This is a mirror of the original BitMEX trollbox archive that used to be online here.
BitMEX disabled their archive after the DDOS attack so I have decided to make my mirror publicly available.

Well now, a few days after I made this mirror available to the public, the original archive from BitMEX is online again.
But since it is still limited (neutered to the last few hundred messages) I will keep my FULL mirror alive.

You have access to more than 50 million trollbox posts. This is more than 7 gigabyte of data hosted on a $5 server so please be patient or consider a donation

<<  >>  English  中文  Русский  한국어  日本語  Español  Français 
[2015-12-03 09:09:50] habibi : http://qz.com/563967/goldman-sachs-wants-to-create-its-own-version-of-bitcoin/
[2015-12-03 09:12:13] jung1 : even monetary policy in bitcoin was designed to avoid any bigger changes after 2021 couse over 90% of coins will be generated http://themisescircle.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/Bitcoin-Inflation.png
[2015-12-03 09:13:32] rapidtrades : I worry that we will see more regulation
[2015-12-03 09:27:42] jung1 : so collect as much coins as possible before regulations
[2015-12-03 09:35:01] messiaen8844 : hello fellas
[2015-12-03 09:41:07] jung1 : hi
[2015-12-03 09:44:16] micmix : I like how hu0bi and okc0in can trade 10k coins without moving the price by even 5 CNY.
[2015-12-03 09:46:02] habibi : once per few days they trade 20k for minute and price dont move :p
[2015-12-03 09:46:14] micmix : when 2k coins traded on finex cause $10 dump
[2015-12-03 09:46:23] habibi : china volumizer is good volumizer
[2015-12-03 09:46:35] habibi : thats what happens when there are 0% fees right :)
[2015-12-03 09:46:36] HotDogs : okcoin has skillz
[2015-12-03 09:46:45] HotDogs : Chop Chop Chop
[2015-12-03 09:46:55] messiaen8844 : it's not a volumizer
[2015-12-03 09:47:10] messiaen8844 : it's a high-volume liquidity provider :) :) :) :)
[2015-12-03 09:47:12] messiaen8844 : lol
[2015-12-03 09:47:12] habibi : micmix: yea 2k coins cause 10$ dump and what is more interesing china follows finex even by half of dump
[2015-12-03 09:47:31] habibi : why would they if they would believe in their own volume
[2015-12-03 09:48:13] micmix : lots of arbitrage bots trade finex-okc
[2015-12-03 09:49:04] habibi : yea after last mini bubble specially
[2015-12-03 09:49:24] habibi : imho hobi has more chinese users than okc
[2015-12-03 09:49:47] micmix : they will move china down after finex dump unless someone is williing to spend lots of money to keep prices up
[2015-12-03 09:50:43] habibi : and thats arbitrage?
[2015-12-03 09:51:34] habibi : i mean bots buy at dump and sell immediately at china?
[2015-12-03 09:56:09] micmix : basically whenever the difference in price is higher than cost of moving money around, they will sell on the exchange with higher price and buy on the exchange with lower price
[2015-12-03 09:56:32] micmix : it gets a bit more complicated but that's the basic idea
[2015-12-03 09:56:49] habibi : micmix: so they have other low money pocket or china's premium is pumped by great monet
[2015-12-03 09:56:50] habibi : money*
[2015-12-03 09:58:26] micmix : there is a cost involved in moving money to/from China so it's not worth it unless the difference is large enough
[2015-12-03 09:58:45] habibi : 20 $ for withdrawing money or sth like that right?
[2015-12-03 09:58:47] habibi : at okc
[2015-12-03 10:00:10] habibi : at 0.30% withdraw fee for golden users
[2015-12-03 10:00:11] micmix : we don't do arbitrage so I'm not sure about exact costs but I would assume $10 difference in price is not worth it
[2015-12-03 10:01:29] micmix : you have to convert CNY to USD and move it out of mainland China or the other way around, costs money
[2015-12-03 10:05:11] habibi : thats the first option
[2015-12-03 10:05:32] habibi : second much better is just to sell on premium and rebuy when exchanges get close price to west
[2015-12-03 10:05:49] habibi : like it was few days ago
[2015-12-03 10:09:06] HotDogs : That's not arbitrage tho
[2015-12-03 10:09:16] HotDogs : that's spread trading, so taking an additional measure of risk
[2015-12-03 10:18:41] micmix : habibi: HotDogs is right, you are at risk bc the price can move in another direction
[2015-12-03 10:21:22] micmix : you can do statistical arbitrage with selling/buying at different exchanges without actually moving money from one exchange to another but you will still have to move money around eventually and it's not free
[2015-12-03 10:26:48] billyboy402 : why is the settlment price still 368 is it lagging
[2015-12-03 10:27:10] rapidtrades : refresh
[2015-12-03 10:28:48] habibi : micmix: yea after a little of thinking about it, its kinda risky even asuming that its frozen money for 1 months till premium is gone, 5$ is about 1.3% premium so would make about good % anually only if it works all time
[2015-12-03 10:29:44] irbbqu : ow
[2015-12-03 10:33:06] rapidtrades : REKT
[2015-12-03 10:34:01] rapidtrades : these $20-$30 swings are getting stupid
[2015-12-03 10:34:03] habibi : 353.9 was on 7d
[2015-12-03 10:34:07] habibi : lucky buyers
[2015-12-03 10:34:51] rapidtrades : that puts my weekly short in th green :)
[2015-12-03 10:37:58] billyboy402 : OMG yiou guys have to fix this fucken bot refresh rate .
[2015-12-03 10:46:36] rapidtrades : all premium gone on the weekly, tempting to close
[2015-12-03 10:47:15] habibi : coz weekly is only 25 hours before settelment
[2015-12-03 10:47:20] habibi : so weekly=daily soon
[2015-12-03 10:47:22] rapidtrades : still looks bearish imo, thoughts trolls?
[2015-12-03 10:47:42] rapidtrades : habibi: thank u captain obvious
[2015-12-03 10:48:10] habibi : lel, u started with obvious things :) i just explained u why.
[2015-12-03 10:48:45] rapidtrades : habibi: not rly, we had premium on the daily until 1 hour go, cos u ppl love to bid things up
[2015-12-03 10:48:59] rapidtrades : no doubt u will bid up the weekly soon
[2015-12-03 10:49:13] habibi : nah, on premium on weekly affects whole week of trading as well
[2015-12-03 10:49:50] rapidtrades : point is the premium is always there until the last minute
[2015-12-03 10:49:59] rapidtrades : so tempting to close while it's not
[2015-12-03 10:50:55] rapidtrades : poll: up or down
[2015-12-03 10:51:08] rapidtrades : down here
[2015-12-03 10:54:40] rapidtrades : if we don't break $350 by Friday I wont rollover my short...looks like range atm
[2015-12-03 10:57:05] habibi : btw micmix look at volume during this dump
[2015-12-03 10:57:07] habibi : on okc
[2015-12-03 10:57:30] habibi : 90k on hobi/120k on okc
[2015-12-03 10:57:40] rapidtrades : i see a SPIKE
[2015-12-03 10:58:42] rapidtrades : this reversal is a bit too strong...
[2015-12-03 10:58:56] rapidtrades : DO NOT LIKE
[2015-12-03 12:04:36] rapidtrades : lol noones trading
[2015-12-03 12:05:47] rapidtrades : so is the go to contract now the weekly?
[2015-12-03 12:06:11] rapidtrades : cos noones' trading the weekly
[2015-12-03 12:06:41] rapidtrades : meant daily
[2015-12-03 12:07:22] sleger : 7 messages in a row from rapidtrades and no answer ahahah
[2015-12-03 12:07:49] rapidtrades : yeah means we're going down and u b1tches are losing $$$$
[2015-12-03 12:08:14] sleger : how big are your positions ?
[2015-12-03 12:08:25] rapidtrades : bigger then ur penis
[2015-12-03 12:09:00] aspa : Not sure how informative that answer is ;)
[2015-12-03 12:09:35] sleger : it says a lot about his IQ
[2015-12-03 12:10:17] rapidtrades : sleger: being a dick all the time says a lot about ur personality
[2015-12-03 12:10:24] rapidtrades : dick
[2015-12-03 12:20:32] messiaen8844 : back to 2330
[2015-12-03 12:21:18] rapidtrades : noone reads chinese dude....how much s tat in real %
[2015-12-03 12:21:21] rapidtrades : $
[2015-12-03 12:23:59] sleger : having math difficulties too, are we ?
[2015-12-03 12:47:58] rapidtrades : Reuters lied about the ECB rate lol....
[2015-12-03 12:49:03] rapidtrades : anyway got $1.40 but only on 12 contracts....noone's trading atm just the bots
[2015-12-03 12:49:14] rapidtrades : can't get shit filled
[2015-12-03 12:50:50] rapidtrades : bbl
[2015-12-03 15:42:13] podizzler3k_ : these bearwhales making me life hell
[2015-12-03 15:45:11] BitMEX_Sam : we'll see, end of week usually sees more movement
[2015-12-03 15:47:23] podizzler3k_ : okcoin futures open contracts is plumetting
[2015-12-03 15:47:30] podizzler3k_ : top holders cashing out
[2015-12-03 15:47:47] podizzler3k_ : the pump and dump is over
[2015-12-03 15:47:47] podizzler3k_ : well not really they still have a ways to go
[2015-12-03 15:48:38] podizzler3k_ : im just hoping they give it a rest for a few days
[2015-12-03 15:52:31] podizzler3k_ : top 3 holders went from 70k contracts down to 35k since the dumping began yesterday
[2015-12-03 15:52:58] podizzler3k_ : so the max dump would be exactly double what has already happened
[2015-12-03 15:52:59] BitMEX_Sam : Were they long or short? Haven't been following
[2015-12-03 15:53:08] podizzler3k_ : it doesnt really say
[2015-12-03 15:53:23] podizzler3k_ : just they had a position and they dont any longer
[2015-12-03 15:53:59] podizzler3k_ : personally i think they were short and they use some kind of bot to push the price down into their buy walls
[2015-12-03 15:54:11] podizzler3k_ : to close their position
[2015-12-03 15:56:09] podizzler3k_ : you can see it in the huobi depth chart. the sell side turns into a lightning bolt that is zapping the price lower. dozens of micro orders moving down in unison
[2015-12-03 16:14:13] irbbqu : Some nice China trollfakeout 130% retrace into sideways down again trollchop
[2015-12-03 19:26:22] zanza : 400 TODAY BOYS
[2015-12-03 19:26:57] habibi : naturlisch
[2015-12-03 19:27:05] habibi : even 4000 in some time zones
[2015-12-03 19:37:27] Swedishnut : off to the moon yet?
[2015-12-03 20:06:00] sleger : habibi: is china a timezone for you ?
[2015-12-03 20:08:15] Swedishnut : anything of interest or thoughts from the audience?
[2015-12-03 20:09:20] habibi : sleger: nope, china is a country for me
[2015-12-03 20:26:38] Swedishnut : lots of resistance both ways
[2015-12-03 20:30:21] User__1 : hi everyone from kazakhstan
[2015-12-03 20:30:46] Swedishnut : hiyas
[2015-12-03 20:32:02] Swedishnut : go go gadget snap back
[2015-12-03 20:32:24] User__1 : bitmex easy!
[2015-12-03 20:32:40] User__1 : i make big money for home
[2015-12-03 20:37:56] sleger : habibi: so why would you say "14:27 - habibi: even 4000 in some time zones"
[2015-12-03 20:38:23] habibi : just ironic anserw to "zanza: 400 TODAY BOYS"
[2015-12-03 20:38:58] Swedishnut : we may see 375 again but it will be a wild ride there if it happens
[2015-12-03 20:56:18] User__1 : 375 = fools gold
[2015-12-03 20:56:59] messiaen8844 : HI BORAT
[2015-12-03 20:59:49] Swedishnut : USer_1 your short to bring the bacon home good to know
[2015-12-03 21:04:35] User__1 : messiaen yes we have heard of borat here he is hero of my country
[2015-12-03 21:04:57] User__1 : as borat say - very nice!
[2015-12-03 21:12:21] messiaen8844 : good WE FRIENDS
[2015-12-03 21:12:28] messiaen8844 : happpyy???
[2015-12-03 21:12:34] messiaen8844 : now gibe moni plos
[2015-12-03 21:15:53] zanza : Swedishnut: did you ever contact bitmex about investment?
[2015-12-03 21:17:36] Swedishnut : I have and currently gathering family decisions over holidays.
[2015-12-03 21:20:57] messiaen8844 : what are the options for investment?
[2015-12-03 21:21:08] zanza : nothing official
[2015-12-03 21:28:20] Swedishnut : so far just a few e-mails sent back and forth. I'm going on vacation very shortly but end of December I'll be doing more communication etc..
[2015-12-03 22:24:00] User__1 : borat love bitcoin
[2015-12-03 22:25:21] sleger : *loveS
[2015-12-03 22:28:40] User__1 : borat *loveS
[2015-12-03 22:30:13] rapidtrades : was smth changed in the code? seems bitmex is clogging up more resourses then usual
[2015-12-03 22:34:36] micmix : volume kinda low today here
[2015-12-03 22:35:28] sleger : rapidtrades: yes I paid 1bitcoin to bitmex so they load an old buggy version when you log in, special for you. If you behave for a month you can have the good one back
[2015-12-03 22:36:11] micmix : and nothing really happens with the price. I blame Swedishnut, yesterday he guaranteed that the price is going to be stable :-)
[2015-12-03 22:37:43] podizzler3k : goin up! until the next dump in 10 minutes
[2015-12-03 22:38:10] podizzler3k : nevermind already dumped
[2015-12-03 22:38:28] podizzler3k : haha 10 minutes of slow pump followed by dump rinse and repeat until price is $0
[2015-12-03 22:38:48] podizzler3k : or the same
[2015-12-03 22:38:50] podizzler3k : whatever
[2015-12-03 22:39:35] micmix : orderbook looks nice with all those 400 asks :-)
[2015-12-03 22:41:22] rapidtrades : buy them up sir
[2015-12-03 22:42:08] rapidtrades : range 358/364 lol
[2015-12-04 00:02:40] podizzler3k : i feel like the next 24 hours are going to determine the trend for a long time to come
[2015-12-04 00:02:50] podizzler3k : anyone else agree?
[2015-12-04 00:05:13] sleger : no, otherwise easiest trade ever, wait 24h then take a long time trend position ...
[2015-12-04 00:05:22] micmix : I will look on okc futures afetr settlement. if top traders will not return with big positions it's a big reason to worry
[2015-12-04 00:05:52] habibi : micmix: there are still big positions at quaterlies
[2015-12-04 00:06:10] micmix : it might be just holiday season though
[2015-12-04 00:07:35] micmix : yeah, people will wait for quarterlies to settle or close their positions when the settlement is close
[2015-12-04 00:08:33] micmix : I was talking about weeklies, I would watch if the capital is moving out
[2015-12-04 00:08:37] sleger : micmix: do you know how they define top traders ? I could not find it
[2015-12-04 00:09:04] habibi : https://www.okcoin.com/future/futureTop.do?type=0&symbol=0
[2015-12-04 00:09:39] micmix : sleger: I'm not sure, I think it's just top positions by contract value
[2015-12-04 00:10:10] habibi : yep, biggest holders
[2015-12-04 00:10:14] sleger : habibi: thanks. So largest position is only 26k, interesting it is not as much as I thought
[2015-12-04 00:11:28] sleger : I must have been in top 10 a few times without knowing...
[2015-12-04 00:11:56] micmix : AFAIK okc margin called 1M+ position a few days ago when BTC dropped below $350. There was steady decrease in positions since then
[2015-12-04 00:12:17] habibi : 1m+? u mean milion $ cny or?
[2015-12-04 00:12:27] sleger : 10k contracts
[2015-12-04 00:12:31] sleger : 1m$
[2015-12-04 00:12:34] micmix : $
[2015-12-04 00:13:34] habibi : micmix: fontas was crying that he got wiped for 80k$ during that dump
[2015-12-04 00:13:38] habibi : at 355
[2015-12-04 00:14:02] micmix : I'm graphing the total $ in okc top, it's very informative
[2015-12-04 00:14:30] habibi : micmix: could u share with that data?
[2015-12-04 00:15:28] micmix : sorry, it's on a private server. you can do it manually using Excel once a day
[2015-12-04 00:15:51] habibi : will try to do ;)
[2015-12-04 00:15:58] micmix : you don't really need it more often to get the big picture of capital inflow/outflow
[2015-12-04 00:17:28] habibi : how many contracts there were at highest point during last bubble?
[2015-12-04 00:17:48] sleger : I would think it is a lagging indicator
[2015-12-04 00:21:34] micmix : 2000k+ contracts at the top
[2015-12-04 00:22:16] habibi : so like 60% more than now right?
[2015-12-04 00:30:17] micmix : that's the most I ever saw, top 10 where holding about 300k-400k
[2015-12-04 00:32:32] micmix : now total is 460k and top 10 are holding a little over 100k
[2015-12-04 00:33:39] habibi : and it was on last bubble right?
[2015-12-04 00:33:48] habibi : mini bubble*
[2015-12-04 00:34:50] micmix : I think the top was after the Nov. bubble
[2015-12-04 00:37:23] habibi : yep thats pretty good information
[2015-12-04 00:37:45] habibi : can put a strong view for our direction @mid term right now
[2015-12-04 00:37:54] habibi : like bleeding and dead cat bounce
[2015-12-04 00:56:01] messiaen8844 : no action
[2015-12-04 00:56:10] micmix : habibi: I'm not sure you can trade just on that info. It's good info to have but like sleger said it's mostly a lagging indicator of volatility. But steady decrease for several weeks would be a bit worrying.
[2015-12-04 00:57:23] habibi : i mean after whole that pump, without big whales with spare money people will just sell imho
[2015-12-04 00:57:42] messiaen8844 : maybe 1 min before settlement on chipper something will hapen ;)
[2015-12-04 01:01:47] micmix : habibi: you never know, maybe they still have money on okc, just waiting to enter position after settlement. like I said, 2-3 weeks don't mean much but pay attention to steady outflow of capital
[2015-12-04 01:07:22] messiaen8844 : weekly candle not looking very good
[2015-12-04 02:42:01] messiaen8844 : finally
[2015-12-04 02:45:45] Swedishnut : action sauce
[2015-12-04 02:46:26] messiaen8844 : H&S action
[2015-12-04 02:48:59] podizzler3k : last week we got saved by the settlement bell remember
[2015-12-04 02:49:08] podizzler3k : well the bullls did
[2015-12-04 02:49:13] podizzler3k : rapidtrades got raped by the bell
[2015-12-04 02:54:46] Swedishnut : this market i pretty odd and depressed. confused is a understatement. imop
[2015-12-04 03:01:30] messiaen8844 : we are testing now some nice uptrend lines
[2015-12-04 03:01:46] messiaen8844 : 340 seems safer region to buy
[2015-12-04 03:04:32] messiaen8844 : lol ,the market disagrees ;)
[2015-12-04 03:05:50] podizzler3k : swedishnut its impossible to trade this
[2015-12-04 03:06:00] podizzler3k : selloff into uptrend is what we have
[2015-12-04 03:06:09] podizzler3k : i just have my 5x long and letting the dust settle
[2015-12-04 03:06:21] podizzler3k : trying to swing trade it would be a nightmare
[2015-12-04 03:06:44] messiaen8844 : market shaking
[2015-12-04 03:07:15] laisee : wheeeee ... volatility++
[2015-12-04 03:26:38] BitMEX_Sam : http://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/b0d8f614-997c-11e5-9228-87e603d47bdc.html#axzz3tJpRRO6T
[2015-12-04 03:26:46] BitMEX_Sam : Interesting article on Goldman's plans
[2015-12-04 03:29:53] podizzler3k : i cant wait to fud the shit out of setlcoin
[2015-12-04 03:30:11] podizzler3k : they have no idea the lengths we can go to to destroy shitcoins credibility
[2015-12-04 03:30:20] podizzler3k : we've been practicing for 3 years for this moment
[2015-12-04 03:31:16] messiaen8844 : good point has been made on reddit a few days ago
[2015-12-04 03:31:25] messiaen8844 : banks are training an army of cryptocurrency developers ;)
[2015-12-04 03:31:33] gaoMex : They need to be careful. Banks can't create currency, so this SETL probably is representative of dollar.
[2015-12-04 03:32:06] laisee : Banks do create currency ... fractionally. And GLD is a bank.
[2015-12-04 03:32:30] laisee : good point on how the coin could be valued, though.
[2015-12-04 03:32:46] gaoMex : I mean banks can't create a different currency like Bitcoin.
[2015-12-04 03:33:38] gaoMex : So in effect, it's just a better system, nothing revolutionary.
[2015-12-04 03:33:47] laisee : I think they can, and have, but issues of credibility and valuation exist.
[2015-12-04 03:34:53] laisee : e.g. what would SETLCoin be worth compared to CitiCoin? Would other banks have to buy these coins to settle with GLD/CITI?
[2015-12-04 03:34:55] micmix : they don't need a currency, they can create tokens representing anything: currency, shares etc., even bitcoin
[2015-12-04 03:35:30] laisee : mic> maybe thats why ETH is of interest to banks now.
[2015-12-04 03:38:18] micmix : they are working on a blockchain settlement layer. it can run on any blockchain with sufficient security and transaction throughput
[2015-12-04 03:39:42] micmix : I think they will try to create their own blockchain/currency to be in control but who knows
[2015-12-04 03:40:46] micmix : I think many banks are working on that and some startups too
[2015-12-04 03:42:06] laisee : overall, seems like a good thing which validates the tech ideas.
[2015-12-04 03:42:55] micmix : the trustless open ledger idea is very powerful
[2015-12-04 03:43:39] micmix : and bitcoin showed that it's possible to make it very secure
[2015-12-04 03:44:26] Swedishnut : priceless as Visa would say
[2015-12-04 03:47:27] micmix : too bad that so much negativity was/is attached to bitcoin that many companies are afraid to touch it now
[2015-12-04 03:50:00] habibi : colored coins is enought for theirs purposes probally
[2015-12-04 03:51:04] habibi : but btc needs to finds a way to increase much much more maximum tps
[2015-12-04 03:51:36] micmix : maybe, it's hard to say how it will turn out. bitcoin has some problems with transaction throughput and mining centralization in China
[2015-12-04 03:52:45] habibi : u cant stop mining centralization
[2015-12-04 03:53:15] micmix : I can envision a future where anyone can issue cryptocurrency and trade it. and everyone will know that 1 micmix coin is worth 10 habibi coins :-)
[2015-12-04 03:53:19] Swedishnut : sure you can if everyone has a cheap fun solo mining wallet that doesn't eat their battery
[2015-12-04 03:53:32] Swedishnut : sorry for asking for a miracle :P
[2015-12-04 03:53:37] habibi : pure bussiness, and no single big farm miner would ever try to play against its own bussiness
[2015-12-04 03:54:45] habibi : i mean why would they try to do 51% or any other atack?
[2015-12-04 03:55:26] habibi : Swedishnut: practical way to do it? many shitcoins tried to go this way, noone of them succed
[2015-12-04 03:55:45] micmix : if banks are going to use some kind of blockchain settlement system, they will run their own mining centers (or outsource mining but keep mining pools under their own control)
[2015-12-04 03:56:13] habibi : micmix: why mining then, pure pos
[2015-12-04 03:56:14] Swedishnut : Fact is folks have found a way we did not see it as the "First" thus btc reigns supreme?
[2015-12-04 03:57:26] micmix : maybe POS, I'm not sure what are the implications for security in case of pure POS. POW systems are proven by now.
[2015-12-04 03:57:38] habibi : mining is not efficient way to keep network alive, in uch bank coin they would simply pos it if it would be open ledger, if not they dont need blockchain tech
[2015-12-04 03:58:16] habibi : Vitali from eth stands for that pos is even more secured but who knows
[2015-12-04 04:01:21] habibi : anyway going sleep, gnight guys and wish u good trades if price will moves! gl
[2015-12-04 04:02:09] habibi : micmix: thanks for info about okc contracts
[2015-12-04 04:02:40] micmix : IMHO the main issue will be to get everyone to agree on one system. every major player will try to push their own. that's what Goldman is trying to do using patents
[2015-12-04 04:02:51] micmix : habibi: good night
[2015-12-04 04:03:39] Swedishnut : night
[2015-12-04 04:04:11] micmix : so bitcoin might win just because major players will not come to the agreement on any alternative :-)
[2015-12-04 04:04:35] Swedishnut : sounds like regular money problems
[2015-12-04 04:05:02] Swedishnut : status quo to stay the same due to players not willing to chang the game
[2015-12-04 04:12:30] podizzler3k : why is my withheld profit more than my realized profit on the contract
[2015-12-04 04:12:32] podizzler3k : confused
[2015-12-04 04:13:32] podizzler3k : feature request: show how withheld profit is broken down between contracts instead of just one sum
[2015-12-04 04:27:20] Swedishnut : silly bots
[2015-12-04 04:31:20] BitMEX_Wally : podizzler3k: Good idea. It's on the API, look at `taxableMargin` on the `position` table
[2015-12-04 04:31:44] BitMEX_Wally : podizzler3k: The difference you are seeing is due to fees
[2015-12-04 04:36:09] micmix : BitMEX_Wally: what are simpleQty, simpleCost and simpleValue in the position table?
[2015-12-04 04:37:03] podizzler3k : fees eh
[2015-12-04 04:37:49] podizzler3k : how long does it take for realized profit to show up in open positions after i complete a trade
[2015-12-04 04:38:28] podizzler3k : fees are killing me
[2015-12-04 04:38:32] podizzler3k : apparently
[2015-12-04 04:39:30] micmix : podizzler3k: realised PNL is updated immediately after each trade
[2015-12-04 04:39:36] podizzler3k : wow
[2015-12-04 04:39:55] podizzler3k : so i buy 3000 contracts at 359.31, sell them at 360.00 and its negative profit after fees
[2015-12-04 04:39:56] podizzler3k : wtf
[2015-12-04 04:40:13] Swedishnut : due to the fact price is moving up?
[2015-12-04 04:41:47] micmix : podizzler3k: I think it should be positive even with 0.075% fees both ways
[2015-12-04 04:42:21] podizzler3k : is comm fees?
[2015-12-04 04:42:48] micmix : yes
[2015-12-04 04:43:29] podizzler3k : probably should be called fees
[2015-12-04 04:45:15] podizzler3k : damn i got hit with .0126 for buying 5000 contracts?
[2015-12-04 04:45:18] podizzler3k : thats pretty rough
[2015-12-04 04:45:33] podizzler3k : i need to go over this fee policy
[2015-12-04 04:47:34] micmix : 5k contracts is 18 coins at 360, so 0.075% is 0.0135. looks right
[2015-12-04 04:49:25] podizzler3k : but if im the 'maker' than i actually get back .025
[2015-12-04 04:49:29] podizzler3k : how do i become the maker
[2015-12-04 04:49:37] podizzler3k : place an order and have it filled?
[2015-12-04 04:49:57] micmix : yep, you have to place the order and wait for it to be filled
[2015-12-04 04:50:01] podizzler3k : thats some policy
[2015-12-04 04:50:21] Swedishnut : it is pretty nice is you know the "price"
[2015-12-04 04:50:33] podizzler3k : what do you mean
[2015-12-04 04:50:46] micmix : it's a very common practice. makers are paid to take the risk that their order will not be filled.
[2015-12-04 04:51:07] Swedishnut : buy as many contracts as you see it fit th price = profit. if you are wrong lose XYZ%
[2015-12-04 04:51:21] podizzler3k : im getting obliterated by being the taker here
[2015-12-04 04:51:29] podizzler3k : paying hundreds in fees
[2015-12-04 04:51:46] micmix : 0.075% is still cheaper than finex or any other place except China
[2015-12-04 04:51:48] podizzler3k : time to join the taker squad
[2015-12-04 04:51:54] Swedishnut : then buy long? and sell a few $ different?
[2015-12-04 04:52:10] podizzler3k : i'll just start placing orders 1 penny below the bid/ask
[2015-12-04 04:52:26] Swedishnut : that may work to create market solvency
[2015-12-04 04:52:27] podizzler3k : my luck someone will move the order down 1 second before i click place
[2015-12-04 04:53:15] podizzler3k : ah fuck it i'll just keep doing what im doing but not bother with small profits
[2015-12-04 04:53:41] podizzler3k : its kind of ridiculous that my PNL says 25% profit but if i close im still negative
[2015-12-04 04:53:46] Swedishnut : if .1 is mall take less
[2015-12-04 04:54:29] laisee : pod> good practice to buy (or sell) and then set your limit sell (or buy) based on profit you want to make. plus a stop/loss.
[2015-12-04 04:54:46] podizzler3k : thanks captain obvious
[2015-12-04 04:54:48] Swedishnut : do not aim for 1. it is less than easy to achieve if your hedge is less than .25
[2015-12-04 04:54:49] podizzler3k : ;)
[2015-12-04 04:55:04] laisee : well, not obvious to all.
[2015-12-04 04:55:29] micmix : podizzler3k: if you are a taker you'll need $1+ movement to make something
[2015-12-04 04:55:39] podizzler3k : micmix this is what im discovering
[2015-12-04 04:55:46] podizzler3k : knowledge is power
[2015-12-04 04:55:57] podizzler3k : you see that green 25% and say 'hey every little bit counts'
[2015-12-04 04:55:58] podizzler3k : wrong
[2015-12-04 04:56:16] podizzler3k : its actually -5% or something
[2015-12-04 04:56:21] podizzler3k : when the fees are added in
[2015-12-04 04:56:44] Swedishnut : do "close market: if you ahead
[2015-12-04 04:56:59] podizzler3k : what is that some kind of loophole?
[2015-12-04 04:57:07] podizzler3k : youre not the taker if you close market?
[2015-12-04 04:57:15] Swedishnut : simply closes all positins to active buys
[2015-12-04 04:57:26] micmix : no, still a taker
[2015-12-04 04:57:32] podizzler3k : then why would i do that
[2015-12-04 04:57:41] podizzler3k : you nut
[2015-12-04 04:57:46] Swedishnut : if you are up and want to profit?
[2015-12-04 04:58:12] podizzler3k : i think we're talking about two different things
[2015-12-04 04:58:28] Swedishnut : maybe but I close often if am up 3-%
[2015-12-04 04:58:32] BitMEX_Wally : podizzler3k: Your unrealised PNL is based on the current mark price. If you close your position there is no guarantee you will be able to trade at that price
[2015-12-04 04:58:33] Swedishnut : err 30%
[2015-12-04 04:58:39] podizzler3k : swedishnut maybe youre a maker
[2015-12-04 04:58:44] podizzler3k : im a taker more often than not
[2015-12-04 04:59:08] Swedishnut : I'm often a maker but I try to take as often as I see
[2015-12-04 04:59:48] podizzler3k : snatchin up orders like gambit
[2015-12-04 05:00:03] podizzler3k : haha swedishnut
[2015-12-04 05:00:03] rapidtrades : SUP LADIES
[2015-12-04 05:00:15] podizzler3k : good policy. should see some strong negative growth with that strategy
[2015-12-04 05:00:54] podizzler3k : rapidtrades wrong channel try #betanormies
[2015-12-04 05:01:14] Swedishnut : simply trying to be the outlier to the growth strat :P might get burned but it is a profitable idea if it plays out
[2015-12-04 05:02:07] podizzler3k : i wonder where the cutoff is if im maker and taker
[2015-12-04 05:02:11] podizzler3k : probably around 15% i guess
[2015-12-04 05:02:30] rapidtrades : 15% of what
[2015-12-04 05:02:47] podizzler3k : just icing my butt after realizing how much fees ive been paying
[2015-12-04 05:02:59] rapidtrades : no it's cool
[2015-12-04 05:03:11] podizzler3k : i just now realized that if you are the taker twice than you need to be over 30% profit to make any money
[2015-12-04 05:03:12] rapidtrades : keep paying, don't want to miss those moves
[2015-12-04 05:03:20] laisee : sometimes you really lose when you win ... ;-)
[2015-12-04 05:03:44] podizzler3k : rapidtrades no fomo yolo 25/8
[2015-12-04 05:03:54] BitMEX_Wally : podizzler3k: Take fee is 0.075% so you only need 0.15% to break even. With 100x leverage that's 15%
[2015-12-04 05:04:19] podizzler3k : if youre taker both times?
[2015-12-04 05:04:20] rapidtrades : yeah it's only 15% if u risk it all on 100/1
[2015-12-04 05:04:41] BitMEX_Wally : 0.075% + 0.075% = 0.15%
[2015-12-04 05:05:08] rapidtrades : taker fee is approximately 24 cents at these prices @podizzler3k
[2015-12-04 05:05:16] podizzler3k : i guess what happened was i bought 5000 and sold 2500 so the fees from the buy kept me negative
[2015-12-04 05:05:23] podizzler3k : rapidtrades im not really interested in the cents
[2015-12-04 05:05:27] podizzler3k : more about the % to break even
[2015-12-04 05:05:43] rapidtrades : ....well it's 48 cents then
[2015-12-04 05:06:30] podizzler3k : ok so if im the taker twice than i can just subtract 15% from PNL and that would be my PNL after fees
[2015-12-04 05:06:31] BitMEX_Wally : But the % number you are looking at is ROE, which is based on your unrealised PNL at the mark price divided by the margin
[2015-12-04 05:06:47] BitMEX_Wally : You would be better to look at the entry price and add/remove 24 cents as needed
[2015-12-04 05:06:49] podizzler3k : uhh
[2015-12-04 05:07:00] rapidtrades : exctly
[2015-12-04 05:07:05] laisee : Wally> can we have a 'daytrader' % fee of 0, as long as BTC committed to each trade and only for 24H?
[2015-12-04 05:07:22] rapidtrades : can we trade4free plz
[2015-12-04 05:07:26] laisee : ^1 BTC
[2015-12-04 05:07:31] Swedishnut : value of fiat is printed daily what is the current cost of minting? That is the cost of fiat current
[2015-12-04 05:08:26] podizzler3k : im not into calculating fees before each trade so i'll just keep a conscious mind that if im the taker not to bother with small profits
[2015-12-04 05:08:28] laisee : It would be special fee for traders who can't do math right.
[2015-12-04 05:08:31] podizzler3k : that should work for me
[2015-12-04 05:08:47] Swedishnut : what is small profit?
[2015-12-04 05:09:01] Swedishnut : 1 tc?
[2015-12-04 05:09:03] podizzler3k : under 30% PNL
[2015-12-04 05:09:10] Swedishnut : ahh kk
[2015-12-04 05:09:16] podizzler3k : or under 20% rather
[2015-12-04 05:09:22] podizzler3k : 25 we'll say heh
[2015-12-04 05:09:48] Swedishnut : I don't pull before 33% I might be odd
[2015-12-04 05:10:02] podizzler3k : nah i think thats smart
[2015-12-04 05:10:15] podizzler3k : unless youre bored and trying to stack bitcents
[2015-12-04 05:10:25] podizzler3k : which is what i was doing when i realized i was losing
[2015-12-04 05:10:39] rapidtrades : how long did that take u
[2015-12-04 05:10:52] podizzler3k : one trade
[2015-12-04 05:11:23] podizzler3k : but i probably could have been maker on a lot of previous trades and saved some loot
[2015-12-04 05:11:37] rapidtrades : depends on the way u trade
[2015-12-04 05:12:02] rapidtrades : liquidity is not the greatest here, I rarely get 50% of my orders filled
[2015-12-04 05:13:04] rapidtrades : and by that I mean say I want to go short....50% of the time I wont get a fill despite ''fighting'' with the bots
[2015-12-04 05:13:42] podizzler3k : sometimes when a liquidation order shows up it pays to be the taker thats for sure
[2015-12-04 05:13:45] Swedishnut : yeah fight with humans works much better
[2015-12-04 05:14:04] laisee : true, dat.
[2015-12-04 05:14:08] podizzler3k : rapidtrades yeah the new fee policy probably makes being the maker very frustrating
[2015-12-04 05:14:30] podizzler3k : #takerboyz
[2015-12-04 05:14:37] Swedishnut : yeah maker must swap pricing very often
[2015-12-04 05:14:43] rapidtrades : podizzler3k: I think competition is harder but it's diffcult to tell with the current volatility
[2015-12-04 05:14:53] podizzler3k : time to get that makerbot crackin
[2015-12-04 05:14:57] rapidtrades : it throws market makers off
[2015-12-04 05:15:06] podizzler3k : /learn2bot
[2015-12-04 05:15:14] laisee : thin market woth big moves generated by external mkts ... need to be nimble as MM here
[2015-12-04 05:15:25] Swedishnut : bots are hard to control without minds'
[2015-12-04 05:15:41] rapidtrades : #freethebots
[2015-12-04 05:15:43] laisee : same as humanz
[2015-12-04 05:15:49] rapidtrades : #botsRppl2
[2015-12-04 05:15:53] Swedishnut : indeed humanz are fallible
[2015-12-04 05:16:08] rapidtrades : #livingwage4bots
[2015-12-04 05:16:20] rapidtrades : #24cNOTenuff
[2015-12-04 05:16:46] podizzler3k : haha
[2015-12-04 05:17:42] podizzler3k : speaking of #takerboyz why isnt there a market open?
[2015-12-04 05:17:44] podizzler3k : only market close
[2015-12-04 05:22:04] rapidtrades : okc settlement in 3 hrs?
[2015-12-04 05:25:39] podizzler3k : yep
[2015-12-04 05:26:01] podizzler3k : remember last week huge pump before bitmex weekly settlement
[2015-12-04 05:26:06] podizzler3k : will i do it again? wait and see
[2015-12-04 05:28:41] rapidtrades : yeah last week we pumped post okc
[2015-12-04 05:32:55] Swedishnut : 375?
[2015-12-04 05:39:33] rapidtrades : no they'll dump this time sorries
[2015-12-04 05:39:46] Swedishnut : sigh guess people would rather the price be 300
[2015-12-04 05:40:41] rapidtrades : Goldman called for 3% lower Euro yesterday
[2015-12-04 05:40:54] rapidtrades : .....Euro is 3% higher today
[2015-12-04 05:41:20] Swedishnut : eoro is ppo
[2015-12-04 05:43:58] Swedishnut : euro is poo
[2015-12-04 05:46:06] rapidtrades : poo indeed
[2015-12-04 05:47:19] Swedishnut : yup wish it would steep up
[2015-12-04 05:52:43] Swedishnut : ;Coinbase is slow
[2015-12-04 05:53:06] Swedishnut : 5 btc and 3 days no deposit...
[2015-12-04 05:53:26] rapidtrades : woah
[2015-12-04 05:53:41] Swedishnut : yup screw tha..
[2015-12-04 05:53:54] rapidtrades : WOAH
[2015-12-04 05:55:09] Swedishnut : tired of waiting for "profit: people already made the positions.... now to try and find new ones,,, sigh
[2015-12-04 05:55:29] Swedishnut : Shorting looks best atm
[2015-12-04 05:56:29] podizzler3k : no way
[2015-12-04 05:56:43] podizzler3k : all the people with settled okcoin contracts gonna go long again you know its true
[2015-12-04 05:56:48] Swedishnut : why 350 easy right?
[2015-12-04 05:58:34] Swedishnut : 341 will burn me
[2015-12-04 05:58:48] Swedishnut : well 331 now
[2015-12-04 06:12:19] TschavaTschigger : morning guys (and girls possibly)
[2015-12-04 06:19:07] laisee : top of the morning to you.
[2015-12-04 06:28:39] rapidtrades : (and girls possibly) NOPE
[2015-12-04 06:28:54] rapidtrades : we have a gay though, if that would work for u
[2015-12-04 06:31:35] micmix : I'm not sure about no girls, my wife has accounts on finex and coinbase. We must have some girls trading here but maybe not in trollbox.
[2015-12-04 06:32:06] laisee : >>> probably something they don't advertise.
[2015-12-04 06:32:33] laisee : given some behavior here & elsewhere ...
[2015-12-04 06:32:50] micmix : yeah, I think you are right laisee
[2015-12-04 06:35:48] rapidtrades : what behavior?
[2015-12-04 06:36:59] rapidtrades : Wel welcome all women here*
[2015-12-04 06:37:11] rapidtrades : * as long as they put out
[2015-12-04 06:40:59] laisee : q.e.d.
[2015-12-04 06:43:57] SnackyCoins : http://i.imgur.com/IxXG6fo.jpg
[2015-12-04 06:47:45] rapidtrades : holy shit
[2015-12-04 06:48:54] rapidtrades : was that a liq?
[2015-12-04 06:49:51] stevelim : what was that?
[2015-12-04 06:50:33] rapidtrades : we're at discount
[2015-12-04 06:52:04] rapidtrades : get em while they're cheap boys
[2015-12-04 06:54:35] stevelim : just bought daily and sold weekly. free money
[2015-12-04 06:55:04] rapidtrades : great minds think alike :)
[2015-12-04 06:59:50] micmix : weekly settles on 2H index and daily on 30m, there will be some difference in settlement price but probably not too large
[2015-12-04 07:00:11] rapidtrades : ah tnx for pointing that out
[2015-12-04 07:00:51] rapidtrades : I wanna be net short anyway so hoping to cut the daily soon
[2015-12-04 07:12:41] laisee : futures < cash ... do we have a functioning futures market now whioch reflects sentiment? ;-)
[2015-12-04 07:14:49] rapidtrades : it would be unusual to drop so soon to okc settlement
[2015-12-04 07:14:56] rapidtrades : but stranger things have happened
[2015-12-04 07:15:02] micmix : laisee: we had okc futures for a while now and they reflect the sentiment quite well. the problem is that the sentiment is wrong quite often as you can see by huge margin calls on futures :-)
[2015-12-04 07:15:11] rapidtrades : hehe
[2015-12-04 07:15:27] laisee : sentiment !+ truth ... ///
[2015-12-04 07:16:27] laisee : ... and China market is super easy to trade on little to no info
[2015-12-04 07:16:57] TschavaTschigger : laisee: perfect for rapid then
[2015-12-04 07:17:23] laisee : yeah, not sure why he wastes time here with us nooobs.
[2015-12-04 07:18:30] micmix : The sentiment here changes multiple times per day as I see base on our MM bot position.
[2015-12-04 07:18:41] rapidtrades : oh rly
[2015-12-04 07:18:44] micmix : * based
[2015-12-04 07:18:49] rapidtrades : ur bot can reads sentiments
[2015-12-04 07:19:30] rapidtrades : how cans it
[2015-12-04 07:19:31] micmix : well of course, it accumulates long position when most ppl are selling into its bids
[2015-12-04 07:19:33] podizzler3k : its sentient
[2015-12-04 07:19:41] rapidtrades : ah i see
[2015-12-04 07:19:59] micmix : if it goes way over to one side the sentiment is strong
[2015-12-04 07:20:18] rapidtrades : so it basically watches finex and moves its bids/offers or
[2015-12-04 07:20:29] rapidtrades : how do u prevent it from getting raped
[2015-12-04 07:20:41] micmix : magic :-)
[2015-12-04 07:20:49] rapidtrades : u watch finex i know
[2015-12-04 07:20:55] rapidtrades : I KNOW
[2015-12-04 07:21:11] micmix : well it uses index among other things of course
[2015-12-04 07:21:34] TschavaTschigger : I am waiting for sam/wally to implement a leaderboard so we can dick-size compare our bots
[2015-12-04 07:21:55] podizzler3k : my bot is all dick
[2015-12-04 07:21:59] rapidtrades : how do u know if the current premium/discount is fair? @micmix
[2015-12-04 07:22:17] rapidtrades : like now...why aren't bots straddling around 357
[2015-12-04 07:22:51] laisee : becos ... sentiment
[2015-12-04 07:23:13] micmix : I don't really need to know, if ppl sell into bids the bids are lowered
[2015-12-04 07:23:32] rapidtrades : ah
[2015-12-04 07:23:36] rapidtrades : AH HA
[2015-12-04 07:24:15] podizzler3k : get ready for a surprise
[2015-12-04 07:24:38] rapidtrades : podizzler3k: I don't need surprises right now, im mostly hedged
[2015-12-04 07:24:43] laisee : floopy is a billionaire?
[2015-12-04 07:26:00] podizzler3k : i just had that scene from total recall in my head
[2015-12-04 07:27:37] rapidtrades : hey is okc settlement in 1 or 2 hrs? not logged in atm
[2015-12-04 07:28:35] podizzler3k : http://getjumbucks.com/settlement/
[2015-12-04 07:28:38] podizzler3k : 30 minutes
[2015-12-04 07:28:47] rapidtrades : tnx
[2015-12-04 07:31:17] rapidtrades : finally
[2015-12-04 07:33:35] podizzler3k : surpriiiise
[2015-12-04 07:34:07] podizzler3k : tfw futures holders have no more contracts to dump
[2015-12-04 07:34:15] rapidtrades : good
[2015-12-04 07:36:08] laisee : now they are buying again, since 0 left to sell.
[2015-12-04 07:37:06] rapidtrades : rally now dump post settleemnt
[2015-12-04 07:37:16] rapidtrades : i have spoken
[2015-12-04 07:38:47] micmix : I don't mind as long as we have at least some movement