BitMEX Trollbox Userinfo

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This is a mirror of the original BitMEX trollbox archive that used to be online here.
BitMEX disabled their archive after the DDOS attack so I have decided to make my mirror publicly available.


Well now, a few days after I made this mirror available to the public, the original archive from BitMEX is online again.
But since it is still limited (neutered to the last few hundred messages) I will keep my FULL mirror alive.

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[2016-06-13 17:55:07] BTCDJS : elmorte: how much extra? enough to pay the bills?
[2016-06-13 17:55:25] elmorte : Yeah, and take the lady out for steak
[2016-06-13 17:56:14] BTCDJS : elmorte: what? How did you come across this way of trading?
[2016-06-13 17:56:50] elmorte : It's not really trading, it's more of a hedge
[2016-06-13 17:57:10] elmorte : You go long on spot and short on derivative
[2016-06-13 17:57:33] BitMEX_Sam : It's very simple and very profitable right now , we expect the premium to evaporate once traders realize
[2016-06-13 17:57:38] BTCDJS : elmorte: damn. Does it work everytime?
[2016-06-13 17:57:39] elmorte : The funding here was just a bonus
[2016-06-13 17:57:57] elmorte : Only if the funding rate is worth the risk
[2016-06-13 17:58:08] BTCDJS : in a bull market?
[2016-06-13 17:58:18] elmorte : After I did that, I realized what Arthur was talking about here: https://blog.bitmex.com/earning-interest-income-on-xbtusd-with-minimised-risk/
[2016-06-13 17:58:36] BitMEX_Sam : In any market, this will work
[2016-06-13 17:58:45] BitMEX_Sam : The idea is to get your position delta to 0 which is simple to do with an inverse derivative
[2016-06-13 17:59:00] BitMEX_Sam : Then no matter which way the price goes, so long as you have enough backing margin, you will make money from funding
[2016-06-13 17:59:03] elmorte : BTCDJS: I didn't know how much of a bull market it would be
[2016-06-13 17:59:28] j8 : yeah, i made 2.3594% interest yesterday.. not bad
[2016-06-13 17:59:31] elmorte : And I thought funding was pro-rated :)
[2016-06-13 17:59:45] BTCDJS : BitMEX_Sam: interesting. Im going to look into it
[2016-06-13 18:00:04] BitMEX_Sam : The real issue is getting enough fiat moved around quickly to take advantage of it
[2016-06-13 18:00:18] BitMEX_Sam : In Nov 2013 if you were, say, selling swaps on BFX you could make as much as 1% a day
[2016-06-13 18:00:33] BitMEX_Sam : Today, you can make 2+% off of our contract - even better!
[2016-06-13 18:00:54] elmorte : Yeah, I just happened to have USD10k on finex...I was asking ppl here what to do with it
[2016-06-13 18:02:04] BTCDJS : Well blow me down. You learn something new everyday. Good talk
[2016-06-13 18:02:04] Yumi : BitMEX_Sam: all great until you get DPE
[2016-06-13 18:02:34] Yumi : its great opportunity but there is risk and it should be clearly stated
[2016-06-13 18:02:57] BitMEX_Sam : Agreed, that is true
[2016-06-13 18:03:09] BitMEX_Sam : Although if more users were doing it, that would push the premium down and thus make it easier for liquidations to fill
[2016-06-13 18:03:10] j8 : yeah, all of arthur's promos talk about getting the interest without the counterparty risk.. that's really dishonest, the default risk is way higher
[2016-06-13 18:03:30] BitMEX_Sam : It's not intentionally dishonest, although I understand your sentiment j8
[2016-06-13 18:03:37] BitMEX_Sam : Until this weekend it had been a long time since DPE
[2016-06-13 18:04:11] tscha : BitMEX_Sam: I don't think the premium will vanish during a bull run. Your assumption is based on a non-directional market. The question is not "where can I make money" but "where can I make most money"
[2016-06-13 18:04:15] Yumi : yes but it can take one bad day and you lose everything you made and more
[2016-06-13 18:04:19] j8 : to someone who understands the product it just comes of as being salesman.. of a financial product in beta
[2016-06-13 18:04:28] BTCDJS : So Im having a problem. I just can't seem to go Long ATM. I set an order lower it gets rejected. I set an order slightly higher and I get insta LIQ notification. Is the best I can do, Pray theres a little dump so I can get in? @BitMEX_Sam
[2016-06-13 18:05:08] BitMEX_Sam : BTCDJS: Lower your leverage
[2016-06-13 18:05:13] elmorte : BTCDJS: I'm not Sam but either reduce the contract qty or add more coins to your wallet
[2016-06-13 18:05:48] BitMEX_Sam : Also, if you still have the Limit Order confirmation dialog enabled, you can see an estimated liquidation price
[2016-06-13 18:06:31] BTCDJS : BitMEX_Sam: how do I enable that?
[2016-06-13 18:06:43] BitMEX_Sam : BTCDJS: https://www.bitmex.com/app/preferences
[2016-06-13 18:11:50] BTCDJS : BitMEX_Sam: Order gets filled by the mark price right?
[2016-06-13 18:12:08] BitMEX_Sam : An order gets filled by the resting orders in the orderbook
[2016-06-13 18:12:31] BTCDJS : Ok and the chart follows those figures too?
[2016-06-13 18:13:57] BitMEX_Sam : Yes
[2016-06-13 18:13:57] BTCDJS : So Right now prices are at 705. And I want to buy in at 695. But that is more than mark price. So I can't get in.
[2016-06-13 18:14:05] BitMEX_Sam : The candles are actual trades, the purple line is the index
[2016-06-13 18:14:07] elmorte : If it was by the mark price, I would've liquidated myself :)
[2016-06-13 18:14:23] BitMEX_Sam : If you want to buy in at 695 you can certainly place a resting limit order
[2016-06-13 18:14:32] BitMEX_Sam : But nobody is willing to sell at 695 at the moment.
[2016-06-13 18:14:58] rentchev : premium is big at the moment
[2016-06-13 18:15:13] rentchev : I think it's a good opportunity to make money on that
[2016-06-13 18:15:17] elmorte : 11....if it goes below 10, something's wrong
[2016-06-13 18:15:26] rentchev : people still expect more upside, but might not happen short term
[2016-06-13 18:15:34] BTCDJS : BitMEX_Sam: ok so Im on the wrong train of thought then. A previous order got rejected. Can you look into it and tell me why please
[2016-06-13 18:16:08] BitMEX_Sam : Did you do a market order @BTCDJS?
[2016-06-13 18:16:57] BTCDJS : BitMEX_Sam: no limit order 1500 contracts 694.31. It was resting. and a few moments later it was gone. history says rejected
[2016-06-13 18:17:31] BTCDJS : BitMEX_Sam: i assumed because of immediate liquidation or something
[2016-06-13 18:17:47] BitMEX_Sam : Your history should show the full rejection reason
[2016-06-13 18:18:01] BitMEX_Sam : See also https://www.bitmex.com/app/tradeHistory
[2016-06-13 18:20:33] BitMEX_Wally : BTCDJS: That order was not resting, it was rejected at submission
[2016-06-13 18:20:47] BitMEX_Wally : `Rejected: Executing at order price would lead to immediate liquidation Submission from www.bitmex.com`
[2016-06-13 18:21:40] elmorte : `Rejected: Too fugly Submission from www.bitmex.com`
[2016-06-13 18:21:59] elmorte : Damnit guys....
[2016-06-13 18:23:03] BTCDJS : BitMEX_Wally: Maybe I just had a glitch in the matrix moment. Thought I set an order. but when I looked again it was gone.
[2016-06-13 18:25:47] elmorte : BitMEX_Sam: Um...changing the leverage in the Confirm Order screen changes the whole leverage even if I cancelled the order.
[2016-06-13 18:26:07] elmorte : Like, didn't submit it...was just playing around to see the liqn price
[2016-06-13 18:26:59] BitMEX_Wally : The leverage setting applies to open orders and open positions
[2016-06-13 18:27:08] BitMEX_Wally : and new open orders
[2016-06-13 18:27:17] BTCDJS : elmorte: didn't your mother teach you not to touch anything or play with buttons
[2016-06-13 18:27:28] elmorte : Yeah, but I clicked cancel...it should revert to previous setting then
[2016-06-13 18:27:40] elmorte : BTCDJS: I know I know but testnet is boring
[2016-06-13 18:27:50] BTCDJS : elmorte: now you're just being childish
[2016-06-13 18:28:17] elmorte : BTCDJS: joke's on you! I was childish the whole time!
[2016-06-13 18:28:38] BTCDJS : elmorte: Im going to tell your your wife if you don't pack it in!
[2016-06-13 18:28:51] BTCDJS : she will sort you out
[2016-06-13 18:29:24] elmorte : :(
[2016-06-13 18:30:10] elmorte : Thanks @BTCDJS , time to hit the sack
[2016-06-13 18:30:51] elmorte : Gnite fellas, be good, do everything opposite of what I did today and you'll be just fine
[2016-06-13 18:31:10] rentchev : see ya @elmorte
[2016-06-13 18:31:29] elmorte : :)
[2016-06-13 18:31:47] BTCDJS : elmorte: bye
[2016-06-13 18:35:27] rentchev : BitMEX_Wally: I think your exchange is by far the best one. And the rate at which issues get fixed and changes are implemented is amazing. Also support is very good. Please pass this to the whole BitMEX team.
[2016-06-13 18:35:54] BTCDJS : rentchev: suck up
[2016-06-13 18:35:55] Blargwaffle : Bitmex is great, DPE's kind of annoying though.
[2016-06-13 18:36:08] rentchev : lol BTCDJS
[2016-06-13 18:36:10] rentchev : I mean it
[2016-06-13 18:36:23] Blargwaffle : I'd probably be with cryptofacilities if I wasn't concerned about id theft.
[2016-06-13 18:36:31] rentchev : Blargwaffle: is there anything better out there?
[2016-06-13 18:36:48] Blargwaffle : I don't know if they're "better", just no DPE.
[2016-06-13 18:36:53] tscha : I actually think that changes are implemented way too fast here. On Live products there should be at least 1 week notice.
[2016-06-13 18:37:02] Blargwaffle : Or Socialized Loss in general.
[2016-06-13 18:37:17] BTCDJS : tscha: +1
[2016-06-13 18:37:18] rentchev : This is only my opinion guys
[2016-06-13 18:37:44] tscha : I wasn't affected, but I understand the people complaining about fast changes, it looks very unprofessional to do overnight changes without prior notice.
[2016-06-13 18:37:52] j8 : definitely
[2016-06-13 18:38:02] j8 : it's not the way to do things
[2016-06-13 18:38:08] BTCDJS : ++1 @tscha
[2016-06-13 18:38:20] BTCDJS : j8: +++++++11111
[2016-06-13 18:38:29] rentchev : keep in mind that we are the first to use this and the exchange is still yang
[2016-06-13 18:38:39] rentchev : it will take time for the software to mature
[2016-06-13 18:38:51] j8 : it's really becoming a pattern for bitmex too. they scrapped futures and added the swap in less than 24 hours
[2016-06-13 18:38:52] rentchev : I don't mind being part of this
[2016-06-13 18:39:00] tscha : just 1 week notice on any live changes is enough, not a hard thing to do either
[2016-06-13 18:39:19] rentchev : it's good feedback for them
[2016-06-13 18:39:32] rentchev : you can guys send emails to support
[2016-06-13 18:39:39] BitMEX_Sam : You're absolutely right tscha
[2016-06-13 18:39:48] BitMEX_Sam : We had a discussion about this yesterday and we are going to be much more conservative with the timeframes in the future
[2016-06-13 18:41:28] tscha : BitMEX_Sam: But that's what you said last time too, when there was a sudden API change that broke micmix' bot... like 1-2 months ago... I remember that you specifically said that you will be more conservative with changes on live products back then
[2016-06-13 18:41:33] BitMEX_Sam : We were very motivated to get the new funding rate in ASAP to clear that enormous liquidation and prevent massive DPE, which was successful, but in order to do so we caused some consternation which we regret
[2016-06-13 18:42:06] j8 : it's pretty clear that the issues with the swap were the result of moving too fast in the first place
[2016-06-13 18:42:14] BitMEX_Sam : That was a different type of thing, that was API return types (which we are very conservative about now), but I understand where you're coming from
[2016-06-13 18:43:06] BitMEX_Sam : Unfortunately the current issues we're having with premium did not and could not have shown up in test, it requires FOMO from real users
[2016-06-13 18:43:13] j8 : a lot of concerns were voiced about price marking, DPE risk, etc before the swap was even introduced. these weren't addressed at all
[2016-06-13 18:43:50] BitMEX_Sam : We believed the market would behave more rationally and that the funding rates as-is would be enough to anchor the product. That assumption was incorrect as is clear to see
[2016-06-13 18:43:50] BTCVIX : j8: this
[2016-06-13 18:44:06] BTCVIX : BitMEX_Sam: this is bitcoin -- how can you assume rationality
[2016-06-13 18:44:07] BTCVIX : lol
[2016-06-13 18:44:10] Blargwaffle : Bitcoin doesn't rational.
[2016-06-13 18:44:15] j8 : yeah, that's an awful assumption
[2016-06-13 18:44:34] BitMEX_Sam : Profits motivate people - I'm sure everyone can agree on that
[2016-06-13 18:44:57] BitMEX_Sam : Our incorrect assumption was that easy money by hedging spot & earning funding rates would be more of a motivator than FOMO
[2016-06-13 18:45:03] j8 : we already have examples in the bitcoin market where high leverage skews rates. see okc futures
[2016-06-13 18:45:05] BitMEX_Sam : Clearly, that's not the case, although the funding helps
[2016-06-13 18:45:09] BTCVIX : best course of action would have been to just settle the product and then make the changes and reopen -- you would have some blow back by taking people out of positions but they wouldn't be waking up to a new product with a bunch of changes and still in open positions
[2016-06-13 18:45:29] BTCVIX : BitMEX_Sam: nobody arbs lol
[2016-06-13 18:45:40] BTCVIX : that is one these beliefs mex still holds onto
[2016-06-13 18:47:27] j8 : i originally decided i wasn't gonna arb it, because the contract didn't make sense and the dpe risk was extreme. i ended up getting involved because it was too damn profitable. so far it's worked out but it's playing with fire
[2016-06-13 18:48:32] j8 : 32% clawback over two days kills arbitrage. i was just lucky to have losses on the swap
[2016-06-13 18:49:13] tscha : j8: well, imagine the other side. huge DPE risk and STILL buying at $15 premium :)
[2016-06-13 18:49:36] j8 : yeah, well i don't understand why anyone would do that, but they are
[2016-06-13 18:49:40] tscha : I will never understand that, buy yes, Bitcoin is irrational
[2016-06-13 18:50:05] j8 : just BUY JUNE PEOPLE. sorry for caps
[2016-06-13 18:50:22] rentchev : why j8?
[2016-06-13 18:50:36] rentchev : I am thinking of shoring June
[2016-06-13 18:50:40] j8 : it's turning out to be a way cheaper long
[2016-06-13 18:50:49] j8 : though the swap rate is variable
[2016-06-13 18:50:55] rentchev : I see
[2016-06-13 18:51:06] tscha : Bitmex should hire BTCVIX to learn from the point of view of the irrational maniac buttcoin trading site... arthur's oldschool finance knowledge does not apply :)
[2016-06-13 18:51:08] j8 : and it's quanto and volatility is high so it's already underpriced
[2016-06-13 18:51:40] BTCVIX : tscha: yeah I am just well versed in degen gambling -- he can keep all the high finance excel spreadsheets
[2016-06-13 18:52:10] tscha : BTCVIX: :)
[2016-06-13 18:53:27] j8 : rentchev: consider that on the swap longs are paying 1-2% per day. the premium on june is only 3% for 11 days
[2016-06-13 18:54:51] rentchev : j8: I was looking at shorting swap, so for me it makes sense
[2016-06-13 18:55:09] rentchev : for longs doesn't
[2016-06-13 18:55:17] rentchev : based on your explenation
[2016-06-13 18:55:19] j8 : yep
[2016-06-13 18:55:34] j8 : but it does mean betting on rates staying high
[2016-06-13 18:55:46] rapidtrades : longs still leaving that dream i see
[2016-06-13 18:55:55] rapidtrades : living
[2016-06-13 18:56:05] j8 : this could crash and you end up paying interest on the swap and losing the premium on june
[2016-06-13 19:01:14] lockhedge : BTCVIX: best course of action would have been to just settle the product. just close all longs that were bought at a premium at the spot price? seriously? how would your reddit post sound if they followed your advice?
[2016-06-13 19:02:07] BTCVIX : I said to close all positions
[2016-06-13 19:02:14] BTCVIX : as in induce settlement
[2016-06-13 19:02:25] BTCVIX : everyone just realizes P&L and then they can make the changes
[2016-06-13 19:02:30] BitMEX_Sam : Which would produce instant losses for longs
[2016-06-13 19:03:12] BTCVIX : how does settlement result in a loss for longs
[2016-06-13 19:03:15] j8 : 2 weeks notice for settlement would have satisfied most people
[2016-06-13 19:03:26] BitMEX_Sam : Because the current spot price is $10 under the last price
[2016-06-13 19:03:39] BTCVIX : well that an issue with how you do settlement
[2016-06-13 19:03:52] BTCVIX : OKC doesn't use spot price or index for settlement and they do just fine
[2016-06-13 19:04:03] j8 : settling at a $10 premium would be pretty unfair to shorts
[2016-06-13 19:04:08] BitMEX_Sam : ????
[2016-06-13 19:04:09] BTCVIX : you guys do it at daily rebalancing don't you ?
[2016-06-13 19:04:19] BitMEX_Sam : I don't think you understand what settlement is
[2016-06-13 19:04:38] BitMEX_Sam : Of course OKC settles at spot
[2016-06-13 19:05:06] aethlios : BTCVIX: it uses index
[2016-06-13 19:05:18] lockhedge : BTCVIX: never traded okc futures?
[2016-06-13 19:05:45] BTCVIX : lockhedge: OKC doesn't settle against index
[2016-06-13 19:06:17] BTCVIX : The system takes the last completed transaction price as the settlement price.
[2016-06-13 19:06:27] BitMEX_Sam : It certainly does not
[2016-06-13 19:06:27] BTCVIX : right from OKC FAQs
[2016-06-13 19:06:28] aethlios : BTCVIX: okcoin futures settle against index, now index 696, weekly spot 701.5
[2016-06-13 19:07:26] BTCVIX : do I have to get the screen shot from OKC FAQs as well or does my copy and paste not qualify ?
[2016-06-13 19:07:37] BTCVIX : OKC doesn't use index to settle their futures product
[2016-06-13 19:07:42] BitMEX_Sam : Lol...
[2016-06-13 19:07:43] j8 : BTCVIX: what okc calls settlement, bitmex calls rebalance
[2016-06-13 19:07:47] rapidtrades : next rate after this should be closer to 1.1%? @BitMEX_Sam
[2016-06-13 19:07:55] j8 : what okc calls delivery, bitmex calls settlement
[2016-06-13 19:08:11] BTCVIX : OKC does rebalancing as well though
[2016-06-13 19:08:20] rapidtrades : k
[2016-06-13 19:08:21] BTCVIX : and they use the same criteria
[2016-06-13 19:08:24] BitMEX_Sam : Which they very confusingly call settlement which is not the correct term
[2016-06-13 19:08:59] rapidtrades : BitMEX_Sam: ? 1.1% yes? give me that link
[2016-06-13 19:09:05] aethlios : At the time of delivery, the system will execute to close the positions on all opened weekly futures. The price will be the arithmetic mean value of the index of the preceding one hour before delivery.
[2016-06-13 19:09:16] BitMEX_Sam : rapidtrades: Go to Contracts -> .XBTUSDPI
[2016-06-13 19:09:23] rapidtrades : :(
[2016-06-13 19:09:24] j8 : normally bitmex futures would rebalance weekly at the future price. now, the swap rebalances at the spot price. that's different
[2016-06-13 19:09:28] rapidtrades : i cant bookmark that
[2016-06-13 19:09:35] BitMEX_Sam : You can go to it, then bookmark it
[2016-06-13 19:09:45] rapidtrades : k
[2016-06-13 19:10:46] rapidtrades : nothing here mate
[2016-06-13 19:11:05] rapidtrades : https://www.bitmex.com/app/contract/.XBTUSDPI
[2016-06-13 19:11:06] Yumi : rapidtrades:
[2016-06-13 19:11:10] BitMEX_Sam : https://www.bitmex.com/app/index/.XBTUSDPI
[2016-06-13 19:11:13] BitMEX_Sam : yes
[2016-06-13 19:11:14] Yumi : [2016-06-13 17:19:59] BitMEX_Wally : Yumi: The maintenance margin for XBTUSD is currently 0.50% plus 0.7787%
[2016-06-13 19:11:22] Yumi : [2016-06-13 17:21:21] BitMEX_Wally : But only for longs, as the funding rate is positive [2016-06-13 17:21:28] BitMEX_Wally : For shorts the maintenance margin in 0.50%
[2016-06-13 19:13:08] tscha : "OKC settles against last completed transaction" - imagine sleger's reaction if podizzle3k had said that :)
[2016-06-13 19:15:10] BTCVIX : the point is that before making drastic changes to an experimental product that had live money on the line the best course of action is to zero everyone out , which is just to give them the p&L minus DPE and then make the big changes
[2016-06-13 19:15:27] BTCVIX : it isn't really fair to be entering into a contract/trade that has changing terms in the middle of it
[2016-06-13 19:15:31] lockhedge : BTCVIX: can i quote you on reddit about okc settlement?
[2016-06-13 19:16:02] BTCVIX : lockhedge: sure -- it is right there in OKC FAQs
[2016-06-13 19:16:46] futuretrader : guys roe is basically i will get half of my profits right
[2016-06-13 19:16:52] futuretrader : if it says 48%
[2016-06-13 19:17:06] BitMEX_Sam : futuretrader: ROE is calculated on mark price, not last price, so be aware of that
[2016-06-13 19:17:12] BitMEX_Sam : Instead look at your entry price and compare to the current price
[2016-06-13 19:17:32] futuretrader : BitMEX_Sam: yes but say i make 0.02profit i get 48% of that right
[2016-06-13 19:17:50] BitMEX_Sam : No, it's saying that's 48% of the margin you put up to open the position
[2016-06-13 19:18:06] Yumi : BitMEX_Sam: see how ROE is confusing
[2016-06-13 19:18:06] BitMEX_Sam : So if you used 0.04 XBT to open a position and made 0.02 XBT off of it, that would be 50% ROE
[2016-06-13 19:18:14] Yumi : was my point earlier
[2016-06-13 19:18:18] BitMEX_Sam : Yumi: I agree that we need to do something to factor in the premium, but his question is different
[2016-06-13 19:18:42] BTCVIX : Yumi: no no-- bitmex has been "simplifying" things -- this is blasphamy to think it is complex
[2016-06-13 19:18:45] BitMEX_Sam : ROE == `Return On Equity`
[2016-06-13 19:18:49] Yumi : my point was its close to useless and misleading
[2016-06-13 19:19:07] futuretrader : BTCVIX: its just gets complex when you compare to poloniex mrgin
[2016-06-13 19:19:43] BTCVIX : yeah I know -- but that is still an issue with BitMEX -- they wanted to do things "their" way with XBT and gobbley gook
[2016-06-13 19:19:52] BTCVIX : so they get to answer the same questions over and over and over again
[2016-06-13 19:19:53] justinlooking : 690
[2016-06-13 19:19:56] justinlooking : wut
[2016-06-13 19:20:03] futuretrader : BTCVIX: it takes some getting used to. i dont see all these terms on poloniex simple straight i know how much i put in and how much i make easy
[2016-06-13 19:20:04] BitMEX_Sam : Looks like a big market sell
[2016-06-13 19:20:25] futuretrader : BTCVIX: this is more professional but i think it puts off those that are new to the game
[2016-06-13 19:22:59] futuretrader : plus i get confused when i dont see my profit balance straight away i think wtf where my profit
[2016-06-13 19:23:12] BTCDJS : BitMEX_Sam: what tells you that its a big market sell?
[2016-06-13 19:23:30] BitMEX_Sam : That it ate through $4 of bids
[2016-06-13 19:23:52] justinlooking : BTCDJS: all traded at same time
[2016-06-13 19:24:02] justinlooking : did it twice
[2016-06-13 19:25:28] BTCDJS : But also hardlyany volume behind it?
[2016-06-13 19:25:55] rapidtrades : longers finally realizing whats up
[2016-06-13 19:26:12] Yumi : rapidtrades: see above what I pasted
[2016-06-13 19:26:22] rapidtrades : no
[2016-06-13 19:26:30] Yumi : why not
[2016-06-13 19:26:48] blackwhite : rapidtrades: when you posted, they started to buy moar
[2016-06-13 19:26:58] rapidtrades : u say a lot of useless things @Yumi
[2016-06-13 19:27:14] Yumi : [2016-06-13 17:19:59] BitMEX_Wally : Yumi: The maintenance margin for XBTUSD is currently 0.50% plus 0.7787%
[2016-06-13 19:27:23] rapidtrades : f*ck
[2016-06-13 19:27:29] lockhedge : BTCVIX: only found this "The futures delivery price will now be calculated from the average index price between 3PM-4PM on the delivery date" http://blog.okcoin.com/post/115291858594/okcoin-futures-full-account-clawback-system did they make any changes how they settle?
[2016-06-13 19:27:37] rapidtrades : why would they include that in the maintence margin
[2016-06-13 19:27:41] Yumi : u my bitch now @rapidtrades
[2016-06-13 19:27:42] rapidtrades : that's such bullshit
[2016-06-13 19:28:07] rapidtrades : Yumi: ? there was no bet...f off
[2016-06-13 19:28:09] Yumi : [2016-06-13 17:21:21] BitMEX_Wally : But only for longs, as the funding rate is positive [2016-06-13 17:21:28] BitMEX_Wally : For shorts the maintenance margin in 0.50%
[2016-06-13 19:29:01] rapidtrades : i see u were right u dont have to spam that shit
[2016-06-13 19:29:37] rapidtrades : why would they include that in the margin tho? especially when offering 50/1 leverage
[2016-06-13 19:29:40] rapidtrades : thats stupid
[2016-06-13 19:30:27] justinlooking : BTCDJS: was a fair bit first time, check the tape
[2016-06-13 19:31:11] BTCDJS : justinlooking: what tape?
[2016-06-13 19:31:20] rapidtrades : so for longs what would be the max effective leverage
[2016-06-13 19:31:29] justinlooking : recent trades
[2016-06-13 19:31:53] justinlooking : 20:19:42, 697 -> 690, 40k lots(?)
[2016-06-13 19:33:31] justinlooking : dat tz leak
[2016-06-13 19:34:37] BTCDJS : justinlooking: Ok so someone on this exchange is selling off a lot. Because hardly a flinch on Finex or 0kcoin
[2016-06-13 19:35:06] rapidtrades : well yeah rates in 30 mins
[2016-06-13 19:35:37] BTCDJS : rapidtrades: cool so I can get my long filled cheaper
[2016-06-13 19:35:44] kogroken : Premium did shrink towards refunding
[2016-06-13 19:36:06] rapidtrades : refunding? is that an official term?
[2016-06-13 19:36:15] j8 : you can fill your long cheaper before funding, but then you pay funding
[2016-06-13 19:36:37] kogroken : It's recurring funding :P Dunno
[2016-06-13 19:36:45] rapidtrades : j8: it's a WIN WIN
[2016-06-13 19:36:51] rapidtrades : for shorts :)
[2016-06-13 19:36:55] j8 : absolutely
[2016-06-13 19:37:04] BTCDJS : j8: its small. but this whole debacle liquidated me in the first place
[2016-06-13 19:37:16] j8 : use lower leverage
[2016-06-13 19:38:31] BTCDJS : j8: it costs more
[2016-06-13 19:38:48] rapidtrades : it doesn't cost more...
[2016-06-13 19:38:48] j8 : "cost" is margin requirement
[2016-06-13 19:39:21] rapidtrades : that's not lost tho u get it back
[2016-06-13 19:39:23] j8 : getting liquidated is what actually costs you coins
[2016-06-13 19:39:44] rapidtrades : ^^^
[2016-06-13 19:41:38] BTCDJS : ok
[2016-06-13 19:42:02] justinlooking : lower leverage costs potential profit, but save potential loss
[2016-06-13 19:42:53] wurstgelee : justinlooking: only if u go all in
[2016-06-13 19:42:59] wurstgelee : otherwise it costs no profit
[2016-06-13 19:43:01] wurstgelee : =)
[2016-06-13 19:43:05] justinlooking : :)
[2016-06-13 19:43:11] wurstgelee : *potential
[2016-06-13 19:54:37] vizlma22 : Yep. Fees are crazy expensive for long positions in at least BTC and Etherium
[2016-06-13 19:55:54] rapidtrades : ^^^ scholar of the markets right here folks
[2016-06-13 20:00:40] rapidtrades : and the dough keeps rolling in
[2016-06-13 20:01:08] tscha : 1.125% back in town
[2016-06-13 20:01:15] rapidtrades : yessss
[2016-06-13 20:09:59] rentchev : vizlma22: that's why for long term position there are quarterly. I hope BitMex keep them
[2016-06-13 20:15:46] BitMEX_Sam : Volume on those contracts has been good so far
[2016-06-13 20:20:18] rentchev : BitMEX_Sam: that means they stay?
[2016-06-13 20:20:37] rentchev : After June is closed we will get a Dec?
[2016-06-13 20:20:48] BitMEX_Sam : Not an official announcement but given their favorable trading characteristics we are likely to continue
[2016-06-13 20:20:57] rentchev : :-)
[2016-06-13 20:21:00] rentchev : very nice
[2016-06-13 20:21:21] rentchev : I base all my trading strategy on the combination of long term and short term trades
[2016-06-13 20:25:45] vizlma22 : Thanks for input rapids--still at day job so wasn't monitoring chat. Was doing great this weekend, but cannot monitor positions and accidentally forgot to set stop loss. lol glad that i was using 12x leverage
[2016-06-13 20:29:19] wurstgelee : BitMEX_Sam: +1 for DEC ;)
[2016-06-13 20:29:27] wurstgelee : *Dec
[2016-06-13 20:31:25] j8 : BitMEX_Sam: that's awesome. might i suggest making it more clear in the UI that these are quanto contracts? most people won't realize
[2016-06-13 20:31:38] BitMEX_Sam : I'm thinking about putting them under a separate heading
[2016-06-13 20:31:48] j8 : makes sense
[2016-06-13 20:32:02] BitMEX_Sam : Our designer just got off the Appalachian trail, time to bother him
[2016-06-13 20:32:49] rentchev : lol
[2016-06-13 20:33:09] BitMEX_Sam : When I do the design... well, you all can see what happens.
[2016-06-13 20:33:18] justinlooking : hahaha
[2016-06-13 20:35:05] rentchev : BitMEX_Sam: how big is the development team?
[2016-06-13 20:35:27] BitMEX_Sam : I do all the UI + API + server work, and two fulltimers on the trading engine
[2016-06-13 20:35:38] BitMEX_Sam : One other parttimer helping with getting the frontend ready for translation
[2016-06-13 20:35:49] rentchev : cool
[2016-06-13 20:35:53] rentchev : so still a small team
[2016-06-13 20:35:59] BitMEX_Sam : Yeah. Lean & mean
[2016-06-13 20:36:03] rentchev : not a time for me to apply yet :-0
[2016-06-13 20:38:34] tscha : *two* fulltimers on the trading engine? so Wally + 1?
[2016-06-13 20:39:27] BitMEX_Sam : Yeah, Jinming, you might see him occasionally in here speaking with Chinese customers
[2016-06-13 20:39:29] j8 : seems we're stuck on some round numbers here. 4600 cny and 700 okc weekly
[2016-06-13 20:40:04] aethlios : j8: we need to sleep a few hours!!!!
[2016-06-13 20:40:13] rentchev : he he
[2016-06-13 20:40:14] rentchev : true
[2016-06-13 20:40:19] tscha : ah yeah. didn't know he was a coder, thought he was support for Chinese community or something
[2016-06-13 20:40:28] rentchev : but now it's the best time to place orders
[2016-06-13 20:40:47] BitMEX_Sam : tscha: Yeah, he basically does both.
[2016-06-13 20:40:58] j8 : resistance is meant to be broken
[2016-06-13 20:41:10] rentchev : BitMEX_Sam: interesting how developers are also support and chat mods
[2016-06-13 20:41:20] rentchev : no dedicated support person?
[2016-06-13 20:41:40] BitMEX_Sam : It's a small organization - at this point nobody dedicated yet, and even if there were, 24hr coverage is impossible for a single person
[2016-06-13 20:41:50] rentchev : right
[2016-06-13 20:41:56] rentchev : startup is fun
[2016-06-13 20:42:11] BitMEX_Sam : Yeah. I would love it if we were 9-5 M-F
[2016-06-13 20:42:30] rentchev : I've been looking to move to crypto related job
[2016-06-13 20:43:21] rentchev : love the space
[2016-06-13 20:45:01] vbmithr : coding?
[2016-06-13 20:46:06] rentchev : I am currently Director of technology for a small software company
[2016-06-13 20:46:16] rentchev : but mostly doing Software architecture, database design etc
[2016-06-13 20:46:50] rentchev : Also some coding :-)
[2016-06-13 20:47:31] vbmithr : ok :)
[2016-06-13 20:47:49] vbmithr : I'm coding a market maker bot currently
[2016-06-13 20:48:02] rentchev : cool
[2016-06-13 20:48:06] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 50 @ 693.83
[2016-06-13 20:48:14] rentchev : I have one ETHBTC bot on cryptotrader
[2016-06-13 20:48:20] rentchev : planing to build a lot more
[2016-06-13 20:48:31] rentchev : need to start using BitMEX API
[2016-06-13 20:48:38] rentchev : cryptotrader doesn't have them
[2016-06-13 20:48:51] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 27933 @ 693.43 **MEGA-REKT** :boom:
[2016-06-13 20:49:25] vbmithr : A friend of mine also using cryptotrader
[2016-06-13 20:49:33] mrp1nk : why is the mark price at premium now?
[2016-06-13 20:49:33] vbmithr : What does the bot do?
[2016-06-13 20:50:11] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 3300 @ 693.26
[2016-06-13 20:50:36] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 731 @ 692.91
[2016-06-13 20:50:44] markimarki : what happend to at chat says it was on 0.0278 around in the order book i didn't find anything?
[2016-06-13 20:50:48] markimarki : et
[2016-06-13 20:50:51] markimarki : eth
[2016-06-13 20:51:06] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 500 @ 692.06
[2016-06-13 20:51:06] REKT : Blood on the streets!
[2016-06-13 20:51:43] markimarki : i mean recent trades don't show anything like that
[2016-06-13 20:52:42] rentchev : vbmithr: trades ETH/BTC pair on margin at Polo and Bitmex
[2016-06-13 20:52:54] rentchev : 2H tick (more of a medium term trend strategy)
[2016-06-13 20:53:04] rentchev : sorry Bitmex = Bitfinex
[2016-06-13 20:53:11] rentchev : I want to do one for BitMEX :-)
[2016-06-13 20:54:25] vbmithr : ok
[2016-06-13 20:54:45] luckynuke : any mods here ?
[2016-06-13 20:54:55] vbmithr : That's not HFT :)
[2016-06-13 20:55:06] vbmithr : Shouldn't be too hard
[2016-06-13 20:55:40] luckynuke : guys i was long, liqidated and earned btc after liquidation. Why ?
[2016-06-13 20:57:39] futuretrader : how come marl price is higher than bitmex price
[2016-06-13 21:05:03] BitMEX_Sam : Mark price includes the funding rate, which decays until funding
[2016-06-13 21:05:16] BitMEX_Sam : This effectively prorates funding over the funding period by building it into the price
[2016-06-13 21:20:00] futuretrader : ok ow why was 0.03btc taken from my account
[2016-06-13 21:20:39] futuretrader : my witheld profit was 0.06 then it went down to 0.03
[2016-06-13 21:20:50] BitMEX_Sam : Because your liquidation cost you 0.03
[2016-06-13 21:21:03] BitMEX_Sam : Position value was 0.734 XBT, multiply by the maintenance margin of 0.5%
[2016-06-13 21:22:48] futuretrader : why is mark price higher than bitmex price
[2016-06-13 21:23:44] LeSmoke : someone is bullish
[2016-06-13 21:23:53] BitMEX_Sam : LeSmoke: It's the other way, in fact
[2016-06-13 21:24:12] BitMEX_Sam : Mark price includes the next funding, which decays linearly until funding is paid
[2016-06-13 21:24:27] BitMEX_Sam : Usually we see some premium on the contract but during this period the funding is properly culling the premium
[2016-06-13 21:26:31] rapidtrades : 'culling'
[2016-06-13 21:26:36] rapidtrades : such a cruel term to use
[2016-06-13 21:26:47] BitMEX_Sam : What can i say, I'm a wordsmith.
[2016-06-13 21:27:00] BitMEX_Sam : Noticing very bursty block confirmations by the way.
[2016-06-13 21:27:16] rapidtrades : meaning?
[2016-06-13 21:27:22] BitMEX_Sam : A few all at once, then a long pause
[2016-06-13 21:27:36] rapidtrades : ah
[2016-06-13 21:27:37] BitMEX_Sam : All full... ~998kb
[2016-06-13 21:27:56] BitMEX_Sam : Mempool is rapidly rising.
[2016-06-13 21:28:47] BitMEX_Sam : Kaiko has a really nice page for this. https://www.kaiko.com/blockchain
[2016-06-13 21:28:49] rapidtrades : ah the old pool of memes
[2016-06-13 21:29:33] rapidtrades : i think the longs are slowly getting the picture
[2016-06-13 21:30:27] rapidtrades : but imo we should be trading at a discount not a premium
[2016-06-13 21:31:06] blocklud : Sam, what's the mail for support?
[2016-06-13 21:31:11] BitMEX_Sam : With this funding rate, for sure
[2016-06-13 21:31:15] BitMEX_Sam : blocklud: support@bitmex.com
[2016-06-13 21:31:22] blocklud : ok, tx
[2016-06-13 21:31:23] rapidtrades : so they don't ''get it'' quite yet :)
[2016-06-13 21:34:12] rapidtrades : okc $700 wiit
[2016-06-13 21:34:21] rapidtrades : i meant to type woot
[2016-06-13 21:36:28] rapidtrades : was hoping to go to bed just now...guess not
[2016-06-13 21:37:28] jesperf : i'm going to have to quit my job to keep up
[2016-06-13 21:38:20] rapidtrades : its been a crazy 3 days, hardly got any sleep at all
[2016-06-13 21:38:25] rapidtrades : maybe 10 hrs total
[2016-06-13 21:42:35] leetsp33ch : i have 5 confirmations on my btc transaction, but it hasn't been credited to my account... never happened before :/
[2016-06-13 21:43:08] dharmabum : dharmabum had a liquidation price of 100m
[2016-06-13 21:43:19] dharmabum : that was pretty sweet. let it run...
[2016-06-13 21:43:39] rapidtrades : wat
[2016-06-13 21:44:10] luckynuke : huge walls in china
[2016-06-13 21:44:26] rapidtrades : bids?
[2016-06-13 21:45:14] luckynuke : walls decreases
[2016-06-13 21:45:35] luckynuke : 4701 ca 1500btc
[2016-06-13 21:45:54] luckynuke : and 2k on okcoin
[2016-06-13 21:46:14] luckynuke : o k c o i n 2k btc to 4700cny
[2016-06-13 21:46:41] luckynuke : 1k, 1.8k
[2016-06-13 21:50:06] luckynuke : china at 712$
[2016-06-13 21:50:29] aethlios : @rapidtrades no sleep and full coffee.
[2016-06-13 21:51:04] tscha : not sure if I should deposit more btc on bitmex so my short is covered, or I should just let my position liquidate and protect my good ROI score on leaderboard
[2016-06-13 21:51:13] tscha : hmmm
[2016-06-13 21:51:39] luckynuke : wait for the next big move ^^
[2016-06-13 21:54:31] rapidtrades : finex is finally on top...now we're in true fomo mode
[2016-06-13 21:54:49] BTCDJS : rapidtrades: can I ask you a question?
[2016-06-13 21:55:02] rapidtrades : yea? lol
[2016-06-13 21:56:05] podizzle3k : 17:29 - rapidtrades: i think the longs are slowly getting the picture
[2016-06-13 21:56:11] podizzle3k : what picture is that exactly
[2016-06-13 21:56:27] rapidtrades : that this isn't the place to go long right now
[2016-06-13 21:57:05] podizzle3k : oh ok so 30 minutes ago was a bad idea to go long immiately when the price shot up $18
[2016-06-13 21:57:08] podizzle3k : good call
[2016-06-13 21:57:30] rapidtrades : $18 sounds like a lot...but how much is 3% per day
[2016-06-13 21:57:40] podizzle3k : a fuckton
[2016-06-13 21:57:45] rapidtrades : 3.3% to be exact
[2016-06-13 21:58:22] BTCDJS : when you go long in a bull market. Do you open a position before the first leg and hold that all the way up to let's say now. And if so, do you add to your position during when you think it's going up another leg. Or do you enter and exit on the way up? @rapidtrades
[2016-06-13 21:58:44] rapidtrades : i don't add, all in and all out
[2016-06-13 21:58:55] podizzle3k : when you arbitrage in you do you wait for the first leg
[2016-06-13 21:58:59] podizzle3k : and then premium out?
[2016-06-13 21:59:16] rapidtrades : i do run two seperate systems tho so it's possible that i slowly enter/exit
[2016-06-13 21:59:29] rapidtrades : but for each system its all in/out
[2016-06-13 21:59:55] justinlooking : FOMO
[2016-06-13 22:00:22] BTCDJS : rapidtrades: system? As in this exchange and finex at the same time? Long?
[2016-06-13 22:00:23] tscha : moon incoming
[2016-06-13 22:00:42] rapidtrades : BTCDJS: system as in entry and exit rules
[2016-06-13 22:01:59] aethlios : Total Market Cap: $ 13,521,010,863 fiat entering crypto market.
[2016-06-13 22:02:14] rapidtrades : after i get a signal i usually try to long where its cheapest...within reason of course...not gonna go all in at btc-e even tho its always at discount @BTCDJS
[2016-06-13 22:02:53] justinlooking : om nom
[2016-06-13 22:04:04] BTCDJS : rapidtrades: ok. I've been entering and exiting after each leg. I've been thinking that is more stressful and less efficient way of trading. Next time I'll do what you do.
[2016-06-13 22:05:02] rapidtrades : day trading is hard...u will have much better odds of success in this game once u start to trade from daily charts or higher @BTCDJS
[2016-06-13 22:06:47] luckynuke : rapidtrades: are you a daytrader ?
[2016-06-13 22:06:56] rapidtrades : nope
[2016-06-13 22:07:24] luckynuke : rapidtrades: how do you know daytrading is hard ?
[2016-06-13 22:07:39] ted : who's got that wall up on eth
[2016-06-13 22:07:49] rapidtrades : because i've been trying to do it for years now, in forex and here
[2016-06-13 22:07:50] ted : why so high over the polo price
[2016-06-13 22:08:02] podizzle3k : one guy at 250
[2016-06-13 22:08:09] podizzle3k : it would go down if people sold to him
[2016-06-13 22:08:15] ted : ye, i guess he's got a good strategy ..
[2016-06-13 22:08:23] podizzle3k : buy at any cost? lol
[2016-06-13 22:08:24] rapidtrades : i usually try it once per year or two years and its always a waste of time and usully money too :)
[2016-06-13 22:08:44] ted : haha is it really you rapidtrade?
[2016-06-13 22:09:00] ted : i worked in a prob firm once, was some guys pushing the market around like that
[2016-06-13 22:09:04] MrRGnome : day trading is hard. It's a matter of volatility. Trends are likely to continue over periods of time, but in that period they may experience some sever volatility that a day trader can fall victim to - or make a killing on. It's strictly speaking harder to make calls with less data in your trend.
[2016-06-13 22:10:00] justinlooking : ted: prob?
[2016-06-13 22:10:09] rapidtrades : probation
[2016-06-13 22:10:20] ted : little confused about the strategy
[2016-06-13 22:10:32] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 9 @ 710.98
[2016-06-13 22:10:36] BTCDJS : rapidtrades: I look at daily chart to have some sort of idea where price is going to go. But I use the 15m chart to find an entry point on Bitmex. I projected price would go to 610-650. But I don't know why it didn't occur to me to just keep that position open all the way up to here. Guess I wasn't confident enough. So wanted to grab profit while I had it. But this experience has made me think a bit more about how to go about it.
[2016-06-13 22:10:54] ted : sure i've seen people push price around with a lot of leverage, but when we are just tracking the underling value on this site, i'm just not seeing it
[2016-06-13 22:11:23] rapidtrades : keep pushing up that premium boys
[2016-06-13 22:11:26] kogroken : BTCDJS: Traditional advice is to let winners ride and cut losses fast
[2016-06-13 22:11:41] rapidtrades : ^^^
[2016-06-13 22:12:10] podizzle3k : btcdjs scale out along the way and use probabilities to determine how much
[2016-06-13 22:12:43] kogroken : Of course, you should also have some plan for taking profits on the winners when they reach some kind of top / the trend reverses
[2016-06-13 22:12:51] lockhedge : i fear it's not possible to predict the future by looking at historical data
[2016-06-13 22:13:02] rapidtrades : lockhedge: lol @u kind sir
[2016-06-13 22:13:49] podizzle3k : lockhedge: no but you can get an edge from historical data
[2016-06-13 22:14:26] ted : anyone got an idea of the strategy of the 'great wall'?
[2016-06-13 22:14:41] rapidtrades : ted: it was to keep out the Mongols dummy
[2016-06-13 22:14:58] ted : haha lot of mongols to try and keep out on this site lol
[2016-06-13 22:14:58] rapidtrades : didn't u take history?
[2016-06-13 22:15:25] podizzle3k : ted i guess as long as price doesnt slip too much theres not much risk
[2016-06-13 22:16:01] justinlooking : maybe he is happy to pay above market to free up margin for other pos
[2016-06-13 22:16:04] rapidtrades : half the time i have no clue what this chat is talking about
[2016-06-13 22:17:04] BTCDJS : lockhedge: on Bitcoin it is. Just about every leg up was support and resistance of the past. I couldn't believe how easy it was to predict it. It definitely guided me all the way up to here.
[2016-06-13 22:18:01] BTCDJS : TA works on Bitcoin. But obviously shouldn't be the only thing to rely on
[2016-06-13 22:22:02] rapidtrades : are u scared fellas?
[2016-06-13 22:22:11] justinlooking : i think m16 is
[2016-06-13 22:22:45] lockhedge : BTCDJS: most important thing if you are planning to trade frequently: avoid transaction costs (fees + spread + volatility*latency) . if you trade 1000 times in one year and pay 0.1% per trade, you have to make 100% return to just earn your costs back.
[2016-06-13 22:23:20] gustavo7 : up we go
[2016-06-13 22:24:06] yerb : funding rate again over 1%
[2016-06-13 22:24:33] rapidtrades : ^^^ diligent market observer right HERE
[2016-06-13 22:26:15] rapidtrades : dam sleger really is gone
[2016-06-13 22:27:31] BTCDJS : lockhedge: ok thanks. I've been noticing the chats in here about fees and have realised it's an important part of trading. I'm still learning but it's definitely in my awareness to take seriously. Don't understand it all properly yet but I'm getting there as I pay more attention to it. Though I'm still a part time trader. got a job and all that. But if I can get really good at this I might quit one day.
[2016-06-13 22:27:55] podizzle3k : people spending too much time analyzing fees and rates imo
[2016-06-13 22:28:13] podizzle3k : should be concentrating on making good trades instead
[2016-06-13 22:28:21] rapidtrades : nope, fees are crucial
[2016-06-13 22:28:29] podizzle3k : but im glad you guys are here to keep bitmex honest
[2016-06-13 22:28:32] aethlios : rapidtrades: sleger needs to come back, a lot of premium now, will recover loss in a week.
[2016-06-13 22:28:35] rapidtrades : most ppl, including me are very poor traders
[2016-06-13 22:28:45] wurstgelee : podizzle3k: +1
[2016-06-13 22:28:48] wurstgelee : =)
[2016-06-13 22:31:24] ted : you seem to be running the show rapidtrades ;)
[2016-06-13 22:32:00] rapidtrades : yeah some ppl call me the leader here
[2016-06-13 22:32:26] rapidtrades : not sure that's a good thing cos most ppl here are idiots
[2016-06-13 22:33:05] BTCDJS : ?
[2016-06-13 22:34:18] BTCDJS : rapidtrades: you've got be he from the NE of England. Your humour is the same.
[2016-06-13 22:35:11] BTCDJS : Mate you a tradesman by trade? Joiner? Bricky? Sparky? Plumber?
[2016-06-13 22:35:27] BTCDJS : Youd do well on a building site lol
[2016-06-13 22:35:34] justinlooking : rapid remember reverse indicator :P
[2016-06-13 22:35:49] wurstgelee : :D
[2016-06-13 22:36:00] podizzle3k : 18:32 - rapidtrades: yeah some ppl call me the leader here
[2016-06-13 22:36:03] wurstgelee : i remember a certain guy refusing to read
[2016-06-13 22:36:03] podizzle3k : hahah