This is a mirror of the original BitMEX trollbox archive that used to be online here.
BitMEX disabled their archive after the DDOS attack so I have decided to make my mirror publicly available.

Well now, a few days after I made this mirror available to the public, the original archive from BitMEX is online again.
But since it is still limited (neutered to the last few hundred messages) I will keep my FULL mirror alive.

You have access to more than 50 million trollbox posts. This is more than 7 gigabyte of data hosted on a $5 server so please be patient or consider a donation

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[2016-12-12 13:22:11] Rado : it cost me 0 to get it to my bank account
[2016-12-12 13:22:23] arbitrage001 : not everyone lives in canada
[2016-12-12 13:22:24] Tetsuo : volatility, risk of BTC exchange collapsing, slippage, risk of bank block your bank account if you use BTC
[2016-12-12 13:23:03] Rado : you guys can keep trying to hold on to your old ways
[2016-12-12 13:23:24] arbitrage001 : i do things practically and efficiently
[2016-12-12 13:23:36] Tetsuo : credit cards will help me get my money back if i get scammed!
[2016-12-12 13:23:44] arbitrage001 : and using btc for payment is not viable at this stage
[2016-12-12 13:24:11] Tetsuo : ^as i said nothing has changed in the last 3 years for real world usage
[2016-12-12 13:24:30] Tetsuo : beside ponzi, gambling black market and usage for alt P&Ds
[2016-12-12 13:25:02] Rado : Tetsuo: tell that to BitPay
[2016-12-12 13:25:26] arbitrage001 : bitpay will eventually go bust
[2016-12-12 13:25:39] Tetsuo : how´s circle doin?
[2016-12-12 13:25:47] arbitrage001 : circle is goner
[2016-12-12 13:25:58] arbitrage001 : coinbase still losing money every year
[2016-12-12 13:32:21] REKT : Liquidated short on `XBTUSD`: Buy 87 @ 778.73
[2016-12-12 13:34:07] Mey : Tetsuo: "alt P&Ds"?
[2016-12-12 13:34:33] Mey : arbitrage001: BitPay is going so bad?
[2016-12-12 13:38:26] REKT : Liquidated short on `XBTUSD`: Buy 350 @ 779.13
[2016-12-12 13:39:31] arbitrage001 : Mey: i am saying bitpay business model do not work
[2016-12-12 13:42:10] j8 : their business model is accepting zero-conf transactions on your behalf, right
[2016-12-12 13:45:03] Mey : arbitrage001: what about it does not work?
[2016-12-12 13:45:07] arbitrage001 : j8: the fee part is too high when comparing to credit card
[2016-12-12 13:45:31] Mey : ouch.
[2016-12-12 13:45:49] Mey : wait, does zero-confirmation mean they need to take a credit risk and then price that in?
[2016-12-12 13:45:57] Mey : arbitrage001: rly?????? what are we talking??
[2016-12-12 13:46:44] j8 : 1% instead of 2-3 for cc's
[2016-12-12 13:46:52] Mey : arbitrage001: hey back to how to hedge USD against BTC
[2016-12-12 13:46:59] Mey : how exactly do aI do that =)
[2016-12-12 13:47:12] arbitrage001 : it is not 1% when you include other "fee"
[2016-12-12 13:47:26] arbitrage001 : could be converting fee plus misc
[2016-12-12 13:47:53] arbitrage001 : Mey: i am about to hit the bed
[2016-12-12 13:48:06] arbitrage001 : Mey: ask j8, he is super expert here
[2016-12-12 13:48:18] arbitrage001 : and making a lot of profit here
[2016-12-12 13:53:51] sleger : Mey: if you want to hedge your usd against btc, you only need to buy bitcoins with your usd
[2016-12-12 14:02:16] rapidtrades : sleger: can u believe this shit man?
[2016-12-12 14:02:26] sleger : shit ?
[2016-12-12 14:02:31] j8 : rapid caught short?
[2016-12-12 14:02:43] sleger : oh yes
[2016-12-12 14:02:59] sleger : dont fight the tren
[2016-12-12 14:03:01] sleger : d
[2016-12-12 14:05:06] rapidtrades : wtf is up wtih reddit? it keeps logging me out
[2016-12-12 14:05:13] rapidtrades : sleger: shut up sleger
[2016-12-12 14:06:17] sleger : rapidtrades: look at btcjpy, showing the way
[2016-12-12 14:06:35] rapidtrades : jpy doesn't matter
[2016-12-12 14:06:48] rapidtrades : japs are only buying cos their currency is going down the drain
[2016-12-12 14:06:58] sleger : so did chinese i thought ?
[2016-12-12 14:06:59] rapidtrades : they don't hold any special info
[2016-12-12 14:07:08] sleger : at least thats what i keep reading on this trollbox
[2016-12-12 14:07:11] rapidtrades : china has all the major exchanges and miners tho
[2016-12-12 14:07:25] rapidtrades : japan is nothing
[2016-12-12 14:07:40] sleger : they're big gamblers
[2016-12-12 14:09:33] j8 : guise this pump is obviously venezuelans buying
[2016-12-12 14:09:54] sleger : bitcoin is the only food left there
[2016-12-12 14:10:39] anonymous789 : still at 778
[2016-12-12 14:10:58] anonymous789 : bull flag forming, looks like i'm gonna get killed
[2016-12-12 14:12:19] bingbongfly : anonymous789: no, china is taking profits, we'll have a retrace to 720 - 740
[2016-12-12 14:12:49] anonymous789 : the sell volume isn't convincing enough for that i feel
[2016-12-12 14:13:18] sleger : its only going higher
[2016-12-12 14:14:18] anonymous789 : i deserve to get liquidated
[2016-12-12 14:14:49] thomaskikansha : stamp broke the June high
[2016-12-12 14:14:55] Tetsuo : so is "Pantera Capital" not injeting enough fresh money to keep Stamps business alive or why are they fundraising?
[2016-12-12 14:15:26] Rado : anonymous789: still short?
[2016-12-12 14:15:35] anonymous789 : Rado: holding until i get killed now
[2016-12-12 14:15:35] Rado : did you not close on teh dip?
[2016-12-12 14:15:42] Tetsuo : only the diehard remain
[2016-12-12 14:16:09] anonymous789 : Rado: nah, didn't really feel like a good time to close, bear flag was formin etc
[2016-12-12 14:16:40] anonymous789 : and this rally is completely baseless
[2016-12-12 14:16:43] anonymous789 : no fundamentals to support
[2016-12-12 14:16:48] Rado : ha ha
[2016-12-12 14:16:52] Rado : you are funny man
[2016-12-12 14:17:10] Rado : when BTC is at $900 you will be scratching your head
[2016-12-12 14:17:21] Rado : remember I told you it's going there
[2016-12-12 14:17:39] anonymous789 : if it goes straight there yeah, if it does what it should and corrects back to <740 i won't be scratching my head
[2016-12-12 14:18:08] Rado : BTC is not supposed to do anything
[2016-12-12 14:18:30] rapidtrades : it's gotta drop 20-25%
[2016-12-12 14:19:11] anonymous789 : price action should dictate sentiment, tell my why there is positive sentiment in bitcoin right now?
[2016-12-12 14:19:23] Rado : yes from $2000 to $1600
[2016-12-12 14:19:43] rapidtrades : sleger: what broker do u use for options
[2016-12-12 14:19:45] anonymous789 : segwit is not being accepted, network completely congested, ridiculous fees for even small transactions
[2016-12-12 14:19:52] anonymous789 : the fundamentals are totally shit
[2016-12-12 14:19:54] rapidtrades : +1
[2016-12-12 14:19:55] sleger : rapidtrades: interactive brokers
[2016-12-12 14:19:58] rapidtrades : bitcoin is dead
[2016-12-12 14:20:14] Rado : anonymous789: people buying BTC and applications being build on top of it it's at all time high
[2016-12-12 14:20:16] sleger : anonymous789: so something is in super high demand therefore its shit
[2016-12-12 14:20:18] sleger : ?
[2016-12-12 14:20:25] Rado : where do you measure your sentiment?
[2016-12-12 14:20:52] anonymous789 : how is bitcoin in super high demand?
[2016-12-12 14:21:06] anonymous789 : the india/venezuela etc buying up bitcoin is pure speculation
[2016-12-12 14:21:13] sleger : anonymous789: because blocks are full
[2016-12-12 14:21:21] anonymous789 : okay so blocks are full
[2016-12-12 14:21:25] anonymous789 : it's embarassing
[2016-12-12 14:21:26] bingbongfly : anonymous789: lbc has new record high every week, about 72m every month
[2016-12-12 14:21:29] anonymous789 : isn't that embarassing?
[2016-12-12 14:21:30] sleger : yes => high demand, high value
[2016-12-12 14:21:43] bingbongfly : anonymous789: people need to send money home, remittance, and dont forget the black market
[2016-12-12 14:21:58] sleger : no its not, its like that super hype night club where people wait in line, everyone wants to go there
[2016-12-12 14:21:58] bingbongfly : anonymous789: saying btc is not in high demand is fooling himself
[2016-12-12 14:22:05] anonymous789 : how are they sending money when it takes likek 15 years to send one transaction?
[2016-12-12 14:22:14] sleger : and then i show up and skip the line just because ;)
[2016-12-12 14:22:21] bingbongfly : anonymous789: well it doesnt take 15 years.
[2016-12-12 14:22:37] bingbongfly : anonymous789: it takes about 5 hours - 2 days depending on the fee you choose
[2016-12-12 14:22:37] sleger : never takes me more than 30 minutes to send a transaction
[2016-12-12 14:22:47] sleger : just skip the line ;)
[2016-12-12 14:22:48] anonymous789 : bingbongfly: lol and that's a good thing?
[2016-12-12 14:23:00] bingbongfly : anonymous789: No never said it was, but its better then any bank can offer
[2016-12-12 14:23:06] anonymous789 : sleger: sending million dollar worth of btc as fees per transaction doesn't count '_)
[2016-12-12 14:23:09] anonymous789 : ;)*
[2016-12-12 14:23:15] sleger : i send 0.0005
[2016-12-12 14:23:23] anonymous789 : sleger: sure
[2016-12-12 14:23:28] bingbongfly : anonymous789: it's high demand, btc has it's problems, big ones, but demand is not one of it
[2016-12-12 14:23:58] anonymous789 : bingbongfly: well not really, i can go into a store and buy a coffee with my debit card, and it's taken directly out of my bank and transferred to the other person's bank instantly for free on my side?
[2016-12-12 14:24:09] anonymous789 : i don't have to wait 5 hours for my coffee lol
[2016-12-12 14:24:14] sleger : it is not instant for them
[2016-12-12 14:24:20] anonymous789 : yes it is in the UK
[2016-12-12 14:24:29] bingbongfly : anonymous789: it's not instant, no it's just required zero confirmations
[2016-12-12 14:24:44] anonymous789 : because 0 confirmations is a secure network... really?
[2016-12-12 14:24:46] bingbongfly : anonymous789: you don't know how it works, that's all. But btc will never be used to buy coffe lol
[2016-12-12 14:25:02] sleger : not directly on the network
[2016-12-12 14:25:04] anonymous789 : not true, coffee shops accept bitcoin...
[2016-12-12 14:25:18] bingbongfly : anonymous789: yes, but it takes like 5 hours, so who would buy coffe xD
[2016-12-12 14:25:21] anonymous789 : sleger: you talking about settlement?
[2016-12-12 14:25:31] anonymous789 : bingbongfly: haha
[2016-12-12 14:25:49] sleger : im saying bitcoin will not be used to buy coffee on the blockchain directly, on sidechains maybe
[2016-12-12 14:26:03] anonymous789 : segwit is not even being accepted
[2016-12-12 14:26:03] bingbongfly : sleger: +1, anon 789 is just a bit dull
[2016-12-12 14:26:16] anonymous789 : nothing happens on btc
[2016-12-12 14:26:24] anonymous789 : like nothing, no one can ever come to concensus about anything
[2016-12-12 14:26:28] sleger : anonymous789: well then you will be happy in your short
[2016-12-12 14:26:34] sleger : short more
[2016-12-12 14:26:43] anonymous789 : i am happy in my short until it gets to like 800 then i won't be haha
[2016-12-12 14:26:49] bingbongfly : anonymous789: agreed, it's a huge problem. However I think btc can go up in value DESPITE the fact they can't agree to anything
[2016-12-12 14:26:50] anonymous789 : oh i would, if i could haha
[2016-12-12 14:27:06] anonymous789 : IMO, this is all FOMO
[2016-12-12 14:27:21] anonymous789 : and fundamentally baseless
[2016-12-12 14:27:22] bingbongfly : anonymous789: the demand outweighs the problems btc has, imo this is all organic growth. not fomo
[2016-12-12 14:27:33] sleger : fomo doesnt look like that
[2016-12-12 14:27:36] Rado : anonymous789: so you will be happy until tomorrow
[2016-12-12 14:27:51] anonymous789 : when people come on trollbox asking how they can buy btc or sell it because they don't know how to use an exchange
[2016-12-12 14:27:52] anonymous789 : i call that fomo
[2016-12-12 14:28:13] anonymous789 : i've seen at least 2 people on troll box asking how do i do shit on this website
[2016-12-12 14:28:23] sleger : i call that being a newb
[2016-12-12 14:28:35] anonymous789 : one of their friends clearly said to them "oh btc is at 780 dollars, you should buy some", FOMO!!!
[2016-12-12 14:28:46] anonymous789 : beacuse they didn't buy at 450
[2016-12-12 14:28:47] anonymous789 : or whatever
[2016-12-12 14:28:49] rapidtrades : sleger: IB is one of the worst platforms ive used
[2016-12-12 14:28:57] sleger : it is the best by far
[2016-12-12 14:29:06] sleger : but it is for the more educated traders
[2016-12-12 14:29:08] sleger : sorry...
[2016-12-12 14:29:12] rapidtrades : its shit
[2016-12-12 14:29:13] sleger : they wont help users
[2016-12-12 14:29:21] Tetsuo : no trollbox?
[2016-12-12 14:29:26] sleger : but for pro its the only one worth using
[2016-12-12 14:29:32] sleger : no trollbox sorry
[2016-12-12 14:29:47] anonymous789 : baseless rally, the phrase of the month
[2016-12-12 14:29:55] rapidtrades : it's not about help, it should be intuitive to use
[2016-12-12 14:30:09] sleger : rapidtrades: its about functionality
[2016-12-12 14:30:16] sleger : its not meant to be intuitive / easy
[2016-12-12 14:30:23] sleger : just like bloomberg
[2016-12-12 14:30:25] rapidtrades : so u agree its shit
[2016-12-12 14:30:31] sleger : no
[2016-12-12 14:30:40] anonymous789 : rapidtrades: sleger thinks he's better than you
[2016-12-12 14:30:58] rapidtrades : sleger thinks he's better then everyone here :)
[2016-12-12 14:31:09] anonymous789 : j8 one-ups him?
[2016-12-12 14:31:32] j8 : hey don't bring me into this
[2016-12-12 14:31:40] anonymous789 : j8: :D
[2016-12-12 14:31:40] rapidtrades : sleger: you use TWS?
[2016-12-12 14:31:46] sleger : yes
[2016-12-12 14:32:01] anonymous789 : eth rallying
[2016-12-12 14:32:12] anonymous789 : now that's a crypto with some fundamentals
[2016-12-12 14:32:26] sleger : hey you
[2016-12-12 14:32:31] sleger : 're not completely stupid
[2016-12-12 14:32:57] anonymous789 : sleger: well if i am, and i support eth, then you should be worried about your investment ;)
[2016-12-12 14:33:13] sleger : yes but i didnt say you were
[2016-12-12 14:33:27] anonymous789 : you said i'm not completely stupid, that means i'm a little bit stupid?
[2016-12-12 14:33:46] sleger : based on all the info i have so far, it seems likely
[2016-12-12 14:33:51] sleger : but not 100% sure
[2016-12-12 14:33:58] anonymous789 : do you really mean stupid or do you mean crazy?
[2016-12-12 14:34:16] sleger : i dont have enough information to assume you are crazy
[2016-12-12 14:35:22] anonymous789 : oh so i'm stupid for shorting btc at these levels?
[2016-12-12 14:35:36] sleger : not that no, the way you talk in general
[2016-12-12 14:35:43] sleger : im anonymous im legion blabla
[2016-12-12 14:35:50] anonymous789 : i am anonymous
[2016-12-12 14:35:53] anonymous789 : i am legion
[2016-12-12 14:35:55] anonymous789 : expect me
[2016-12-12 14:36:27] sleger : i doubt you cant even hack a simple html website
[2016-12-12 14:36:44] sleger : or anyone on open wifi
[2016-12-12 14:36:54] rapidtrades : Call has been price capped to 0.71 to avoid an execution of your order at a price that is not consistent with a fair and orderly market.
[2016-12-12 14:37:02] rapidtrades : wtf is this cap shit
[2016-12-12 14:37:17] anonymous789 : anonymous is anyone and everyone, we are all anonymous, not just hackers
[2016-12-12 14:37:32] anonymous789 : i think you'll find the hacking groups are actually subsets of anonymous i.e. lulzsec
[2016-12-12 14:37:49] anonymous789 : and btw i'm a security point of contact and software developer at oracle, i know how to hack stuff ;)
[2016-12-12 14:37:56] j8 : rapidtrades: maybe don't manipulate the market? :)
[2016-12-12 14:38:25] sleger : anonymous789: oracle, their DB product ?
[2016-12-12 14:38:37] rapidtrades : j8: ur right i could go to jail
[2016-12-12 14:38:50] rapidtrades : SEC will be all over my ass any second now
[2016-12-12 14:38:51] anonymous789 : no, oracle as in the company that is worth over 350 billion dollars and has over 120000 worldwide employees oracle
[2016-12-12 14:39:07] sleger : anonymous789: yes, but which product of oracle do you work for ?
[2016-12-12 14:39:17] anonymous789 : i work for the retail GBU
[2016-12-12 14:39:22] j8 : cops will find you in your mom's basement like sarao @rapidtrades
[2016-12-12 14:39:37] sleger : anonymous789: btw oracle has 170bn market cap
[2016-12-12 14:39:51] rapidtrades : i wish i was in my mom's basement, i would save so much $$$
[2016-12-12 14:40:10] anonymous789 : sleger: i'll go by my figures
[2016-12-12 14:40:26] sleger : i mean its not up for debate
[2016-12-12 14:40:33] sleger : the price per share is 40.5
[2016-12-12 14:40:34] anonymous789 : well i'm debating it
[2016-12-12 14:40:44] sleger : it is what it is, and it is 170bn
[2016-12-12 14:40:53] anonymous789 : still more than you're worth
[2016-12-12 14:40:53] bingbongfly : look at this buy wall at xbt :d
[2016-12-12 14:41:05] anonymous789 : bingbongfly: eat it
[2016-12-12 14:41:19] bingbongfly : anonymous789: too poor :/
[2016-12-12 14:41:30] Rado : bingbongfly: this is sleger buying 1/10 of his position
[2016-12-12 14:41:34] anonymous789 : is that 1million dollars worth of buy wall?
[2016-12-12 14:41:50] Rado : it's $210,000
[2016-12-12 14:41:50] sleger : anonymous789: well of course its worth more than I am. Is that your tactic when you're proven wrong, you just change subject and attack on something stupid and unrelated ?
[2016-12-12 14:41:57] Rado : 1 contarct = $1 USD
[2016-12-12 14:42:02] anonymous789 : Rado: but what about the 5 orders down to 777
[2016-12-12 14:42:32] anonymous789 : some hidden 210ks there?
[2016-12-12 14:42:43] anonymous789 : and they're gone...
[2016-12-12 14:42:55] anonymous789 : manipulation at its finest
[2016-12-12 14:42:59] anonymous789 : stop messing around sleger
[2016-12-12 14:43:11] j8 : you were looking at the total column maybe..
[2016-12-12 14:43:19] anonymous789 : j8: makes sense
[2016-12-12 14:43:28] sleger : just pushing up the price to 800
[2016-12-12 14:43:31] anonymous789 : i assumed total included hidden orders
[2016-12-12 14:43:34] sleger : to clean up the trollbox
[2016-12-12 14:43:43] j8 : they wouldn't really be hidden then would they
[2016-12-12 14:43:46] anonymous789 : sleger: 843 is where you're gonna liquidate me bitch
[2016-12-12 14:44:00] sleger : shit you're here for 2 more weeks then
[2016-12-12 14:44:01] anonymous789 : j8: okay smartypants
[2016-12-12 14:44:09] anonymous789 : sleger: yup
[2016-12-12 14:44:25] Rado : lol
[2016-12-12 14:44:46] anonymous789 : well if it gets past 780 i could gone by tomorrow
[2016-12-12 14:44:57] sleger : if oracle is worth 350bn and not 170, then is 1 contract here worth 2$ ? @anonymous789
[2016-12-12 14:45:16] anonymous789 : sleger: now that's unrelated...
[2016-12-12 14:45:25] sleger : actually it's not
[2016-12-12 14:45:30] anonymous789 : actually it is
[2016-12-12 14:45:37] sleger : maybe you're talking different $, worth half a real dollar
[2016-12-12 14:45:41] OVS : wow nice to see everyone getting along this morning.
[2016-12-12 14:45:49] anonymous789 : OVS: :D
[2016-12-12 14:46:01] anonymous789 : sleger: maybe
[2016-12-12 14:46:20] OVS : :)
[2016-12-12 14:46:22] anonymous789 : all i know is ethereum is the future
[2016-12-12 14:46:35] j8 : at least you guys can agree on that
[2016-12-12 14:46:44] anonymous789 : j8: :)
[2016-12-12 14:47:06] Rado : ha ha
[2016-12-12 14:47:08] anonymous789 : fomo longs gonna get rekt soon
[2016-12-12 14:47:09] sleger : maybe i should reconsider that position
[2016-12-12 14:47:20] anonymous789 : sleger: :D
[2016-12-12 14:49:00] anonymous789 : i want btc to stop torturing me and just liquidate me already
[2016-12-12 14:57:26] Rado : anonymous789: just short more
[2016-12-12 14:57:55] Rekted : anonymous789: close your position and send me your btc (you will be free)
[2016-12-12 14:57:57] anonymous789 : gotta wait until i get liquidated first
[2016-12-12 14:58:00] laisee : sell the house and short it all
[2016-12-12 14:58:10] anonymous789 : laisee: that's the best idea
[2016-12-12 14:58:38] laisee : can't lose.
[2016-12-12 14:59:45] laisee : anonymous789: u really work for oracle?
[2016-12-12 14:59:46] rapidtrades : BEN DOVER LONGS
[2016-12-12 15:00:17] Rado : by the way shorting the quarterly you can't lose in USD terms
[2016-12-12 15:00:23] Rado : unless you get liquidated
[2016-12-12 15:00:44] Rado : anonymous789: are you shorting swap or Dec 30?
[2016-12-12 15:00:47] anonymous789 : laisee: yea i do, that bit is not a lie :P
[2016-12-12 15:00:53] anonymous789 : Rado: swap
[2016-12-12 15:00:55] laisee : who uses the usd anymore ...
[2016-12-12 15:01:06] anonymous789 : Rado: that's why i'm not liking the funding rate etiehr should be better
[2016-12-12 15:01:51] laisee : anonymous789: why is Java so lame? Can Oracle fix it sometime or put it out of its misery sooon
[2016-12-12 15:02:50] anonymous789 : java 9 soon
[2016-12-12 15:02:54] anonymous789 : should be decent
[2016-12-12 15:03:50] anonymous789 : btw java is number 1 programming language in the world, so can't be that bad ;)
[2016-12-12 15:04:07] laisee : they said the same about cobol
[2016-12-12 15:04:27] anonymous789 : depending on you speak too, some will say they love cobol
[2016-12-12 15:05:14] laisee : 60 yr old cobol guys love ...
[2016-12-12 15:05:31] laisee : cobol
[2016-12-12 15:05:50] anonymous789 : i've never used it, those 60 year olds might be right
[2016-12-12 15:06:32] sleger : i'd rather use c# than java, and i hate windows
[2016-12-12 15:06:47] anonymous789 : sleger: c# is the devil
[2016-12-12 15:06:48] laisee : sleger: +1000
[2016-12-12 15:06:58] anonymous789 : laisee: -1000
[2016-12-12 15:07:14] laisee : c-sharp rocks. java is like c-sharp from 6 years ago
[2016-12-12 15:07:31] Rado : Windows is really bad
[2016-12-12 15:07:42] laisee : true, dat.
[2016-12-12 15:07:48] anonymous789 : laisee: on what basis do you say that?
[2016-12-12 15:08:19] sleger : i've used both
[2016-12-12 15:08:20] laisee : I see stuff in Java 8 that came iut years ago in c-s
[2016-12-12 15:09:35] vincent : anh duc
[2016-12-12 15:09:39] minhduc : dc
[2016-12-12 15:10:13] laisee : e.g. lambda func
[2016-12-12 15:10:55] anonymous789 : okay so lambda functions are really necessary in object oriented programming languages?
[2016-12-12 15:11:49] anonymous789 : even taking lambda functions out of the equation, you're basic argument is that c# has more functionality yea?
[2016-12-12 15:11:52] laisee : depends. I think they are cool and OO has had its turn.
[2016-12-12 15:12:23] laisee : yeah, c-s passed java years back and has got way more stuff in it
[2016-12-12 15:12:39] anonymous789 : okay, you're aware that complexity of programming languages is not always a good thing?
[2016-12-12 15:13:05] laisee : I like option to write procedural, OO or functional in one language
[2016-12-12 15:13:16] anonymous789 : most developers are not geniuses, in fact, quite the contrary, most programmers are just people that happened to get a computer science degree, or a maths degree and it was a decent living to choose that career
[2016-12-12 15:13:40] anonymous789 : complexity adds problems for most developers
[2016-12-12 15:13:43] anonymous789 : and complicates things
[2016-12-12 15:13:45] laisee : anonymous789: agree, and that accunts for all the awful java code I have to work with
[2016-12-12 15:13:46] anonymous789 : java keeps it simple
[2016-12-12 15:14:02] sleger : then they should use python if they want simple
[2016-12-12 15:14:03] vincent : anh duc oi
[2016-12-12 15:14:25] minhduc : thang nay no khung qua
[2016-12-12 15:14:26] anonymous789 : sleger: python is a mess
[2016-12-12 15:14:57] sleger : yes but i still rather use python than java
[2016-12-12 15:14:57] laisee : yay. python keeps most people out of trou
[2016-12-12 15:15:45] laisee : anonymous789: python is good for people who will never be rea
[2016-12-12 15:15:55] anonymous789 : so i started java during 1.4, before generics etc and everytime there is an iteration, although it comes with the territory being a developer, it's a pain in the ass to learn new things
[2016-12-12 15:16:06] anonymous789 : C# is a f-ucking nightmare for people that just want to earn money
[2016-12-12 15:16:40] anonymous789 : being a c# developer means you have what's called lower 'knowledge capital'
[2016-12-12 15:16:41] laisee : anonymous789: actually, c-s is great for building stuff that makes lots of moolah
[2016-12-12 15:16:50] anonymous789 : so is java..
[2016-12-12 15:17:12] laisee : sure, it just takes an extra million lines of code ;-)
[2016-12-12 15:17:51] anonymous789 : laisee: well that's not entirely true, some stuff does make the line count less, but learning that stuff and putting that stuff into practice is still a pain in the ass
[2016-12-12 15:18:02] anonymous789 : like delegate methods for example, why bother
[2016-12-12 15:18:33] laisee : you don't like functional stuff, it seems
[2016-12-12 15:18:56] anonymous789 : well the languages were designed to not be functional inherently
[2016-12-12 15:19:04] anonymous789 : they were designed to be object oriented
[2016-12-12 15:19:11] anonymous789 : if you want that level of complexity, i'd say go to C++
[2016-12-12 15:19:18] anonymous789 : but certainly i'd never bother with c#
[2016-12-12 15:19:22] sleger : c++ is great too
[2016-12-12 15:19:32] anonymous789 : sleger: i won't argue that
[2016-12-12 15:19:43] sleger : at least your program doesnt stop for 1 second to clean its messed up memory
[2016-12-12 15:20:23] anonymous789 : sleger: actually, they say the java VM is so optimised that it runs code faster than if you wrote your own memory handling in C++ for a like-for-like program
[2016-12-12 15:20:40] anonymous789 : that certainly used to be the case back in the day
[2016-12-12 15:20:43] anonymous789 : <java 1.6
[2016-12-12 15:20:44] sleger : for some particular examples maybe it is true, but not in general
[2016-12-12 15:20:58] anonymous789 : not true, it's the inverse of that
[2016-12-12 15:21:12] anonymous789 : in general, java is faster, for particular examples C++ is faster
[2016-12-12 15:21:17] sleger : if you write shitty c++ code you can make it worse than java
[2016-12-12 15:21:21] anonymous789 : yes
[2016-12-12 15:21:36] anonymous789 : that's what most devs do though, most devs are not professors
[2016-12-12 15:21:37] sleger : if you write shitty code then dont use c++
[2016-12-12 15:21:40] sleger : use java
[2016-12-12 15:21:45] laisee : pre-optimized code can be a bad thing, too
[2016-12-12 15:21:52] anonymous789 : doesn't matter, even if you write good code in c++ it might not be 'great' code
[2016-12-12 15:22:17] anonymous789 : java vm makes it run almost great in most instances
[2016-12-12 15:22:22] sleger : so if i need performance i use c++, otherwise i use python
[2016-12-12 15:23:14] anonymous789 : sleger, write 2 data structures, one in C++ and one Java, exactly the same
[2016-12-12 15:23:19] anonymous789 : then use a profiler
[2016-12-12 15:23:44] anonymous789 : you tell me which one performs better through the profiler
[2016-12-12 15:24:02] laisee : and c++ will be faster
[2016-12-12 15:24:10] sleger : a structure is not a program, it doesnt do anything by itself so not sure what i would be running
[2016-12-12 15:24:29] anonymous789 : well that's what i mean
[2016-12-12 15:24:33] sleger : and i wouldnt use a profiler to measure performance, but do some operation on it and time it
[2016-12-12 15:24:38] sleger : and c++ will be faster
[2016-12-12 15:24:43] anonymous789 : you would obviously create a small program to run the data structure you implemented yourself
[2016-12-12 15:25:12] anonymous789 : sleger: if you don't deal with your memory handling perfectly, you'll find the VM optimised the shit out of it and beat your times
[2016-12-12 15:25:32] anonymous789 : there's many examples of this if you google it
[2016-12-12 15:26:15] sleger : i am not arguing with that, if you write shitty c++ code on purpose you can make it slower than java
[2016-12-12 15:26:26] sleger : but that is a stupid way of comparing performance
[2016-12-12 15:26:37] anonymous789 : no i'm not saying write shitty c++ code, im saying write it to the best of your ability in both
[2016-12-12 15:26:58] laisee : good c++ beast good java easily.
[2016-12-12 15:27:37] sleger : anonymous789: look, recent comparison https://blog.famzah.net/2016/09/10/cpp-vs-python-vs-php-vs-java-vs-others-performance-benchmark-2016-q3/
[2016-12-12 15:28:42] anonymous789 : so what about with -O2 optimisation
[2016-12-12 15:28:50] anonymous789 : without*
[2016-12-12 15:29:00] sleger : why would you remove compiler optimization
[2016-12-12 15:29:12] anonymous789 : because we're comparing like-for-like right
[2016-12-12 15:29:13] vincent : co ai la nguoi viet nam khong
[2016-12-12 15:29:31] sleger : optimize your java as much as you want
[2016-12-12 15:29:31] hauruck : is it possible to lend out btc @bitmex, margin funding/lending?
[2016-12-12 15:29:44] sleger : but dont slow down c++ on purpose
[2016-12-12 15:29:47] laisee : no, but u can donate
[2016-12-12 15:30:54] hauruck : ok thanks
[2016-12-12 15:30:56] anonymous789 : anyway i'm not trying to convince you to use java over c++, both great languages, both better than C#
[2016-12-12 15:31:01] sleger : i'm sorry but there is no doubt that java is slower than c++, any good developer (even java ones) will tell you that
[2016-12-12 15:31:03] anonymous789 : that's the point
[2016-12-12 15:31:14] anonymous789 : sleger: that's just not true anymore
[2016-12-12 15:31:22] anonymous789 : but each to their own anyway
[2016-12-12 15:31:23] sleger : well you're changing your point, but c++ is faster than java, by design
[2016-12-12 15:31:46] anonymous789 : sleger: it gives you more freedom, that doesn't make it faster by desgin
[2016-12-12 15:31:47] anonymous789 : design*
[2016-12-12 15:31:50] Rado : there is no even debate about that
[2016-12-12 15:31:54] Rado : it is faster
[2016-12-12 15:31:56] sleger : yes it does, sorry
[2016-12-12 15:32:46] sleger : and if you used the intel compiler on a high perf intel cpu, you can make it much faster than java (more than this perf comparison shows)
[2016-12-12 15:32:47] anonymous789 : lol okay i've done quite a lot of research on this, stubbournness will be stubbourness
[2016-12-12 15:32:56] sleger : indeed it will
[2016-12-12 15:33:38] brouk : as a developer im with sleger on this, java is a mess compared to c++
[2016-12-12 15:33:54] orly : you can probably optimize c++ to run faster than java in most cases, but in the process you make it signifcantly less readable to humans
[2016-12-12 15:34:23] orly : the jvm on the other hand will JIT compile your code after a few iterations, profile continously, inline stuff, optimize in other ways
[2016-12-12 15:34:32] laisee : ... ability to maintain code is important. which is why J2EE/Spring and ll that clunky stuff are not great at all IMHO
[2016-12-12 15:34:35] orly : and none of that hurts the source readability
[2016-12-12 15:34:56] anonymous789 : laisee: C# is inherently ridiculously clunky, can't even be compared to java
[2016-12-12 15:35:09] anonymous789 : laisee: spring etc are just frameworks. you don't have to use them...
[2016-12-12 15:35:25] Rado : probability of fed rate hike for the next 10 meetings is 100%
[2016-12-12 15:35:29] Rado : what a bullshit
[2016-12-12 15:35:40] anonymous789 : Rado: they won't hike
[2016-12-12 15:36:07] Rado : that is what I think as well
[2016-12-12 15:36:10] laisee : orly: JVM and java are good for helping people who don't know how to code optimized apps
[2016-12-12 15:36:14] Rado : or maybe they will do one hike and done
[2016-12-12 15:36:31] anonymous789 : laisee: most people don't = number 1 most used language in the world...
[2016-12-12 15:37:35] orly : laisee: in most use-cases, people can live with say 30% less performance and stop the world GC pauses, in exchange for not worrying about optimizing manually at all
[2016-12-12 15:38:22] laisee : exactly. its "used" by people who don;t really know how hardware or memeory work
[2016-12-12 15:38:53] anonymous789 : laisee: so is c# though...
[2016-12-12 15:39:06] orly : or maybe they know, but they don't want to worry about it because it's just not worth it
[2016-12-12 15:39:16] anonymous789 : the c# and java dev demographic is the same, just that c# is more unnecessarily bloated with functionality
[2016-12-12 15:39:23] laisee : orly: sadly, true
[2016-12-12 15:39:59] anonymous789 : time is money and java makes things easier and quicker to implement than c++ and c#
[2016-12-12 15:40:36] anonymous789 : and requires less constant knowledge updating, although there are updates that add significant amounts of features to the language, it's not on the scale of c#
[2016-12-12 15:40:56] Rado : can you guys discuss something not so boring
[2016-12-12 15:40:57] Rado : :-)
[2016-12-12 15:41:00] anonymous789 : meanwhile i've still not been liquidated
[2016-12-12 15:41:17] brouk : so what is your favorite food?
[2016-12-12 15:41:40] brouk : mine is roast beef with grilled vegetables
[2016-12-12 15:41:43] anonymous789 : i'd prefer not to eat if that were possible
[2016-12-12 15:41:53] laisee : ... mst be the bloated kdb code doing some memory management b4 it wipes u out
[2016-12-12 15:42:20] sleger : lol
[2016-12-12 15:42:43] anonymous789 : i wanna see some longs get REKT, that will be fun
[2016-12-12 15:42:50] anonymous789 : especially the FOMO ones that joined today
[2016-12-12 15:46:06] thiago : we have 425 bots online?
[2016-12-12 15:46:08] anonymous789 : anyone ever wonder what would happen if in say 5-10 years crypto just doesn't work, and never gets mainstream adoption?
[2016-12-12 15:46:10] Rado : anonymous789: it will be fun to see some shorts get REKT as well
[2016-12-12 15:46:27] anonymous789 : Rado: fomo longs getting rekt is more fun, because they were idiots
[2016-12-12 15:46:35] Rado : thiago: these are connections that use API key
[2016-12-12 15:46:41] Rado : they don't have to be "bots"
[2016-12-12 15:46:59] Rado : you can trade manually, but if you are connected with the API key it counts as a bot
[2016-12-12 15:47:25] Rado : anonymous789: not too many of these here I think
[2016-12-12 15:47:35] j8 : websocket connections only i think
[2016-12-12 15:48:04] thiago : what you can use the api for other than bots?
[2016-12-12 15:48:15] j8 : i.e. charting sites would use it
[2016-12-12 15:48:53] j8 : tradingview, cryptowat.ch both have bitmex feeds
[2016-12-12 15:49:03] sleger : recording market data would count
[2016-12-12 15:54:55] laisee : thiago: tracking rekt traders via the liquidation method call
[2016-12-12 15:59:27] thiago : thanks guys :)
[2016-12-12 16:02:38] thiago : so where i buy the fraking bot anyways
[2016-12-12 16:05:06] REKT : Liquidated short on `XRP7D`: Buy 1 @ 0.00000882
[2016-12-12 16:12:02] CaptainDean : nice BTC push
[2016-12-12 16:13:57] Rado : thiago: what kind of bot do you need?
[2016-12-12 16:14:46] thiago : money maker machine model?
[2016-12-12 16:15:07] Rado : that's very general
[2016-12-12 16:15:17] Rado : it will cost you a lot of money
[2016-12-12 16:15:19] Rado : ;-)
[2016-12-12 16:17:04] rapidtrades : 20% correction coming
[2016-12-12 16:18:25] anonymous789 : rapidtrades: i've given up hope lol
[2016-12-12 16:19:44] anonymous789 : so, a general question, do you guys think bitcoin will ever achieve consensus on any hard fork?
[2016-12-12 16:20:04] thiago : Rado: I lost a lot of money already.. so, it would be cheaper lol
[2016-12-12 16:20:10] thiago : have
[2016-12-12 16:24:03] Rado : anonymous789: I hope there is no hard fork
[2016-12-12 16:24:39] anonymous789 : i'm talking about any hard fork ever in the future?
[2016-12-12 16:25:39] minhduc : Viet anh có tren này ko
[2016-12-12 16:26:03] Coconuter : Cheguei nos USA
[2016-12-12 16:26:12] Coconuter : Sorte q deixei meu long aberto
[2016-12-12 16:26:17] Coconuter : Kkkkkkkkk
[2016-12-12 16:26:35] thiago : !!!!!!!!!
[2016-12-12 16:26:36] thiago : bah
[2016-12-12 16:26:38] thiago : que bom
[2016-12-12 16:26:45] thiago : deve ter lucrado uma grana kkkkkk
[2016-12-12 16:26:52] thiago : tava em 100x?
[2016-12-12 16:26:57] Coconuter : Nada ta mesma coisa
[2016-12-12 16:27:07] Coconuter : Pq eu nao dei profit no ultimo high
[2016-12-12 16:27:18] Coconuter : Cara nem to viu so 15x
[2016-12-12 16:27:27] Coconuter : 100 eh muita rabeira
[2016-12-12 16:30:29] rapidtrades : BUILD A WALL
[2016-12-12 16:31:13] DangerandPlay : nessa sala somente falamos ingles, porra
[2016-12-12 16:31:16] DangerandPlay : se liga mane
[2016-12-12 16:31:18] DangerandPlay : :C
[2016-12-12 16:31:23] DangerandPlay : to brincando
[2016-12-12 16:32:37] rapidtrades : El español va a casa!
[2016-12-12 16:35:01] rapidtrades : jk continue :)
[2016-12-12 16:40:12] thiago : rapid losses is happy today lol
[2016-12-12 16:40:22] thiago : I mean, " asuhauhssuahsuah" hue hue br
[2016-12-12 17:12:40] aethlios : btc in 3 1/2 years annual inflation will be 1.73%, usd and eur have at least a 9% average inflation rate of basic money supply M0. This will be the major drive of price up, (if tech of the network is fine with no problems)
[2016-12-12 17:15:27] sleger : M0 inflation is irrelevant
[2016-12-12 17:23:51] rapidtrades : but its relevant for ZEC?
[2016-12-12 17:25:54] rapidtrades : nvm i see the comment u were replying to
[2016-12-12 17:51:12] Derreck : dat BTC pump is epic
[2016-12-12 17:52:48] thomaskikansha : $4 on perpetual swap? no way
[2016-12-12 17:53:16] thomaskikansha : just buying crazy
[2016-12-12 17:55:35] aethlios : 780 resistance if hammered, many stops above 800
[2016-12-12 17:55:47] aethlios : so shorts close now on swap
[2016-12-12 17:58:24] j8 : cheap interest next two periods
[2016-12-12 17:59:29] aethlios : btc yuan premium now 12 usd from 3 yesterday
[2016-12-12 17:59:54] rapidtrades : we're gonna dump soon
[2016-12-12 18:00:50] aethlios : daily pump candle today or tomorrow breaking resistance with 70 usd body up to 850 spot and 900 quarterly
[2016-12-12 18:01:02] rapidtrades : plz
[2016-12-12 18:01:11] rapidtrades : noone wants to hear that BS
[2016-12-12 18:01:30] Tetsuo : ^+1
[2016-12-12 18:01:45] rapidtrades : it look 25 days for bitcoin to climb $70 to here
[2016-12-12 18:01:59] rapidtrades : it's not gonna jump $70
[2016-12-12 18:02:04] sleger : btcjpy going for 100k, nothing can stop it
[2016-12-12 18:02:19] rapidtrades : yeah pretty sure it will be stoppe
[2016-12-12 18:02:22] rapidtrades : d
[2016-12-12 18:02:29] thomaskikansha : I see no real resistance above 780
[2016-12-12 18:02:33] CrazyAlfy : Has anyone looked at the leaderboard lately?
[2016-12-12 18:04:05] sleger : on nov 25th the insurance fund went up 80btc
[2016-12-12 18:04:22] sleger : was that the zec rekt ?
[2016-12-12 18:04:32] j8 : trollboxer :(
[2016-12-12 18:04:33] thomaskikansha : yes
[2016-12-12 18:04:40] aethlios : sleger: zcash whale margin call profits
[2016-12-12 18:04:52] thomaskikansha : 4.3K liquidation
[2016-12-12 18:06:49] sleger : he had a huge maintenance margin because of his position size, he got really screwed
[2016-12-12 18:07:00] sleger : but now that insurance part is tied to zec though
[2016-12-12 18:07:52] rapidtrades : i think he was responsible for the 30% discount
[2016-12-12 18:08:01] rapidtrades : he kept selling as we were going down
[2016-12-12 18:08:11] rapidtrades : prolly with his profits, greedy idiot
[2016-12-12 18:08:36] rapidtrades : wait are we talking about troll boxer?
[2016-12-12 18:10:12] sleger : himself
[2016-12-12 18:13:13] rapidtrades : WHAT
[2016-12-12 18:15:01] j8 : what
[2016-12-12 18:15:10] rapidtrades : j8: wat?
[2016-12-12 18:15:16] j8 : you started it