This is a mirror of the original BitMEX trollbox archive that used to be online here.
BitMEX disabled their archive after the DDOS attack so I have decided to make my mirror publicly available.

Well now, a few days after I made this mirror available to the public, the original archive from BitMEX is online again.
But since it is still limited (neutered to the last few hundred messages) I will keep my FULL mirror alive.

You have access to more than 50 million trollbox posts. This is more than 7 gigabyte of data hosted on a $5 server so please be patient or consider a donation

<<  >>  English  中文  Русский  한국어  日本語  Español  Français 
[2016-10-25 13:56:24] aethlios : did they say what time at 28th it starts?
[2016-10-25 13:57:08] martinium : no idea
[2016-10-25 13:59:35] REKT : Liquidated long on `XMR7D`: Sell 2280 @ 0.009492
[2016-10-25 13:59:35] REKT : Liquidated long on `XMR7D`: Sell 169 @ 0.009488
[2016-10-25 14:00:51] aethlios : btc bullish and all serious coins getting crashed except the magic zcash which still makes new dummy ATH
[2016-10-25 14:01:35] Kalman : aethlios: zcash is only a future yet
[2016-10-25 14:02:17] aethlios : zcashmania.
[2016-10-25 14:02:30] Kalman : its huge question if people take that much money in the hand
[2016-10-25 14:02:44] Kalman : at launch
[2016-10-25 14:03:49] aethlios : serious buyers will wait 1 year after touching zcash
[2016-10-25 14:04:39] aethlios : if zcash fails (many things can go shitty) then monero is the only game in town.
[2016-10-25 14:05:02] aethlios : for black markets i mean.
[2016-10-25 14:05:53] habibi : if not then zcash will be only game in town for anonimity
[2016-10-25 14:06:10] habibi : holy grail :)
[2016-10-25 14:06:47] aethlios : we don't know if their new system works.
[2016-10-25 14:06:58] habibi : so far it works,testnet been there for months
[2016-10-25 14:09:42] REKT : Liquidated short on `ZECZ16`: Buy 4 @ 0.243750
[2016-10-25 14:10:03] mjones : damn zcash going up still
[2016-10-25 14:10:08] habibi : mjones: u short?
[2016-10-25 14:10:10] mjones : XRP holding strong too. rest of the coins going to shit
[2016-10-25 14:10:22] mjones : i have not touched zcash yet. 2x is too low
[2016-10-25 14:10:25] mjones : give me like 10x
[2016-10-25 14:10:43] habibi : thats funny
[2016-10-25 14:11:35] mjones : .25 to .5 is 200% ROE
[2016-10-25 14:12:19] mjones : i'll see how things are on friday
[2016-10-25 14:12:41] jose : with 10x on ZEC, you liquidate just with the spread
[2016-10-25 14:13:16] mjones : yeah i dont know why anyone is trading zec
[2016-10-25 14:13:48] mjones : 2x and .25 and you gotta wait till friday and hope some legit exchange adds it
[2016-10-25 14:14:17] habibi : this is what we do here on all coins right? speculation
[2016-10-25 14:14:35] aethlios : bitmex could place a cap at 0.5, and remove the cap 1 week prior to expiration. so more people will trade and short it.
[2016-10-25 14:14:43] mjones : zec is hardcore though.
[2016-10-25 14:15:14] habibi : aethlios: more inside regulations ! more
[2016-10-25 14:15:43] aethlios : any bitmex here?? place a cap to zcash so people can short, remove the cap 1 week pior to expiration since then volumes at spot will exist.
[2016-10-25 14:16:25] aethlios : why not a cap?? people can trade then safely. not afraid of manipulation.
[2016-10-25 14:16:54] BitMEX_Sam : Because adding a cap is manipulation by the exchange to benefit shorters.
[2016-10-25 14:17:04] habibi : i guess u are short and ur liquidation is around 0.5
[2016-10-25 14:18:45] habibi : cut ur losses or be ready for potential liquidation
[2016-10-25 14:19:43] mjones : if 1 ZEC is $300 then that would be a million dollar market cap on the first day. 2 million on the second day
[2016-10-25 14:20:00] habibi : 100 coins timex 300$ is 1 milion :D?
[2016-10-25 14:20:03] habibi : times*
[2016-10-25 14:20:07] mjones : 3000 coins
[2016-10-25 14:20:13] mjones : 125,000 first 34 days
[2016-10-25 14:20:19] habibi : eh
[2016-10-25 14:20:19] mjones : i dunno how many are mined the first day
[2016-10-25 14:20:32] mjones : i just divided to get average per day
[2016-10-25 14:20:32] habibi : so why u are trying to guess first day cap at x price
[2016-10-25 14:21:02] habibi : there will be ~100 coins minder at first day
[2016-10-25 14:21:06] habibi : mined*
[2016-10-25 14:21:55] mjones : i'm gonna guess people will be on bitcointalk offering to sell 0.25 ZEC for .4 BTC or something crazy
[2016-10-25 14:23:01] DangerandPlay : anyone got a prediction for ETH price one month from now, given zcash imminent arrival./....
[2016-10-25 14:23:43] DangerandPlay : i think it could reach 0.012...
[2016-10-25 14:23:45] Kalman : DangerandPlay: what are you willing to pay?
[2016-10-25 14:24:10] DangerandPlay : i'm just curious.
[2016-10-25 14:24:42] Kalman : it has its price!
[2016-10-25 14:24:43] habibi : DangerandPlay: be careful with eth, it can be still kept high as there is not that far away from pos for eth and there are definitely some big whales in game
[2016-10-25 14:25:25] DangerandPlay : thanks for tip @habibi
[2016-10-25 14:28:25] aethlios : habibi: no position on zcash
[2016-10-25 14:29:04] habibi : aethlios: nice, what do u think about capping btc price on all exchanges at 700 so we can short there?
[2016-10-25 14:29:52] aethlios : habibi: so is the same? said remove cap 1 week prior to expiration
[2016-10-25 14:30:15] habibi : why 7 days instead for example 10 and 2 hours?
[2016-10-25 14:31:01] aethlios : let the market adjust to spot
[2016-10-25 14:31:26] Rado : ZEC will be a very nice short after open
[2016-10-25 14:31:48] aethlios : that's why you avoid the "noice" of first month, and traders can increase open positions
[2016-10-25 14:32:21] habibi : aethlios: awsome, why not cap minimum price at 0.5 btc?
[2016-10-25 14:32:53] habibi : if u want to avoid anything just don't trade it ffs
[2016-10-25 14:34:01] aethlios : cap 1 btc, but just place a cap so shorters can feel safe.
[2016-10-25 14:34:16] habibi : are u serious?
[2016-10-25 14:34:18] Rado : aethlios: you are kidding right?
[2016-10-25 14:34:26] Rado : it's free market man
[2016-10-25 14:34:46] habibi : so longers will take risk but shorters not? u think anyone would buy then
[2016-10-25 14:34:55] Rado : no socialist bullshit trying to control the market
[2016-10-25 14:35:02] aethlios : longs have already a floor zero, shorters don't have a cap
[2016-10-25 14:37:08] habibi : :D
[2016-10-25 14:38:23] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 170 @ 0.01723
[2016-10-25 14:38:23] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 200 @ 0.01723
[2016-10-25 14:38:23] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 3 @ 0.01716
[2016-10-25 14:39:22] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 1 @ 0.01715
[2016-10-25 14:40:52] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 839 @ 0.01711
[2016-10-25 14:42:18] laisee : ETH is died
[2016-10-25 14:43:42] mjones : yeah. only times it was lower was the dao hack and bitfinex hack
[2016-10-25 14:43:53] XXXX : aethlios: then stop whining and go long if all the market parameters are aligned to help long.
[2016-10-25 14:44:11] laisee : why 0.25 getting hit in ZEC market but 0.249999 still in order book?
[2016-10-25 14:45:53] oxandro : the rock trading announce zec trading on 28
[2016-10-25 14:47:15] mjones : wtf is that
[2016-10-25 14:47:20] mjones : the rock?
[2016-10-25 14:47:45] jose : dwayne jhonsson is trading ETC ?
[2016-10-25 14:47:49] habibi : laisee: coz someone put 1 qty sell order there
[2016-10-25 14:48:38] mjones : why is bitmex hyping ZEC in a blog post
[2016-10-25 14:48:49] laisee : habibi: i must be dumb ... but why matching above displayed order book price?
[2016-10-25 14:48:54] mjones : could be good for more exposure i suppose since they are already trading ZEC
[2016-10-25 14:49:01] habibi : last traded price is 0.25
[2016-10-25 14:49:22] REKT : Liquidated long on `XRP7D`: Sell 58711 @ 0.00001340
[2016-10-25 14:49:40] laisee : exactly. why didn't 0.249999 get taken?
[2016-10-25 14:50:11] habibi : laise watch orderbook
[2016-10-25 14:50:16] Rado : might be cached
[2016-10-25 14:50:29] habibi : ups, didnt want to take orders from the book
[2016-10-25 14:50:34] mjones : big zec wall put up. go get long people
[2016-10-25 14:50:50] habibi : just to show u someone can put sell order after 0.25 got hitted
[2016-10-25 14:51:16] laisee : someone got a call from their broker
[2016-10-25 14:51:37] Rado : FCT is the only shit coin that is green
[2016-10-25 14:51:53] chromaticcr1 : laisee: well in here we only got email instead of call and sms ;)
[2016-10-25 14:53:13] laisee : chromaticcr1: no ticker tape either ... :-(
[2016-10-25 14:54:27] mjones : FCT total supply has been the same for a very long time. mainly in strong hands
[2016-10-25 14:54:44] mjones : when the time comes, that will be a great long
[2016-10-25 14:55:53] laisee : i read the coin name as "FEKT"
[2016-10-25 14:57:19] mjones : well time to go to work. can't play shitcoins any more and will just stay in my btc long
[2016-10-25 14:57:43] mjones : eth trying to bounce
[2016-10-25 15:06:13] mjones : Dash fell a bit
[2016-10-25 15:07:51] Boontjie : Any news on whether we will get a bitcoin future again?
[2016-10-25 15:10:12] Kalman : Boontjie: XBTUSD not fine?!
[2016-10-25 15:19:16] Boontjie : Its a swap. I just want to long and sleep, no funding
[2016-10-25 15:19:35] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 1581 @ 0.01699
[2016-10-25 15:19:39] martinium : the cash flow payments aka funding on swaps can be a killer
[2016-10-25 15:19:49] martinium : Boontjie: I kind of agree with you
[2016-10-25 15:20:16] martinium : Boontjie: but the fact it's perpetual also helps compared to futures that might expire at an inconvenient time
[2016-10-25 15:20:31] Boontjie : Sure, but I would get out before
[2016-10-25 15:20:55] Boontjie : I may then go over to the swap for a short while till it settled
[2016-10-25 15:20:58] Kalman : Boontjie: future isn't for free either
[2016-10-25 15:21:01] wurstgelee : why not keep perpetual and add quarterlies as futures again?
[2016-10-25 15:21:08] wurstgelee : doesnt have to be either or
[2016-10-25 15:21:30] Boontjie : wurstgelee: This is what I am going for
[2016-10-25 15:21:48] wurstgelee : there no downside imo.
[2016-10-25 15:21:59] wurstgelee : *is
[2016-10-25 15:22:06] Boontjie : wurstgelee: You spread the liquidity, the only downside
[2016-10-25 15:22:17] Boontjie : And mark price shenanigans
[2016-10-25 15:22:19] kogroken : liquidity will be worse in both
[2016-10-25 15:23:01] wurstgelee : now u spread liquidity with JPY futures....
[2016-10-25 15:23:03] Kalman : kogroken: a wide spread mey attract market makers
[2016-10-25 15:23:14] Kalman : *may
[2016-10-25 15:23:57] wurstgelee : sooner or later, people who want xbtusd-based futures will move or have to move
[2016-10-25 15:24:04] wurstgelee : if things stay the way they are
[2016-10-25 15:24:22] wurstgelee : doesnt help with liquidity as well...
[2016-10-25 15:26:58] wurstgelee : on a sidenote: thank you eth, keep on dying
[2016-10-25 15:27:00] wurstgelee : =)
[2016-10-25 15:27:22] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 75 @ 0.01688
[2016-10-25 15:28:36] wurstgelee : zcash .25
[2016-10-25 15:52:47] Velancry : Will a position only be liquidated if the mark price reach the Liq. price or is it based on Last Price at bitmex?
[2016-10-25 15:53:10] dasdfasdf : mark
[2016-10-25 15:54:11] Velancry : dasdfasdf: Ok thanks.
[2016-10-25 16:00:39] wurstgelee : Velancry: except for zec where mark=last price for now
[2016-10-25 16:00:50] wurstgelee : not really an exception tho
[2016-10-25 16:10:35] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 1692 @ 0.01690
[2016-10-25 16:19:00] Fuck : Zcash is too buble dont you think?
[2016-10-25 16:19:18] Fuck : I mean ZET
[2016-10-25 16:20:25] Fuck : There is no such price coin even there is goodtechnology
[2016-10-25 16:20:40] BitMEX_Greg : Fuck: Could be a bubble, but I would say most coins are
[2016-10-25 16:20:50] habibi : u remember eth and expanse correlation in first months of eth shot up? i guess we will see kinda same between zcash and zcoin
[2016-10-25 16:21:23] Fuck : Yes I think so too
[2016-10-25 16:21:40] habibi : zcoin is kinda scammy anyway but who will care, markets are blind here sometimes
[2016-10-25 16:22:07] Fuck : Haha we can be good friends~
[2016-10-25 16:23:23] BTCDJS : Fuck: is this? I'm just going to take your name next time I want to swear
[2016-10-25 16:23:34] BTCDJS : damn. didn't work
[2016-10-25 16:24:12] Fuck : Who cares~
[2016-10-25 16:24:31] BTCDJS : Fuck: you
[2016-10-25 16:25:46] BTCDJS : does anybody give a @Fuck
[2016-10-25 17:19:12] AudibleScience : Fuck: WTF!
[2016-10-25 17:39:48] wurstgelee : i have .2 fucks to give atm
[2016-10-25 17:40:00] wurstgelee : BTCDJS: it's not a whole fuck but it's a starter
[2016-10-25 17:42:09] BTCDJS : fuck it. just save your fucks for later
[2016-10-25 17:50:41] wurstgelee : if u think that fuck is funny, fuck yourself and save your money
[2016-10-25 17:50:45] wurstgelee : :D
[2016-10-25 19:07:04] RocketScience : fuck
[2016-10-25 19:12:49] martinium : is there a way to see userlist of trollbox?
[2016-10-25 19:15:24] justinlooking : nope
[2016-10-25 19:15:41] justinlooking : u could enumerate the names of people that have spoken from api /chat
[2016-10-25 19:16:50] martinium : wonder when xbtusd is going to start rising some more. All things are pointing to a move towards and above $800
[2016-10-25 19:18:56] BitMEX_Greg : martinium: I don't believe we publish that data
[2016-10-25 19:19:49] BitMEX_Greg : martinium: With CNY devaluing day on day and the premium starting to increase, I don't doubt we will see a huge rise soon
[2016-10-25 19:21:03] habibi : this is the thing that annoys me right now,everyone is bullish
[2016-10-25 19:23:16] BitMEX_Greg : Why is that annoying? Are you short?
[2016-10-25 19:23:42] sleger : no, but if everyone is bullish and long it's gonna crash
[2016-10-25 19:24:57] habibi : BitMEX_Greg: u can check if i am
[2016-10-25 19:25:17] habibi : sleger: yep
[2016-10-25 19:25:22] BitMEX_Greg : haha
[2016-10-25 19:25:39] BitMEX_Greg : Well it needs new funds coming in
[2016-10-25 19:25:59] BitMEX_Greg : if everyone is leveraged and cashed out then it won't be able to move up more
[2016-10-25 19:26:52] sleger : if only we could trade BTC/insults we'd have unlimited supply of money around here, with rapidtrades
[2016-10-25 19:28:34] BitMEX_Greg : new coin request Sleger?
[2016-10-25 19:41:29] martinium : haha
[2016-10-25 19:41:41] martinium : I trade the chart and it screams bullish
[2016-10-25 19:42:02] martinium : fundamentals also bullish
[2016-10-25 19:42:54] martinium : Global Currencies all racing to devalue to compete. Near zero and negative rates in many places. Bitcoin is a better store of value than gold as it is also more useful for commerce.
[2016-10-25 19:43:04] martinium : All in due time
[2016-10-25 19:44:20] martinium : sleger: the contrarian in you says we go nowhere due to all the bulls. Just remember that the market doesn't care about my bias or yours price will move wherever the demand takes it.
[2016-10-25 19:44:34] martinium : since price*
[2016-10-25 19:45:53] BTCDJS : ooh this is going to be good. Rubs hands together.
[2016-10-25 19:54:45] martinium : lol
[2016-10-25 20:14:27] sleger : XBTUSD -80267 122.6239 XBT 654.86 654.58 xxxx.xx 3.2116 XBT (Cross) 0.0531 XBT (1.73%)
[2016-10-25 20:14:47] sleger : anyone quickly sees why this 122btc position requires 3.2btc of margin ?
[2016-10-25 20:19:40] BitMEX_Greg : sleger: Might be including some unrealised gains perhaps
[2016-10-25 20:19:43] Kalman : what is the risk limit
[2016-10-25 20:20:12] sleger : Kalman: ahah well done
[2016-10-25 20:20:16] mjones : damn, the 1 hour i was busy at work xmr and eth tanked and bounced
[2016-10-25 20:20:25] sleger : i had it on 300
[2016-10-25 20:20:31] BitMEX_Greg : sleger: The base risk limit is 200 xbt double check if you are on higher
[2016-10-25 20:20:32] BitMEX_Greg : ah
[2016-10-25 20:20:36] BitMEX_Greg : FYI: https://www.bitmex.com/app/riskLimits
[2016-10-25 20:20:46] Kalman : sleger: send you a bill ;)
[2016-10-25 20:21:04] sleger : BitMEX_Greg: maybe that should automatically go down if position is reduced below the threshold
[2016-10-25 20:21:16] sleger : as there is no reason to risk more for a user who reduced his risk
[2016-10-25 20:21:47] BitMEX_Greg : sleger: Yeah but it becomes more complicated then (if someone is teetering back and forth between the risk limits for example)
[2016-10-25 20:22:03] sleger : XBTUSD -83267 127.1837 XBT 654.87 654.70 xxxx.xx 3.3092 XBT (Cross) 0.0327 XBT (1.03%)
[2016-10-25 20:22:10] sleger : although I reduced it back to 200
[2016-10-25 20:23:06] sleger : BitMEX_Greg: I would be happy to confirm the risk increase again, but for most users it would be better to have it automatic I believe. So why is my position still using 3btc of collateral ?
[2016-10-25 20:23:21] BitMEX_Greg : I'm finding out
[2016-10-25 20:23:35] BitMEX_Greg : https://www.bitmex.com/app/isolatedMargin
[2016-10-25 20:23:39] sleger : I pasted each time the unrealised, it's tiny.
[2016-10-25 20:23:48] BitMEX_Greg : `Cross Margin, also known as “Spread Margin” is a margin method that utilises the full amount of funds in the Available Balance to avoid liquidations. Any Realised PNL from other positions can aid in adding margin on a losing position.`
[2016-10-25 20:24:13] sleger : doesnt answer the question
[2016-10-25 20:24:20] BitMEX_Greg : I need to double check this from Sam or Wally. Perhaps it is using the full amount in your available balance
[2016-10-25 20:24:26] BitMEX_Greg : Yeah I need to double check for you
[2016-10-25 20:24:35] sleger : my available balance is way higher
[2016-10-25 20:24:45] BitMEX_Greg : Yeah, I am not sure what the backend calc is here
[2016-10-25 20:25:04] sleger : my guess: when you reduce the max position it doesnt adjust back the margin
[2016-10-25 20:25:41] BitMEX_Sam : sleger: It does not automatically move it back down, but in the event of a liquidation the risk limit is adjusted to its minimum, then liquidation is re-run only if necessary
[2016-10-25 20:26:19] habibi : sleger: just changed to fixed and back to cross
[2016-10-25 20:26:23] habibi : change*
[2016-10-25 20:26:37] sleger : habibi: that worked
[2016-10-25 20:26:48] sleger : XBTUSD -83268 127.1869 XBT 654.87 654.69 xxxx.xx 1.4022 XBT (Cross) 0.0343 XBT (2.70%)
[2016-10-25 20:27:09] BitMEX_Sam : :+1: It assigns your profit to the position automatically.
[2016-10-25 20:35:36] bernx : BitMEX_Sam: fundng 1% per day?
[2016-10-25 20:36:01] BitMEX_Sam : bernx: Which contract?
[2016-10-25 20:36:08] bernx : XBTUSD
[2016-10-25 20:36:35] bernx : For two day Im lose about 5% lol
[2016-10-25 20:37:03] wurstgelee : if u are long, u paid a lot of funding for longs the last 2 days, thats correct
[2016-10-25 20:37:26] bernx : lol
[2016-10-25 20:37:34] wurstgelee : i wish ;)
[2016-10-25 20:37:51] bernx : And why then funding rate @0.14%?
[2016-10-25 20:38:19] bernx : even if every 8hours, there is about 1%, not even close to 5%
[2016-10-25 20:38:23] sleger : as long as you find it funny
[2016-10-25 20:38:32] BitMEX_Sam : Funding is trending down because XBTUSD is trading closer to spot
[2016-10-25 20:38:45] wurstgelee : bernx: it went down just recently
[2016-10-25 20:38:53] BitMEX_Sam : But you can see that for some time it was trading quite high above, which is why funding went up.
[2016-10-25 20:40:33] bernx : Ok. So, there was foe xample
[2016-10-25 20:40:40] bernx : 0.8 BTC long for 2 days
[2016-10-25 20:40:53] bernx : Funding history was 1.125% dayly
[2016-10-25 20:41:04] bernx : Ill lost about 0.06 BTC for funding
[2016-10-25 20:41:07] bernx : wtf?
[2016-10-25 20:41:28] sleger : that was a while ago ?
[2016-10-25 20:42:01] bernx : 24/10 15:00 my balance was 1.0293
[2016-10-25 20:42:07] bernx : For now there is 0.941
[2016-10-25 20:42:40] bernx : In open position was only 0.8BTC
[2016-10-25 20:43:11] BitMEX_Sam : Yes, funding has been quite high lately due to the pump
[2016-10-25 20:43:29] bernx : Was 1.125%
[2016-10-25 20:43:36] bernx : It's not about 8% mate
[2016-10-25 20:43:54] BitMEX_Sam : It's quoted per 8 hours, max 0.375%
[2016-10-25 20:44:07] bernx : Yes, and daily 1.125%
[2016-10-25 20:44:17] BitMEX_Sam : It's on position size, not underlying equity.
[2016-10-25 20:44:22] BitMEX_Greg : bernx: That occured only 1 day however, where all 3 periods ere 0.375%
[2016-10-25 20:44:35] BitMEX_Greg : It has since dropped down
[2016-10-25 20:45:18] bernx : So, there is I'm idiot, but then how 0.375% every 8 hours cut my depo for ~8% for 2 days
[2016-10-25 20:45:50] bernx : According to funding day table there is 0.375/1.125 funding
[2016-10-25 20:46:16] BitMEX_Greg : The rates are only every 8 hours
[2016-10-25 20:46:24] BitMEX_Greg : that Daily rate is just there for comparison
[2016-10-25 20:46:30] lockhedge : bernx: 8% of what? 8% of your position, of your balance?
[2016-10-25 20:46:57] sleger : "BitMEX_Sam: It's on position size, not underlying equity."
[2016-10-25 20:47:37] bernx : 0.8 BTC in position, 0.08 BTC for funding
[2016-10-25 20:47:43] bernx : So about 10% for 2 days, lol
[2016-10-25 20:47:54] bernx : Not worth even with grow market
[2016-10-25 20:48:28] BitMEX_Greg : bernx: We haven't had 10% funding over 2 days. The max it has been is 1.125% which occurred 1 day
[2016-10-25 20:48:56] bernx : So how it all happen?
[2016-10-25 20:49:22] BitMEX_Greg : bernx: let me check your account
[2016-10-25 20:49:32] manchstr_untd1 : greg, you are forgetting that leverage increases funding. so 1% a day at 20x leverage is actually 20% equity in funding costs
[2016-10-25 20:49:47] bernx : hm
[2016-10-25 20:49:57] BitMEX_Greg : manchstr_untd1: He said his position size was 0.8 BTC
[2016-10-25 20:49:59] bernx : Accoding 1% per day for leverage, so then rihgt
[2016-10-25 20:50:19] BTCDJS : fucking bitsamp.
[2016-10-25 20:50:42] BitMEX_Greg : bernx: Are you referring to your margin assigned to the position OR your total notional?
[2016-10-25 20:50:49] BitMEX_Greg : when you say 0.8 BTC
[2016-10-25 20:50:57] bernx : 2016-10-25 15:00:00 RealisedPNL -0.0710 XBT
[2016-10-25 20:50:59] bernx : To this
[2016-10-25 20:51:26] BitMEX_Greg : bernx: Ok but are you comparing this to your margin or to your position size?
[2016-10-25 20:51:54] martinium : if they fee was 0.375% every 8 hours always that means a trader would pay 7.875% per week in funding fees!
[2016-10-25 20:51:57] bernx : If Ill pay 1.125% per every leverage then it's all correct
[2016-10-25 20:52:24] martinium : guess they don't want long term longs on here
[2016-10-25 20:52:29] bernx : Due If position was about 0.8BTC and there was used x10, then ill correct
[2016-10-25 20:52:40] bernx : *all fine
[2016-10-25 20:52:53] BitMEX_Sam : This is the highest the funding has been for some time, see the history at https://www.bitmex.com/app/fundingHistory and click XBTUSD
[2016-10-25 20:53:04] BitMEX_Sam : It is normally much lower.
[2016-10-25 20:53:18] martinium : getting raped by the fees slowly
[2016-10-25 20:53:25] martinium : every 8 hours
[2016-10-25 20:53:26] martinium : lol
[2016-10-25 20:53:27] BitMEX_Greg : martinium: They are not fees
[2016-10-25 20:53:32] martinium : sorry the funding rate
[2016-10-25 20:53:34] BitMEX_Greg : They are swapped between longs and shorts
[2016-10-25 20:53:35] martinium : :-p
[2016-10-25 20:53:40] BitMEX_Greg : If you are short then you can earn it
[2016-10-25 20:53:43] martinium : yeah shorts are making a killing
[2016-10-25 20:53:51] sleger : well the price went up dummy
[2016-10-25 20:53:52] martinium : if they market stays sideways
[2016-10-25 20:53:58] martinium : the*
[2016-10-25 20:54:07] sleger : if the market is sideways then the funding becomes close to zero
[2016-10-25 20:54:53] BitMEX_Greg : Yes
[2016-10-25 20:55:07] BitMEX_Greg : I just calculated the funding over the past month, it has been a total of 5.44%
[2016-10-25 20:55:21] BitMEX_Greg : Whereas Bitcoin has moved up 8.7% in the same period
[2016-10-25 20:55:42] manchstr_untd1 : thats still like 60% of your gains gone to funding
[2016-10-25 20:55:51] sleger : so in summary you invented a system where noone can make money, except the exchange collecting fees ? ;) @BitMEX_Greg
[2016-10-25 20:57:02] manchstr_untd1 : plus, of course, fees and funding are always multiplied by leverage. so someone on 30x is gonna have a hell of a surprise when they think the fee was .37% and their equity goes down by over 10%... in eight hours....
[2016-10-25 20:57:35] BitMEX_Greg : manchstr_untd1: I'm always surprised by this point. I don't understand why people think they only pay fees on the margin amount
[2016-10-25 20:58:28] BitMEX_Greg : I don't think in any market, Bitcoin or otherwise, there is an exchange or broker where you pay fees not on the notional but on the amount you are putting up as margin, and if you are then the fee is going to be higher as a reflection of that
[2016-10-25 20:58:42] lockhedge : sleger: you aren't making any money on your 83k short ;)
[2016-10-25 20:59:21] manchstr_untd1 : im not suggesting that fees should be paid on the margin and not the notational. im saying 10% "fee" in equity at 30x for 8 hours of a position is rediculous. im sure we could all agree.
[2016-10-25 20:59:29] BitMEX_Greg : sleger: Traders can always exit before funding, there's always a market for scalps
[2016-10-25 20:59:57] BitMEX_Greg : manchstr_untd1: Funding is not a fee for a start.
[2016-10-25 21:00:05] sleger : manchstr_untd1: so is paying a foot-punching ball idiot millions per year
[2016-10-25 21:00:11] manchstr_untd1 : whether it goes to bitmex or shorts doesn'
[2016-10-25 21:00:15] manchstr_untd1 : doesnt matter to a long
[2016-10-25 21:00:47] martinium : it's expensive is all
[2016-10-25 21:00:50] sleger : well it does matter, cause you have the option to short, but you cant have the option to earn the taker trading fee
[2016-10-25 21:00:52] manchstr_untd1 : a 10% decrease in equity for 8 hours of position is a steep price to pay
[2016-10-25 21:00:54] habibi : at the end its sad that bitmex guys have good intentions ( i guess) and at the end all changes end up with more complication and problems to casual users
[2016-10-25 21:00:55] martinium : prohibitive for a long term short
[2016-10-25 21:01:01] martinium : long term long***
[2016-10-25 21:01:58] martinium : BitMEX_Greg: is the funding from other traders or an institution?
[2016-10-25 21:02:15] BitMEX_Greg : martinium: It's paid between longs and shorts
[2016-10-25 21:02:25] BitMEX_Greg : so shorts receive the funding if the funding is positive
[2016-10-25 21:02:30] martinium : then I think it should be a heck of a lot less
[2016-10-25 21:02:34] manchstr_untd1 : it would work better if it was at least dynamic. you pay the fee 8 hours after the TWAP for the price differential anyways. way too long of a lag IMO. should be much more frequent and use real-time rates, not rates from 1/3 a day ago
[2016-10-25 21:03:34] BitMEX_Greg : Well the 8 hour TWAP was introduced to avoid much higher funding spikes
[2016-10-25 21:03:38] BitMEX_Greg : as it suggests, its a TWAP
[2016-10-25 21:04:21] martinium : would dollar weighted make it much more expensive in your tests?
[2016-10-25 21:04:22] BitMEX_Greg : Could be 20%, 0%, 0%, 0%, for an average of 5%
[2016-10-25 21:04:25] lockhedge : BitMEX_Greg: but the TWAP is from hour -16 to hour -8, it's not a dynamic 8h TWAP
[2016-10-25 21:04:27] manchstr_untd1 : yeah which means im paying for the difference between spot and mark as it was a long time ago, not as it is. and much higher funding spikes are ignored if there's a cap anyways
[2016-10-25 21:05:03] BitMEX_Greg : lockhedge: Problem with a dynamic one is then you don't know what you are going to be paying or receiving
[2016-10-25 21:05:24] BitMEX_Greg : The cap would have to be higher if the time period was shorter @manchstr_untd1
[2016-10-25 21:05:55] manchstr_untd1 : the cap SHOULD be higher, at least if the goal of the fee is to encourage the spot price to move towards the mark price. as it is, when spot is 3% over mark, a .375% fee aint gonna do shit
[2016-10-25 21:05:58] manchstr_untd1 : as an example
[2016-10-25 21:08:23] manchstr_untd1 : either it should be calculated much more frequently and uncapped in such a way to actually be useful at controlling the spot price, or there should be some other way. i dont think its accomplising its goals as it is. but then again, this is also a volatile time. as you said, funding rates usually aren't high enough to be an issue
[2016-10-25 21:11:25] sleger : it is not so volatile yet
[2016-10-25 21:12:02] sleger : but didnt you say a few min ago " im saying 10% "fee" in equity at 30x for 8 hours of a position is rediculous. im sure we could all agree." and now you want even higher funding ?
[2016-10-25 21:17:50] BitMEX_Greg : Yes this is the problem, if we had more frequent, uncapped funding rates, then you could see it rise to an equivalent 20% or 30% daily funding
[2016-10-25 21:23:22] sleger : why is this a problem
[2016-10-25 21:23:23] wurstgelee : wtf
[2016-10-25 21:23:36] sleger : if this is what people want to pay to get leveraged long
[2016-10-25 21:23:46] wurstgelee : some people like to open a position and not care for days...
[2016-10-25 21:23:46] BitMEX_Greg : But the thing is they don't want to pay
[2016-10-25 21:23:59] sleger : then they wont buy and the price will track the index more
[2016-10-25 21:24:00] wurstgelee : thats imposible with high funding...
[2016-10-25 21:24:01] BitMEX_Greg : It's a balancing act
[2016-10-25 21:24:12] sleger : your duty is to keep the price close to the index
[2016-10-25 21:24:35] BitMEX_Greg : Yeah
[2016-10-25 21:24:52] sleger : you kind of made it clear when you completely changed the product without notice
[2016-10-25 21:24:59] sleger : it had to be done, no choice etc...
[2016-10-25 21:25:24] sleger : if 0.37% funding doesnt keep the swap close to index you have to increase it, one way or another
[2016-10-25 21:26:11] wurstgelee : are there actually people in this trollbox who prefer the current system over classic futures contracts with settlement?
[2016-10-25 21:26:14] wurstgelee : just curious
[2016-10-25 21:26:55] MrRGnome : Not me. I don't mind if mark price is way off index, so long as it present a trading opportunity and not some bullshit liquidations. Futures are a good example of what I like.
[2016-10-25 21:27:18] MrRGnome : But ideally I'd have swap too. I don't see why I wouldn't want both
[2016-10-25 21:27:52] lockhedge : tbh for market making i like the swap. so what others get is maybe more liquidity
[2016-10-25 21:27:56] BitMEX_Greg : We don't want to fragment liquidity too much
[2016-10-25 21:28:29] sleger : if you replace jpy futures with usd futures it doesnt add fragmentation
[2016-10-25 21:28:39] wurstgelee : so why do u chose xbjxbt over xbtusd ....
[2016-10-25 21:28:42] wurstgelee : ha :D
[2016-10-25 21:29:20] sleger : want the truth ? here it is ...
[2016-10-25 21:29:23] sleger : because they want new users that dont speak english so they dont have to answer stupid questions all day in chat
[2016-10-25 21:29:30] BitMEX_Greg : lol
[2016-10-25 21:29:32] MrRGnome : bahahaha
[2016-10-25 21:29:33] wurstgelee : haha
[2016-10-25 21:29:36] wurstgelee : :D :D :D
[2016-10-25 21:29:38] BitMEX_Greg : Nailed it
[2016-10-25 21:30:03] wurstgelee : RUBXBT next
[2016-10-25 21:30:31] MrRGnome : just keep creating arb opportunities and liquidity will create itself.
[2016-10-25 21:31:54] wurstgelee : seriously, not a single XBTUSD futures contract......thats sad :(
[2016-10-25 21:33:04] BitMEX_Greg : We are thinking about something, stay tuned folks
[2016-10-25 21:33:14] wurstgelee : it wouldnt spread liquidity, it would add the liquidity of those who want to trade futures and not swap ;)
[2016-10-25 21:36:02] MrRGnome : If you don't mind me asking, what percent of your userbase would you consider as high leverage traders at risk for liquidations?
[2016-10-25 21:36:46] MrRGnome : I assume you keep track of that kind of stuff to help you assess the durability of your insurance fund as well as your own general risk
[2016-10-25 21:36:49] BitMEX_Greg : wurstgelee: From discussions with market makers, they only have so much margin they want to apply to certain instruments. So while one instrument may have a deep book, another may not be quoted
[2016-10-25 21:37:08] BitMEX_Greg : MrRGnome: Not information I have unfortunately
[2016-10-25 21:37:22] MrRGnome : That's cool, thanks
[2016-10-25 21:38:24] micmix : if it's like other crypto markets, over 90% of users will be high-leverage gamblers
[2016-10-25 21:38:37] lockhedge : BitMEX_Greg: you could allow phantom liquidity with cross instrument OCO orders ;) market makers could post the same liquidity twice, if an order at XBTUSD gets filled, XBTUSD7D gets cancelled
[2016-10-25 21:38:41] sleger : in # of users, not in # of $
[2016-10-25 21:38:52] micmix : yep, in # of users
[2016-10-25 21:39:07] lockhedge : afaik a lot of traditional markets in europe allow phantom liquidity...
[2016-10-25 21:39:14] MrRGnome : that's a really important distinction.
[2016-10-25 21:39:44] MrRGnome : So I assume market makers are the minority but are responsible for most of the volume and aren't highly leveraged
[2016-10-25 21:40:04] MrRGnome : and chronic degenerate gamblers are the majority, getting wrecked by the makers
[2016-10-25 21:40:21] micmix : in % of $ gamblers are probably 20-30%
[2016-10-25 21:40:34] micmix : maybe a bit more
[2016-10-25 21:41:00] MrRGnome : You getting those stats from the woodchipper?
[2016-10-25 21:41:15] lockhedge : arbitrage and directional bots probably make more money than market makers
[2016-10-25 21:41:27] wurstgelee : u dont necessarily get rekt by makers tho. u just need to know when to gamble and when not
[2016-10-25 21:41:29] wurstgelee : ;)
[2016-10-25 21:41:38] habibi : micmix: hey, whats ur opinion about upcoming months in btc price?
[2016-10-25 21:42:33] micmix : I'm slightly long overall
[2016-10-25 21:44:20] micmix : lockhedge: arb not so much, it's difficult now for any substantial amount and counterparty risk too high
[2016-10-25 21:45:32] micmix : as an example see finex, price is way out and no one want to arb it
[2016-10-25 21:47:57] wurstgelee : admins?
[2016-10-25 21:47:59] wurstgelee : https://twitter.com/ZcashNews/status/791031838580043777
[2016-10-25 21:48:13] wurstgelee : there the first possible reference exchange for zcash
[2016-10-25 21:48:14] BitMEX_Greg : interesting
[2016-10-25 21:48:15] wurstgelee : ;)
[2016-10-25 21:48:46] wurstgelee : early pump due to nonexisting supply confirmed ;)
[2016-10-25 21:49:50] lockhedge : micmix: that's true, spot arb trading doesn't really work, but a wider definition like latency arbitrage or volatility trading
[2016-10-25 21:51:03] wurstgelee : https://twitter.com/ZcashNews/status/791031161791377408
[2016-10-25 21:51:13] wurstgelee : shapeshift too
[2016-10-25 21:51:43] wurstgelee : polo will follow soon. great times ahead ;)
[2016-10-25 21:57:07] manchstr_untd1 : up we go
[2016-10-25 21:58:55] Tetsuo : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AdpqgqVdXWs
[2016-10-25 22:03:36] justinlooking : u hungry for xbt utd?
[2016-10-25 22:04:29] Tetsuo : hungry bitcoin wolves will soon be unchained
[2016-10-25 22:13:40] micmix : lockhedge: yeah, all my bots incorporate some of that
[2016-10-25 22:20:38] wurstgelee : go btc :)
[2016-10-25 22:26:31] mjones : short everything but ZEC and BTC
[2016-10-25 22:26:53] wurstgelee : pretty much
[2016-10-25 22:32:28] REKT : Liquidated short on `XBTUSD`: Buy 600 @ 656.75
[2016-10-25 22:32:28] REKT : Liquidated short on `XBTUSD`: Buy 1550 @ 656.44
[2016-10-25 22:32:33] wurstgelee : excellent......
[2016-10-25 22:32:35] wurstgelee : :D
[2016-10-25 22:32:47] BitMEX_Sam : Up it goes
[2016-10-25 22:32:52] wurstgelee : choo choo
[2016-10-25 22:32:57] habibi : Weeeee
[2016-10-25 22:34:31] manchstr_untd1 : up up and away
[2016-10-25 22:34:50] manchstr_untd1 : dangggggg
[2016-10-25 22:35:18] REKT : Liquidated short on `XBTUSD`: Buy 25 @ 658.49
[2016-10-25 22:35:18] REKT : Liquidated short on `XBTUSD`: Buy 10000 @ 658.45
[2016-10-25 22:39:43] mjones : xbj futures sucks. china goes up 2% and xbj on quoine goes up 0.25%
[2016-10-25 22:40:42] habibi : mjones: they reacting with lag sometimes, where u see negative, one can see opportunity
[2016-10-25 22:40:56] BitMEX_Sam : Yes, if they are slow to react that's a great scalp.
[2016-10-25 22:41:10] mjones : true. open a long and hope they catch up
[2016-10-25 22:41:53] habibi : if the price will keep run/stay above previous lvl u can be 100% basically its matter of time when they will
[2016-10-25 22:42:13] habibi : sure*
[2016-10-25 22:43:29] mjones : and then some china bearwhale has a few thousand BTC to knock the price back down
[2016-10-25 23:18:15] mjones : why not just get rid of the XBJ24H
[2016-10-25 23:18:35] mjones : improve liquidity on the 7D
[2016-10-25 23:18:58] sleger : MM is max short
[2016-10-25 23:20:40] lockhedge : sleger: which one and on what instrument?
[2016-10-25 23:21:20] sleger : what mjones said
[2016-10-25 23:21:35] miramm1115 : back on xbj24h if someone needs to long
[2016-10-25 23:21:36] wurstgelee : what mjones and sleger said
[2016-10-25 23:23:40] wurstgelee : lol, nice retrace ;)
[2016-10-25 23:23:43] mjones : china is dumping. see if 4535 CNY provides support or not
[2016-10-25 23:24:22] miramm1115 : price will stabilize @ $666.66
[2016-10-25 23:25:29] mjones : well wtf
[2016-10-25 23:25:36] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 3000 @ 656.17
[2016-10-25 23:25:38] wurstgelee : lolz
[2016-10-25 23:25:48] wurstgelee : loooool
[2016-10-25 23:25:58] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 3000 @ 653.19
[2016-10-25 23:26:02] sleger : lol
[2016-10-25 23:26:08] habibi : hehehe
[2016-10-25 23:26:11] wurstgelee : hahahahahaha
[2016-10-25 23:26:29] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 48500 @ 648.00 **MEGA-REKT** :boom:
[2016-10-25 23:26:29] REKT : Getting chopped to death is fun, everyone should try it!
[2016-10-25 23:26:29] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 8000 @ 647.37
[2016-10-25 23:26:29] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 20000 @ 648.53 **MEGA-REKT** :boom:
[2016-10-25 23:26:29] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 75000 @ 646.96 **EPIC REKT** :unamused: :confounded: :astonished:
[2016-10-25 23:26:32] wurstgelee : wtf
[2016-10-25 23:26:34] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 1000 @ 646.22
[2016-10-25 23:26:34] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 1000 @ 646.08
[2016-10-25 23:26:43] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 190000 @ 645.83 **REKTosaurus** :slot_machine: :moneybag: :fire:
[2016-10-25 23:26:43] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 8000 @ 645.55
[2016-10-25 23:27:14] wurstgelee : any casualties?
[2016-10-25 23:27:16] wurstgelee : ;)
[2016-10-25 23:27:22] wurstgelee : and now bounce for me baby
[2016-10-25 23:27:27] mjones : and xbj7d went up lol
[2016-10-25 23:28:07] manchstr_untd1 : lol wut
[2016-10-25 23:28:12] rapidtrades : who's dumping yo
[2016-10-25 23:28:15] miramm1115 : thanks you for your money :-)
[2016-10-25 23:28:39] mjones : lots of longs called on 0kcoin
[2016-10-25 23:28:39] wurstgelee : thanks for great entry ;)
[2016-10-25 23:30:06] sleger : XBTUSD 11618 11618 0 640.00
[2016-10-25 23:30:21] rapidtrades : what
[2016-10-25 23:30:27] mjones : more fun to trade on okcoin i think. easier to trade these kinds of moves
[2016-10-25 23:30:33] sleger : while at the same time : XBJ7D 5000 -5000 0 69561
[2016-10-25 23:31:07] bernx : what it was?
[2016-10-25 23:31:53] sleger : whis
[2016-10-25 23:32:00] mjones : xbj7d is all over the place
[2016-10-25 23:32:21] rapidtrades : ppl are stupid....we're still $15 below china
[2016-10-25 23:32:22] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBJ7D`: Sell 10000 @ 68502
[2016-10-25 23:32:27] wurstgelee : sleger: haha
[2016-10-25 23:32:29] wurstgelee : n1
[2016-10-25 23:32:31] sleger : MM is gonna lose a bunch here
[2016-10-25 23:32:32] wurstgelee : ;)
[2016-10-25 23:32:39] mjones : and i got rekted
[2016-10-25 23:32:57] lockhedge : sleger: which one and on what instrument? ;)
[2016-10-25 23:33:06] sleger : 7d
[2016-10-25 23:33:24] mjones : quoine is the worst exchange to pick for futures here
[2016-10-25 23:35:00] mjones : 6 minutes after okcoin dumped to its low quoine hits a new low
[2016-10-25 23:35:16] lockhedge : miramm1115: are you only mm'ing at 24h? great timing to enter the market again :)
[2016-10-25 23:35:50] ixess : i got liquidated from a wick and predicted btc perfectly, can i get a refund?
[2016-10-25 23:35:56] rapidtrades : how much are u guys making from MMing?
[2016-10-25 23:36:08] REKT : Liquidated short on `XBTUSD`: Buy 44700 @ 651.52 **MEGA-REKT** :boom:
[2016-10-25 23:36:24] sleger : few millions a year, you ?
[2016-10-25 23:36:33] rapidtrades : 0
[2016-10-25 23:37:13] sleger : long term is less work though
[2016-10-25 23:37:51] sleger : just work for a large fund, manage few hundred millions, if it works, cash in, if it doesnt start again elsewhere
[2016-10-25 23:37:53] miramm1115 : lockhedge: have small bots on all XBJ, trying it out for now
[2016-10-25 23:38:21] dasdfasdf : sleger: What do you MM?
[2016-10-25 23:38:24] sleger : miramm1115: you're the 200 ?
[2016-10-25 23:38:36] miramm1115 : yep
[2016-10-25 23:38:53] sleger : here i just traded with you
[2016-10-25 23:38:53] miramm1115 : 250 on quarterly
[2016-10-25 23:39:00] sleger : bought 200 @ 68932
[2016-10-25 23:39:27] miramm1115 : thanks :-)
[2016-10-25 23:41:57] REKT : Liquidated short on `ZECZ16`: Buy 1 @ 0.250354
[2016-10-25 23:43:41] wurstgelee : and so it begins
[2016-10-25 23:46:39] Tetsuo : XBJZ16 -25555 72200 XBJZ16 19060 71099 thx for instaprofit due to lag@japs
[2016-10-25 23:46:55] justinlooking : so any adl touches from that? or all liqs get bought?