This is a mirror of the original BitMEX trollbox archive that used to be online here.
BitMEX disabled their archive after the DDOS attack so I have decided to make my mirror publicly available.

Well now, a few days after I made this mirror available to the public, the original archive from BitMEX is online again.
But since it is still limited (neutered to the last few hundred messages) I will keep my FULL mirror alive.

You have access to more than 50 million trollbox posts. This is more than 7 gigabyte of data hosted on a $5 server so please be patient or consider a donation

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[2016-10-24 15:46:50] eth2mars : mjones: i lost about five bitcoins
[2016-10-24 15:47:01] moon : not enough margin for what, I was short, and price didn't went to 76718
[2016-10-24 15:47:47] habibi : Kalman: i do accept, i didnt lost anything but still u think index price is bad sollution for swap?
[2016-10-24 15:48:26] Rado : moon: I think BitMEX needs to do a better job at explaining the trigger price for liquidation
[2016-10-24 15:49:08] BitMEX_Greg : Rado: A user's position gets liquidated at the liquidation price
[2016-10-24 15:49:10] Kalman : habibi: everyone should ask them self that question before putting money on the table
[2016-10-24 15:49:18] BitMEX_Greg : moon: Are you sure you were liquidated and not autodeleveraged?
[2016-10-24 15:49:31] habibi : Kalman: could u answer my question first :)?
[2016-10-24 15:50:09] Kalman : habibi: that are the contract conditions
[2016-10-24 15:50:29] eth2mars : mjones: thanks for sharing the screenshot. it was crazy
[2016-10-24 15:50:34] moon : @BitMEX_Greg I got liquidation notice, but you can check and see what happened
[2016-10-24 15:50:36] Rado : BitMEX_Greg: if he was deleveraged his price will not be 76718
[2016-10-24 15:50:38] Rado : correct?
[2016-10-24 15:50:51] Rado : that seems like bankruptcy price
[2016-10-24 15:51:46] Rado : good my stop was outside of that dip
[2016-10-24 15:52:36] BitMEX_Greg : moon: I am checking now. The liquidation email should have provided some clarity however
[2016-10-24 15:53:07] Rado : I agree with sleger, I don't see why use illiquid exchange like Quoine and JPY when there are so many better options
[2016-10-24 15:53:25] Rado : there are 5-6 exchanges now that have decent volume in USD
[2016-10-24 15:54:18] BitMEX_Sam : Rado: XBTJPY is based on Quoine because it is also traded on Quoine
[2016-10-24 15:54:24] Rado : Bitstamp 4.6 Bitfinex 6.1 GDAX 3.2 itBit 2.0 OKCoin 2.8 BTC-eUSD 3.9
[2016-10-24 15:54:49] Rado : BitMEX_Sam: I understand, but you can see that is not good for traders at all
[2016-10-24 15:54:58] moon : You were short 400 contracts of XBJ24H. With 0.5% Maintenance Margin, your liquidation price was 76817 and your bankruptcy price was 77262 (i.e. 0% margin).
[2016-10-24 15:54:59] Rado : no future should be based on one exchange only
[2016-10-24 15:55:00] BitMEX_Sam : I agree this flash-crash behavior is undesirable
[2016-10-24 15:55:17] BitMEX_Sam : We are investigating
[2016-10-24 15:55:28] Rado : even the 2 exchanges on USD futures are not enough
[2016-10-24 15:55:31] BitMEX_Greg : moon: Do you mind sending us a support ticket? I'm looking right now
[2016-10-24 15:55:37] Rado : specially the current two
[2016-10-24 15:55:52] moon : BitMEX_Greg: I'll open now one
[2016-10-24 15:55:52] Rado : bot of them have the lowest volume at times
[2016-10-24 15:56:11] BitMEX_Greg : moon: Thanks
[2016-10-24 15:56:20] sleger : Rado: agree, the USD mix for index is also really bad
[2016-10-24 15:57:03] Rado : I am very interested to know how many traders here hedge on the exchanges
[2016-10-24 15:57:26] Rado : because if this % is very small there is no reason why the index can not have 3-4 exchanges
[2016-10-24 15:57:33] habibi : sleger: u suggest adding finex again?
[2016-10-24 15:57:42] sleger : i never suggested removing it
[2016-10-24 15:57:53] Rado : habibi: look at the list I posted
[2016-10-24 15:57:53] BitMEX_Sam : We have been investigating choices for XBTUSD but we will not reinstate Bitfinex
[2016-10-24 15:58:34] Rado : GDAX and BTCE can easily be added
[2016-10-24 15:58:40] Rado : very steady volume
[2016-10-24 15:58:42] habibi : Rado: still i believe most of exchanges like stamp/gdax/itbit are buying when finex/china is buying
[2016-10-24 15:58:46] sleger : what if it becomes the main USD exchange again and has 3x the volume of others ??
[2016-10-24 15:58:50] habibi : so poor followers
[2016-10-24 15:59:23] Rado : habibi: the point is that a crash on any one single exchange will not affect the index as much if the index is comprised of 3-4 exchanges
[2016-10-24 15:59:25] BitMEX_Sam : sleger: Perhaps then, but their poor track record prevents us from being anything more than deeply suspicious of their price feed
[2016-10-24 15:59:52] BitMEX_Sam : If we were to reinstate it, it is a very slippery slope back to XBX-style dynamic deweighting, which users did not like
[2016-10-24 16:00:21] sleger : yes dont do dynamic deweighting
[2016-10-24 16:00:31] habibi : users like the biggest opportunity to make money, finex price had that
[2016-10-24 16:02:52] martinium : BitMEX_Sam: please have your guys add gdax/bitstamp to the index used for xbtusd. 2 exchanges is nowhere near enough. Should be at least 5.
[2016-10-24 16:03:28] sleger : martinium: bitstamp is 50% of the index already
[2016-10-24 16:04:09] martinium : its okcoin and bitstamp so they need to add gdax in there and kraken
[2016-10-24 16:04:39] moon : BitMEX_Greg: there should be something at your end, the Liquidation orderID is 000000-000...
[2016-10-24 16:04:57] martinium : OKC oin=woodchipper
[2016-10-24 16:05:05] BitMEX_Sam : moon: We have the data, we are looking into it
[2016-10-24 16:05:47] moon : BitMEX_Sam: I know, you also have the coins
[2016-10-24 16:07:32] martinium : xbtce, btce and gdax need to be part of the kaiko index used for xbtusd @BitMEX_Sam hopefully they add these since they are going to not include bitfinex as part of it
[2016-10-24 16:07:41] martinium : I am still surprised people risk trading there
[2016-10-24 16:07:45] martinium : re finex
[2016-10-24 16:19:43] Mm bot : Wtf happened to JPY 3m contract why did my position get liquidated ?
[2016-10-24 16:20:57] BitMEX_Sam : Everyone: We are communicating with Quoine and unraveling what happened, we will update when we have more information.
[2016-10-24 16:20:59] Mm bot : Order is 00000000
[2016-10-24 16:21:15] BitMEX_Sam : Mm bot: All liquidations have null order IDs, that's normal.
[2016-10-24 16:22:25] mjones : Rollback Futures 6 hours
[2016-10-24 16:23:47] RocketScience : Jpy futures are like fukushima now, no one wants to be there
[2016-10-24 16:25:26] RocketScience : Quoine orderbook is still dangerously empty to the downside
[2016-10-24 16:31:20] sleger : did anyone confirm how big the "fat finger" was on quoine ?
[2016-10-24 16:32:18] RocketScience : 500 btc
[2016-10-24 16:33:51] Mm bot : How come recent trade doesn't show any move on JPY ?
[2016-10-24 16:35:11] habibi : 250 btc according to quoine site chart
[2016-10-24 16:35:18] BitMEX_Sam : All contracts use the underlying index for margining & liquidation purposes, so only if the index moves do users get liquidated
[2016-10-24 16:35:48] BitMEX_Sam : This is generally great for offering high leverage and keeping our markets tradeable even if illiquid, but if an indexed market flash-crashes it could cause liqs here
[2016-10-24 16:36:04] RocketScience : 250 btc took out a big wall near the price, then another 250 btc panic sell took it way down
[2016-10-24 16:36:23] sleger : might be much cheaper to reproduce right now
[2016-10-24 16:38:03] habibi : RocketScience: their chart says diffrently http://prntscr.com/cydf0m
[2016-10-24 16:38:07] rapidtrades : u don't see btc/usd flash-crashing
[2016-10-24 16:38:17] rapidtrades : just sayin
[2016-10-24 16:40:31] rapidtrades : not playin
[2016-10-24 16:40:49] RocketScience : i was watching cryptowatch quoine chart
[2016-10-24 16:41:02] RocketScience : it crashed to 47k?
[2016-10-24 16:41:24] RocketScience : that's obfuscated on 5 min chart...but on daily i can see it
[2016-10-24 16:41:31] Mm bot : BitMEX_Sam: are you guys going to rollback that flashcrash that wiped out our JPY long position? I can't even find that flash on crypto watch
[2016-10-24 16:41:58] BitMEX_Sam : Mm bot: We are still investigating, but it appears they have been deleting the data from history
[2016-10-24 16:42:02] sleger : of course not there is no rollback here unless bitmex matching engine doesnt behave expectedly
[2016-10-24 16:42:27] sleger : and here it did, the index price was the one misbehaving
[2016-10-24 16:43:00] rapidtrades : a 33% flas-crash
[2016-10-24 16:43:30] habibi : actually it did, it didnt catch that wick to 47700, so my question is how randomly it is to catch spikes like that
[2016-10-24 16:44:22] Mm bot : sleger: why isn't all the liquidation be visible on the recent trades?
[2016-10-24 16:44:45] Mm bot : everything seems to be "fine"
[2016-10-24 16:45:17] eth2mars : Mm bot: see 4hr chart
[2016-10-24 16:45:24] Mm bot : BitMEX_Sam: deleting data from history, do you mean their site?
[2016-10-24 16:45:30] wurstgelee : BitMEX_Sam: i noticed something odd, not sure if this applies generally: open bitmex in google chrome with external display attached. everythings works. suspend system, wake system up, no external monitor attached this time-> smaller res in x-axis. notifications still show up at "old" absolute coords, therefore unreadable
[2016-10-24 16:45:47] eth2mars : Mm bot: with 1200 btc it crashed to 33%? unbelievable
[2016-10-24 16:45:50] wurstgelee : i only see the left few pixels, rest it "out of bounds"
[2016-10-24 16:46:04] wurstgelee : it obviously still remembers old res and doesnt account for changed res
[2016-10-24 16:46:09] rapidtrades : wurstgelee: dude we're in the middle o smth here
[2016-10-24 16:46:13] wurstgelee : not sure if bitmex or chrome prob tho
[2016-10-24 16:46:32] habibi : wurstgelee: did u try to turn off and on again ur computer? it should work
[2016-10-24 16:46:40] wurstgelee : habibi: lol ofc that works
[2016-10-24 16:46:45] wurstgelee : but that is not the point :)
[2016-10-24 16:46:59] habibi : wurstgelee: try again then maybe u will catch my point
[2016-10-24 16:47:03] wurstgelee : it should be able to detect changed res as it does with everything else but browser notifications
[2016-10-24 16:47:30] wurstgelee : habibi: i get ur point, i do IT for a living... ;)
[2016-10-24 16:47:33] BitMEX_Sam : wurstgelee: You're talking about the native notifications - as in, out of browser?
[2016-10-24 16:47:39] MrRGnome : wurstgelee: it's not a changing res problem.
[2016-10-24 16:47:41] BitMEX_Sam : Or the in-browser notifications we show at the bottom right?
[2016-10-24 16:47:43] wurstgelee : BitMEX_Sam: yep
[2016-10-24 16:47:47] wurstgelee : bottom right
[2016-10-24 16:47:50] wurstgelee : in-browser then
[2016-10-24 16:47:57] BitMEX_Sam : Those are relative to the viewport
[2016-10-24 16:48:03] BitMEX_Sam : If your browser is resized properly they should be visible
[2016-10-24 16:48:21] BitMEX_Sam : if your browser is resized beyond the edges of your screen, well, there's nothing we could do about that
[2016-10-24 16:48:31] wurstgelee : hm...those notifications i can enable per site in brwoser settings?
[2016-10-24 16:48:33] BitMEX_Sam : Mm bot: Yes
[2016-10-24 16:48:33] wurstgelee : which are those?
[2016-10-24 16:48:42] MrRGnome : Yeah not a webdev problem, it's a local issue
[2016-10-24 16:48:43] BitMEX_Sam : wurstgelee: Could you rephrase?
[2016-10-24 16:49:15] wurstgelee : ill make it simple: if i open bitmex first time with a new browser, it ask me if i want to enable npotifications
[2016-10-24 16:49:18] wurstgelee : those
[2016-10-24 16:49:32] wurstgelee : browser in in full screen, both with external and without external display
[2016-10-24 16:49:36] wurstgelee : properly resized
[2016-10-24 16:49:39] wurstgelee : to current res
[2016-10-24 16:49:41] MrRGnome : obviously not
[2016-10-24 16:49:59] BitMEX_Sam : You can click the lock in the url bar to change those settings.
[2016-10-24 16:50:03] wurstgelee : i can go window and fullscreen again...np
[2016-10-24 16:50:27] wurstgelee : BitMEX_Sam: i can enable/disable - but not reposition?
[2016-10-24 16:50:42] BitMEX_Sam : wurstgelee: Assume your laptop display is 1366x768, and your external is 1920x1080, if you disconnect the external display your browser will still be 1920x1080 on a 1366x768 screen
[2016-10-24 16:50:55] BitMEX_Sam : You need to resize the browser to fit your screen. This is not a BitMEX issue
[2016-10-24 16:51:47] wurstgelee : if i go windowed and maximize again, with lower res display, it should be 1366x768 in your example?
[2016-10-24 16:51:51] wurstgelee : otr is it still 1080 then?
[2016-10-24 16:52:04] BitMEX_Sam : If you go windowed & maximize again it should be fine.
[2016-10-24 16:52:09] wurstgelee : thats my point
[2016-10-24 16:52:11] wurstgelee : it isnt
[2016-10-24 16:52:11] wurstgelee : ;)
[2016-10-24 16:52:33] rapidtrades : IT'S FINE
[2016-10-24 16:53:09] BitMEX_Sam : It certainly should be wurstgelee
[2016-10-24 16:53:17] MrRGnome : wurstgelee: it's still a local issue. bitmex can only put notifications where the browser lets it
[2016-10-24 16:53:19] BitMEX_Sam : The styling is relative to your browser viewport. I have tested it just now and it's fine
[2016-10-24 16:53:25] wurstgelee : thats what i assumed.
[2016-10-24 16:53:35] BitMEX_Sam : If the notifications are not visible then there should be other parts of the page that are not visible as well
[2016-10-24 16:53:44] wurstgelee : not really important tho, it's time for a new, clean setup anyways...
[2016-10-24 16:53:46] habibi : BitMEX_Sam: if one will market buy sth taking mark price to upper limit and in meanwhile there will be liquidations/adl what will happen first? buy to level where first liquidation occurs - adl and then rest of buy or whole market buy and then squeeze of adl ?
[2016-10-24 16:54:09] BitMEX_Sam : habibi: Market buys don't affect mark price, except in the case of ZEC
[2016-10-24 16:54:15] habibi : yes.
[2016-10-24 16:54:30] BitMEX_Sam : Entire buy would execute up to limit up, then liquidations if any
[2016-10-24 16:54:35] MrRGnome : wurstgelee: I have had similar things happen on my multimonitor setup during frequent display changes. It's usually a windows thing, as it's still rendering a desktop i can't see or use or otherwise fucking with me.
[2016-10-24 16:54:41] habibi : thats why i asked, i am writing a book " zec futures manipulation for dummies "
[2016-10-24 16:54:56] habibi : ok thanks\
[2016-10-24 16:55:37] wurstgelee : MrRGnome: when in doubt, blame windows.
[2016-10-24 16:55:45] wurstgelee : correct 80-90%
[2016-10-24 16:58:45] MrRGnome : Rule of thumb, if a refresh fixes a local issue, blame chrome or the site. If a reboot fixes it, blame windows.
[2016-10-24 17:07:04] wurstgelee : reboot would maybe fix it. i dont like rebooting more than once a month tho
[2016-10-24 17:07:15] wurstgelee : annoys me 2 much
[2016-10-24 17:08:12] wurstgelee : 4 days. finally.... ;)
[2016-10-24 17:08:28] wurstgelee : *until zcash launch that is
[2016-10-24 17:59:14] BTCDJS : flash crash happened on bitstamp
[2016-10-24 18:01:09] justinlooking : some big sells there... has had good offers recently too
[2016-10-24 18:14:42] justinlooking : so what's all this monkey business going on at quoine?
[2016-10-24 18:20:21] micmix : BitMEX_Sam: Hi Sam! could you please fix hover over Realized PNL in the positions table? it used to show daily realized PNL when you hover over total realized PNL, doesn't work after the latest update
[2016-10-24 18:20:45] BitMEX_Sam : micmix: That is actually intentional as rebalance is no longer present
[2016-10-24 18:20:59] BitMEX_Sam : Let me see if I can get it to show PNL since the last RealizedPNL event
[2016-10-24 18:21:19] micmix : it was showing exactly that afaik
[2016-10-24 18:21:29] BitMEX_Sam : It was, in a sense, because rebalance was daily
[2016-10-24 18:22:00] micmix : yep, you just had to change the text instead of removing this super useful feature ;-)
[2016-10-24 18:22:16] BitMEX_Sam : Well, the underlying data has changed. Let me see what I can do.
[2016-10-24 18:23:16] BitMEX_Sam : The issue is, unrealised PNL now stays unrealised, rather than moving to RPL daily because of rebalance
[2016-10-24 18:23:48] BitMEX_Sam : So your delta day to day is equal to your UPL yesterday - your UPL today. We may be able to add a position row for accounting purposes, but otherwise you can see this in the Wallet page
[2016-10-24 18:25:02] micmix : afaik `realisedPnl` field is PNL since last RealizedPNL event, at least for swaps
[2016-10-24 18:27:10] RocketScience : btc in china...
[2016-10-24 18:28:18] BitMEX_Wally : micmix: The `realisedPnl` field is shown as a pending `RealisedPNL` transaction in the wallet history
[2016-10-24 18:28:41] micmix : yep, that's exactly what I would like to see on hover
[2016-10-24 18:30:20] micmix : it's realized PNL since last RealisedPNL event, very similar to realized PNL since last rebalance when you had rebalance. basically I want to see daily profit of my algos without switching to the wallet page all the time
[2016-10-24 18:40:01] BitMEX_Wally : micmix: ok so this is the daily change in realisedPNL, excluding any unrealisedPNL
[2016-10-24 18:42:17] BitMEX_Wally : If you just want the same amount as shown in the Pending RealisedPNL transaction then we can go back to showing that `realisedPnl` field on hover over
[2016-10-24 18:43:09] rapidtrades : did anyone keep track how much longs lost due to funding in the move from 614 to here
[2016-10-24 18:49:01] rapidtrades : that would be from oct 11th
[2016-10-24 18:50:35] sleger : just look at funding history
[2016-10-24 18:50:59] BitMEX_Greg : Go to the funding history and insert `{"symbol":"XBTUSD"}` in the box @rapidtrades
[2016-10-24 18:51:58] BitMEX_Greg : I see about 2.30% just adding up the funding rates from 11th Oct at 00:00 UTC
[2016-10-24 18:52:16] justinlooking : 2.16%? that sound about right?
[2016-10-24 18:53:35] sleger : thats because the funding is now capped too low
[2016-10-24 18:56:56] justinlooking : what do you think 8hr cap should be?
[2016-10-24 18:57:57] sleger : 1% is good
[2016-10-24 18:58:12] arbitrage001 : shouldnt be capped
[2016-10-24 18:58:20] arbitrage001 : let the market decide
[2016-10-24 18:58:34] sleger : arbitrage001: what about margin when funding is due ?
[2016-10-24 18:58:35] dasdfasdf : What is the thinking otherwise?
[2016-10-24 18:58:46] arbitrage001 : sleger: adl kick in
[2016-10-24 18:58:50] sleger : do you understand why it is capped today ?
[2016-10-24 18:58:51] habibi : yea lets make 1h funding periods instead, as a part of market i am deciding
[2016-10-24 18:59:18] sleger : arbitrage001: no you dont understand the problem
[2016-10-24 19:00:39] habibi : arbitrage001: if market would be the one to decide sometimes i guess we would get auto liquidation of positions down to 50x margin probally, easy to cause system loss which is unacceptable
[2016-10-24 19:01:11] sleger : but actually, however surprisingly, habibi kind of suggested the right solution for this
[2016-10-24 19:01:23] justinlooking : lol wut
[2016-10-24 19:01:30] sleger : cap is there because of maintenance margin, however 8 hours comes from ??? nowhere
[2016-10-24 19:01:39] sleger : justinlooking: yes I know....
[2016-10-24 19:02:36] rapidtrades : BitMEX_Greg: thanks GREG. But I was hoping some of the bot runners would do the work for me
[2016-10-24 19:02:48] BitMEX_Greg : haha
[2016-10-24 19:02:50] arbitrage001 : conensus among whale here is to reduce leverage?
[2016-10-24 19:02:50] rapidtrades : so i don't have to do add up 30 numbers in the calc
[2016-10-24 19:04:54] sleger : your laptop too old to run excel ?
[2016-10-24 19:04:58] dasdfasdf : lol
[2016-10-24 19:06:20] rapidtrades : sleger: can i export that data to excel?
[2016-10-24 19:06:35] dasdfasdf : top right button 'save as CSV"
[2016-10-24 19:06:37] sleger : yes there is a save as csv button
[2016-10-24 19:06:48] rapidtrades : ah lemme see
[2016-10-24 19:10:37] rapidtrades : it's 2.3%...pretty rapey
[2016-10-24 19:12:08] rapidtrades : so we paid a premium of $14 dollars
[2016-10-24 19:12:20] rapidtrades : loooooooool
[2016-10-24 19:12:24] sleger : if premium could still go to 1% it would have been much higher
[2016-10-24 19:12:42] rapidtrades : the swap blows
[2016-10-24 19:12:44] sleger : *funding , not premium
[2016-10-24 19:12:59] sleger : trade the jpy future then
[2016-10-24 19:13:02] sleger : oh wait....
[2016-10-24 19:13:15] dasdfasdf : why no long dated BTC futures?
[2016-10-24 19:13:23] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 5700 @ 648.66
[2016-10-24 19:13:27] sleger : there is, but only against jpy
[2016-10-24 19:13:33] dasdfasdf : yeah i meant USD
[2016-10-24 19:14:05] rapidtrades : btcusd is so last year
[2016-10-24 19:14:14] sleger : because you're just a child so you dont know what you want
[2016-10-24 19:14:20] rapidtrades : +1
[2016-10-24 19:15:28] mjones : JPY is in. Especially illiquid exchange where you get rekt on a fat finger trade.
[2016-10-24 19:15:35] rapidtrades : seriously tho i will have to use bitvc or okc if this shit isn't sorted out
[2016-10-24 19:15:54] arbitrage001 : rapidtrades: thinking the same
[2016-10-24 19:16:00] justinlooking : oh what a loss that would be :P
[2016-10-24 19:16:04] arbitrage001 : like to trade future from time to time
[2016-10-24 19:16:10] arbitrage001 : like now
[2016-10-24 19:16:17] rapidtrades : long on swap is a disaster
[2016-10-24 19:16:26] arbitrage001 : i am shorting
[2016-10-24 19:16:28] arbitrage001 : swap
[2016-10-24 19:16:48] arbitrage001 : thank you for paying if you are long
[2016-10-24 19:16:53] rapidtrades : :)
[2016-10-24 19:16:54] arbitrage001 : thank you thank you
[2016-10-24 19:16:57] mjones : I should too 43 minutes till nice payout
[2016-10-24 19:17:30] mjones : Can you short 1 minute before and make money that way?
[2016-10-24 19:17:35] dasdfasdf : yes
[2016-10-24 19:17:39] justinlooking : ofc
[2016-10-24 19:17:47] arbitrage001 : market usually smarter
[2016-10-24 19:17:50] sleger : just do it ! Rekt
[2016-10-24 19:18:04] mjones : 100x short incoming
[2016-10-24 19:18:17] mjones : Higher the margin = better payout?
[2016-10-24 19:18:26] arbitrage001 : of course
[2016-10-24 19:18:28] sleger : yes doesnt work at less than 66x
[2016-10-24 19:18:33] justinlooking : rofl
[2016-10-24 19:18:47] arbitrage001 : do it, brave man!
[2016-10-24 19:18:49] rapidtrades : i use 88x for good luck
[2016-10-24 19:19:06] sleger : it's basic math dude, thats why funding is capped at 37.5% of a %
[2016-10-24 19:19:20] mjones : Someone put up a big buy. I'll probably lose money doing this i bet
[2016-10-24 19:19:31] sleger : mjones: how much ?
[2016-10-24 19:20:45] mjones : 30000 contracts i will risk
[2016-10-24 19:20:59] rapidtrades : china still $12 above us
[2016-10-24 19:21:20] arbitrage001 : rapidtrades: let us know when the premiuim is 40 usd
[2016-10-24 19:22:05] micmix : BitMEX_Wally: sorry was afk. yes, showing `realisedPnl' will work for me and it's much easier than calculating the daily change in realisedPNL
[2016-10-24 19:23:36] micmix : BitMEX_Wally: just reverse the change and go back to showing `realisedPnl` and I'll be happy :-) @BitMEX_Sam
[2016-10-24 19:23:49] BitMEX_Sam : micmix: Already on its way to testnet
[2016-10-24 19:24:38] micmix : BitMEX_Sam: thanks, much appreciated!
[2016-10-24 19:26:35] rapidtrades : sleger: where do u long now?
[2016-10-24 19:27:38] sleger : i rarely need to "long" I just need to not hedge my stash
[2016-10-24 19:28:07] arbitrage001 : sleger: meaning you are almost always long?
[2016-10-24 19:28:22] arbitrage001 : as in see everything else price in btc
[2016-10-24 19:29:23] sleger : no, i mean i own enough that i dont need to go leveraged long
[2016-10-24 19:29:55] arbitrage001 : still a very bullish view on btc
[2016-10-24 19:30:07] dasdfasdf : Unless he is hedged
[2016-10-24 19:30:37] rapidtrades : sleger: cool
[2016-10-24 19:31:25] sleger : rapidtrades: so if i go long somewhere using bitcoin as collateral (here for instance) then I would have a short somewhere else
[2016-10-24 19:34:33] rapidtrades : did anyone keep track of premium on okc futures from oct11-oct24
[2016-10-24 19:34:56] rapidtrades : on weekly and bi-weekly
[2016-10-24 19:35:37] sleger : depends when you buy
[2016-10-24 19:35:54] sleger : if you buy when its listed i would say on weekly premium ~3$
[2016-10-24 19:36:21] sleger : biweekly maybe 5$
[2016-10-24 19:37:51] rapidtrades : thanks
[2016-10-24 19:38:19] justinlooking : um, weekly is 663?
[2016-10-24 19:38:51] rapidtrades : index is 660 though
[2016-10-24 19:39:55] justinlooking : which index?
[2016-10-24 19:40:02] rapidtrades : okc
[2016-10-24 19:42:14] RocketScience : gigantic short D:
[2016-10-24 19:44:29] RocketScience : Fundings should be high frequency, like 1000 fundings per second so no one would speculate about them
[2016-10-24 19:45:24] RocketScience : one second after funding there will be a gigantic buy
[2016-10-24 19:51:25] Velancry : RocketScience: how does the funding works ? Do we pay a fee or how should it be understood.
[2016-10-24 19:52:40] RocketScience : If we trade above index price on bitmex, longs have to pay funding to shorts
[2016-10-24 19:52:51] RocketScience : and if we trade below, shorts have to pay longs
[2016-10-24 19:53:09] RocketScience : so we have maximum possible funding from longs to shorts because we were so bullish
[2016-10-24 19:53:26] Velancry : RocketScience: Aha. Thank you very much for the explanation!
[2016-10-24 20:02:15] sleger : price should have gone 2$ higher, only went one higher
[2016-10-24 20:05:31] aethlios : with a lower cap longs have a chance to make profit now, won't get raped a lot from funding.
[2016-10-24 20:06:05] RocketScience : quoine is compromised
[2016-10-24 20:06:17] RocketScience : we need a different futures
[2016-10-24 20:07:11] RocketScience : i was about to get all in like 10 mins before flash crash happened
[2016-10-24 20:09:54] miramm1115 : BitMEX_Sam: what happened to the mark price on XBJ contracts, it's not shown in the UI anymore?
[2016-10-24 20:10:36] sleger : my guess they switched to mark@last
[2016-10-24 20:10:56] BitMEX_Sam : miramm1115: Yes, we switched to `LastPriceProtected` until we are certain Quoine has worked out its issues
[2016-10-24 20:11:13] miramm1115 : ok, thanks
[2016-10-24 20:11:15] sleger : with no limit up or down ??
[2016-10-24 20:11:38] sleger : and with no communication as well ...
[2016-10-24 20:11:41] BitMEX_Sam : No - the `Protected` part of it uses the previous fair basis calc & uses it as a band for marking up & down by one multiple of the maint margin %
[2016-10-24 20:11:52] BitMEX_Sam : The effect to traders is minimal
[2016-10-24 20:12:26] BitMEX_Sam : We decided to make a quick decision to ensure another flash crash could not jeopardize positions. We are working on an announcement
[2016-10-24 20:12:47] sleger : i think it's a good decision, but making the change prior to announcing it is not
[2016-10-24 20:12:57] sleger : proof is we figured it out before the announcement
[2016-10-24 20:13:17] BitMEX_Sam : The effect is the same. We wanted to protect the contract while we worked out the root causes so the announcement was complete
[2016-10-24 20:13:52] BitMEX_Sam : I agree with you that we should have at least left a note here. I'll craft a quick interim announcement
[2016-10-24 20:14:58] miramm1115 : yeah, we need to know stuff like that. my system sent me a warning that mark price is off
[2016-10-24 20:17:02] wurstgelee : "funding" feels like getting your limbs ripped off lately
[2016-10-24 20:17:48] wurstgelee : *not complaining, it's how it works
[2016-10-24 20:18:19] martinium : wurstgelee: I agree regarding the funding when long on xbt swap
[2016-10-24 20:18:40] martinium : lack of movement in price is costly when using leverage
[2016-10-24 20:24:46] MrRGnome : funding IMO clearly hasn't been accomplishing its stated objective of creating incentive on the appropriate side of the order book. The 8 hour lag means that the incentive is very frequently on the wrong side of the orderbook entirely. A 2%+ funding cost during a several day period where price is going the opposite direction of the funding incentive is just stupid IMO.
[2016-10-24 20:29:06] j8 : it's an 8-hour lag, not several days. if funding stays high and the price is going down then it's just because the market was bullish but wrong so far
[2016-10-24 20:31:00] sleger : yep
[2016-10-24 20:37:33] MrRGnome : So you guys feel that, regardless of what the larger markets are doing, there has been a clear need for sell orders on the XBTUSD instrument so much so that a 2% funding rate was necessary? I don't particularly care whether or not the market was inappropriately bullish, the XBTUSD instrument on BitMex was not other than a single period of liquidations lasting not 5 minutes, which obviously an interest rate lagging 8 hours does nothing to incentivize resistance for.
[2016-10-24 20:38:36] j8 : it was bullish in the sense that people continued to be willing to pay 0.375% every 8 hours
[2016-10-24 20:39:14] MrRGnome : But the goal of the funding rate is to create orderbook volume, not measure market sentiment.
[2016-10-24 20:39:24] BitMEX_Sam : https://blog.bitmex.com/site_announcement/a-note-on-xbj-price-anomalies/
[2016-10-24 20:39:24] MrRGnome : I mena it can be used for that, but that'
[2016-10-24 20:39:33] MrRGnome : that's not what I undertand it to be for
[2016-10-24 20:42:53] j8 : the rate was at its maximum, if the price continued up and shit got crazy then it wouldn't be enough for me to keep selling. price was pretty calm though so it worked out
[2016-10-24 20:46:12] sleger : MrRGnome: the funding rate is the only thing that keeps the swap trading close to the index
[2016-10-24 20:46:35] MrRGnome : sleger: I disagree with that assertion, I believe there is evidence it often does the opposite.
[2016-10-24 20:46:59] sleger : MrRGnome: what else would prevent that it trades at 100 or 2000 ?
[2016-10-24 20:47:22] sleger : if there is no settlement, and no physical delivery
[2016-10-24 20:48:43] MrRGnome : I'm in favor of settlement based solutions
[2016-10-24 20:49:00] sleger : MrRGnome: you didnt answer the question
[2016-10-24 20:49:09] wurstgelee : gravity?
[2016-10-24 20:49:19] MrRGnome : You're asking what other means can be used to keep the orderbook price comparable to mark price?
[2016-10-24 20:49:24] sleger : no
[2016-10-24 20:49:39] sleger : I said " sleger: MrRGnome: the funding rate is the only thing that keeps the swap trading close to the index" and you said you disagreed
[2016-10-24 20:49:45] MrRGnome : I do.
[2016-10-24 20:49:53] sleger : well then you're just wrong
[2016-10-24 20:49:54] wurstgelee : sleger: and then u asked...
[2016-10-24 20:49:56] wurstgelee : "what else..."
[2016-10-24 20:50:03] wurstgelee : seems like a question
[2016-10-24 20:50:04] MrRGnome : And I said settlement
[2016-10-24 20:50:06] sleger : what else does
[2016-10-24 20:50:10] sleger : there is NO settlement
[2016-10-24 20:50:16] MrRGnome : No kidding
[2016-10-24 20:50:31] MrRGnome : And if there WAS a settlement, it wouldn't need a funding rate would it?
[2016-10-24 20:50:45] sleger : if settlement then it would be a future
[2016-10-24 20:50:49] j8 : wow this discussion really fell apart
[2016-10-24 20:50:54] MrRGnome : Kind of like how everything was not less than a year ago
[2016-10-24 20:50:57] MrRGnome : Ye sit would be
[2016-10-24 20:51:01] wurstgelee : j8: :D :D :D
[2016-10-24 20:51:04] sleger : they said we did not like futures
[2016-10-24 20:51:05] MrRGnome : Is there something wrong with that?
[2016-10-24 20:51:12] sleger : and that we are children
[2016-10-24 20:51:15] wurstgelee : discussions tend to do this here....
[2016-10-24 20:51:16] MrRGnome : Then why do they still offer them?
[2016-10-24 20:51:21] sleger : so they gave you something better
[2016-10-24 20:51:34] MrRGnome : I'm just saying, funding is a crude instrument, I believe it's flawed in its current form, I prefer settlement
[2016-10-24 20:51:34] aethlios : with no funding and no settlement, noone has the incentive to short btc.
[2016-10-24 20:51:35] sleger : no no the futures are against JPY, this is much much better
[2016-10-24 20:52:05] wurstgelee : did they also say we dont like quarterly futures?
[2016-10-24 20:52:15] sleger : yes and quantos oh we hate them
[2016-10-24 20:52:51] aethlios : previous system with many contracts "failed" because of quanto style.
[2016-10-24 20:52:57] sleger : MrRGnome: fact is : we have a "swap", not a futures, so there is NO settlement, so they need something to keep it aligned with the real price, and that something is funding
[2016-10-24 20:53:39] habibi : quantos were awsome, liquidity was great on 24h jpy and that was the best contract for me to day trade
[2016-10-24 20:53:41] MrRGnome : sleger: You're explaining to me things I already know. What about the swap being the way it is prohibits me from expressing a strong opinion that futures are superior trading instruments for my purposes?
[2016-10-24 20:53:58] sleger : MrRGnome: then just say that from the get go
[2016-10-24 20:53:58] MrRGnome : As is, with swap I often have to trade the funding rate.
[2016-10-24 20:54:01] wurstgelee : can we haz quarterlies back please?
[2016-10-24 20:54:04] wurstgelee : :/
[2016-10-24 20:54:17] MrRGnome : I fucking did. Swap is a crude, screwed up thing that often does not provide the appropriate market incentive
[2016-10-24 20:54:24] MrRGnome : and the solution is settlement
[2016-10-24 20:54:30] dasdfasdf : FOR YOU
[2016-10-24 20:54:35] wurstgelee : AND FOR ME
[2016-10-24 20:54:40] wurstgelee : =)
[2016-10-24 20:54:48] dasdfasdf : i wouldn't mind them
[2016-10-24 20:55:02] MrRGnome : Is it really an either or thing? Like if we have swap we can't have any futures?
[2016-10-24 20:55:10] sleger : and they gave you futures with settlement if that's all you need
[2016-10-24 20:55:35] wurstgelee : non-jpy based please
[2016-10-24 20:55:53] MrRGnome : There is an XBTUSD instrument on bitmex that has settlement? All I see is XBJ
[2016-10-24 20:56:19] wurstgelee : sleger didnt say usd
[2016-10-24 20:56:20] MrRGnome : If you're saying those are the same thing then it's you who is wrong not me.
[2016-10-24 20:56:20] wurstgelee : ;)
[2016-10-24 20:56:59] sleger : MrRGnome: i dont know if you realize, but i've been asking for usd based futures all the same, and was against the swap too, so we want the same things. You just express yourself poorly
[2016-10-24 20:57:21] MrRGnome : I don't think I do, maybe you understand poorly. Others here are buying what I'm selling
[2016-10-24 20:57:31] dasdfasdf : lolz
[2016-10-24 20:57:37] MrRGnome : But EITHER way, so long as my communication is clear to you now.
[2016-10-24 20:58:08] wurstgelee : haha. this trollbox is great with a funny cigarette
[2016-10-24 20:58:14] wurstgelee : very entertaining
[2016-10-24 20:58:36] wurstgelee : and it doesnt make me want to vomit like 20 secs of polo trollbox do
[2016-10-24 20:58:40] wurstgelee : which is a plus too
[2016-10-24 20:58:40] habibi : what u call a funny cigarete?
[2016-10-24 20:58:52] wurstgelee : joint, what else?
[2016-10-24 20:58:53] aethlios : sleger: are you against quanto?
[2016-10-24 20:59:14] sleger : no, im fine with either, ideally both
[2016-10-24 20:59:23] habibi : good thing here is people come here and loose money very fast, so many users are leaving faster then they register
[2016-10-24 20:59:39] wurstgelee : should we make an internet petition? :D
[2016-10-24 20:59:46] wurstgelee : "we want futures now!" or sth
[2016-10-24 20:59:50] rapidtrades : +1 for both @sleger
[2016-10-24 21:00:06] sleger : habibi: so will you please finally trade with real money and not just testnet !!
[2016-10-24 21:00:53] Kalman : sleger: rofl
[2016-10-24 21:00:53] habibi : sleger: i am still begging bitmex guys to give u back ur lost money so u can finally provide more than 10% of ur trading volume, need ur money more than others
[2016-10-24 21:01:38] wurstgelee : oh btw @rapidtrades, you are mostly a useless chimp but by all means, i would never have expected you to be still around here 1 year later.
[2016-10-24 21:01:44] sleger : i dont think it will happen, although they can see what 10x more commissions would represent
[2016-10-24 21:01:44] wurstgelee : so grats! i guess
[2016-10-24 21:01:58] wurstgelee : :)
[2016-10-24 21:06:57] Kalman : sleger: don't you have as well some opportunity costs!
[2016-10-24 21:07:16] sleger : I have principles
[2016-10-24 21:07:23] Kalman : or forgone profits
[2016-10-24 21:09:33] sleger : i trade more at other exchanges, so i dont lose as much as you think
[2016-10-24 21:16:04] marinomedia : unable to confirm google auth sigh
[2016-10-24 21:18:50] wurstgelee : check that ur phone clock is in sync with provider
[2016-10-24 21:19:02] wurstgelee : are any other "official" source
[2016-10-24 21:19:21] marinomedia : it worked one time then i disabled it cause i forgot to write the secret down
[2016-10-24 21:19:28] marinomedia : went to add a new one and it wont tak enow
[2016-10-24 21:20:04] wurstgelee : no clue
[2016-10-24 21:20:05] wurstgelee : admins?
[2016-10-24 21:20:21] BitMEX_Sam : marinomedia: How are you logged in if GA doesn't work?
[2016-10-24 21:20:33] BitMEX_Sam : You're attempting to add a new one I assume?
[2016-10-24 21:20:44] marinomedia : new one yep
[2016-10-24 21:20:48] marinomedia : i did ONCE
[2016-10-24 21:20:53] marinomedia : then i disabled to start again
[2016-10-24 21:21:01] BitMEX_Sam : Hmm. I would definitely check clock skew
[2016-10-24 21:21:03] marinomedia : cause i forgot to write down one time key
[2016-10-24 21:21:11] BitMEX_Sam : In your phone's settings you can have it adjust your clock from the carrier.
[2016-10-24 21:21:12] marinomedia : it workd 30 mins ago
[2016-10-24 21:21:24] wurstgelee : BitMEX_Sam: u have a highlight on "admin"",right?
[2016-10-24 21:21:26] marinomedia : so its not a clock issue
[2016-10-24 21:21:33] BitMEX_Sam : wurstgelee: I see my pings
[2016-10-24 21:21:42] BitMEX_Sam : marinomedia: It still could be if you're at the edge of the interval.
[2016-10-24 21:22:17] marinomedia : its asking for ONE TIME PW
[2016-10-24 21:22:23] marinomedia : not the auth code
[2016-10-24 21:22:29] wurstgelee : ?
[2016-10-24 21:22:39] marinomedia : To verify, please enter your one-time password from Google Authenticator or Authy.
[2016-10-24 21:22:39] wurstgelee : that is the 2fa code...the otp
[2016-10-24 21:22:52] marinomedia : 6 digit code?
[2016-10-24 21:22:57] wurstgelee : yep
[2016-10-24 21:22:59] wurstgelee : 6 digits
[2016-10-24 21:23:18] BitMEX_Sam : That's the same thing.
[2016-10-24 21:23:28] marinomedia : im on android lanovo how do i check clock?
[2016-10-24 21:23:38] marinomedia : i have NEVEr HAD THIS issue i have 7 other accounts
[2016-10-24 21:23:43] BitMEX_Sam : You'll have to check Google, we don't do Android support.
[2016-10-24 21:23:56] marinomedia : why does same thing work on all other exchanges?
[2016-10-24 21:24:26] marinomedia : seems if i were out of sync id have the issue with them
[2016-10-24 21:25:04] wurstgelee : marinomedia: http://lmgtfy.com/?q=android+synchronize+clock+with+carrier
[2016-10-24 21:25:06] BitMEX_Sam : We use particularly tight tolerances for security reasons.
[2016-10-24 21:25:12] rapidtrades : i had the same issue with btce...it just stopped working while all others worked fine
[2016-10-24 21:26:08] rapidtrades : like he has if its synching it shouldn't workon all
[2016-10-24 21:26:09] marinomedia : Wurstgelee FK off mate
[2016-10-24 21:26:20] rapidtrades : like he says*
[2016-10-24 21:26:53] marinomedia : i dont need this crap works everywhere else im on okc houbi finex bittrex vroom all over
[2016-10-24 21:27:30] BitMEX_Sam : marinomedia: He's trying to help you.
[2016-10-24 21:27:47] BitMEX_Sam : If you don't like complete strangers taking time out of their day to help you out, perhaps this isn't the place for you.
[2016-10-24 21:28:04] marinomedia : helping me with sarcasm eh?
[2016-10-24 21:28:21] marinomedia : did u see the condensending link he sent? FFS
[2016-10-24 21:28:22] BitMEX_Sam : I've told you the issue - synchronize your clock. And no, that last comment was not sarcastic, it was literal.
[2016-10-24 21:28:50] marinomedia : http://lmgtfy.com/?q=android+synchronize+clock+with+carrier hahaha oh man u guys never cut a brother a break
[2016-10-24 21:28:51] marinomedia : ok
[2016-10-24 21:29:00] Mm bot : How come the trade history of JPY looks so normal? While most people got liquidated today.
[2016-10-24 21:29:04] marinomedia : i will sync the damn thing if thats the issue i will oppologize if not i wont
[2016-10-24 21:29:37] BTCDJS : marinomedia: you're a piece of work aint ya? Go back to the arse you crawled out of
[2016-10-24 21:31:52] RocketScience : Wurstgelee used lmgtfy! It's super effective!
[2016-10-24 21:32:05] marinomedia : dont answer people with HOW TO SEARCH GOOGLE ffs
[2016-10-24 21:32:20] marinomedia : its just an app CLOCKSYNC thats all u had to say
[2016-10-24 21:32:22] rapidtrades : sleger: how far out do u usually sell options?
[2016-10-24 21:33:20] RocketScience : it's just a troll style of delivery
[2016-10-24 21:33:59] BTCDJS : marinomedia: he didn't have to say anything else. You should change your perception of people and have more tolerance.
[2016-10-24 21:34:33] BTCDJS : your garden is overgrown with weeds bra.
[2016-10-24 21:34:37] marinomedia : ITS OFF BY 1 SECOND so thats not the issue anyway plus android says IT CANT DO IT as it is a root command
[2016-10-24 21:36:22] rapidtrades : are u ppl stupid? if it works on all others it's not a sync issue
[2016-10-24 21:36:32] marinomedia : THANK U
[2016-10-24 21:36:32] laisee : u need to get rooted
[2016-10-24 21:36:46] rapidtrades : ur mom needs to get rooted
[2016-10-24 21:36:49] marinomedia : its within 1/2 a second too
[2016-10-24 21:37:30] laisee : bon mots flowing today ....
[2016-10-24 21:37:30] marinomedia : so its a support issue LOl just like i thought but thanks for the sarcasm of how to google serach something that is not even possible without jailbreak hahaha wat a joke
[2016-10-24 21:37:44] BitMEX_Sam : marinomedia: I'm seeing that code is not valid no matter how large I set our code window
[2016-10-24 21:37:56] BitMEX_Sam : Are you certain you are using the correct code? It changes when you disable/enable 2FA
[2016-10-24 21:38:28] marinomedia : i deleted it from goog auth then readded it
[2016-10-24 21:38:36] marinomedia : using qr on screen
[2016-10-24 21:38:55] BTCDJS : is there two in the list?
[2016-10-24 21:39:27] marinomedia : NOPE
[2016-10-24 21:39:54] BitMEX_Sam : marinomedia: Delete them all, re-add
[2016-10-24 21:40:00] BitMEX_Sam : None of your submitted tokens validate given any time period.
[2016-10-24 21:40:17] marinomedia : i know broh .. i will cntrl-f5 or something
[2016-10-24 21:40:26] rapidtrades : marinomedia: did u use the old QR code when u re-added it?
[2016-10-24 21:40:52] marinomedia : gives me same one time secret
[2016-10-24 21:41:07] BitMEX_Sam : Delete the account from your GA app & re-add
[2016-10-24 21:41:17] marinomedia : yeah i did that first
[2016-10-24 21:41:24] marinomedia : then checked to see it was not in there
[2016-10-24 21:41:51] marinomedia : k will readd again and see
[2016-10-24 21:42:36] marinomedia : SUCCESS
[2016-10-24 21:42:55] marinomedia : very strange
[2016-10-24 21:43:37] marinomedia : Sam is kyc required for withdrawl? bitcoin only deposit?
[2016-10-24 21:43:55] BitMEX_Greg : marinomedia: We only accept Bitcoin here, so we do not require KYC
[2016-10-24 21:44:10] marinomedia : cool cause my id is expired
[2016-10-24 21:44:42] BitMEX_Greg : You should probably get a new one in case you ever lose access to your account. That's the only time we may ask you for ID to verify the account
[2016-10-24 21:45:11] marinomedia : I know i need to
[2016-10-24 21:45:46] Mm bot : It is too bad we don't have a usable 3m BTC future contract, swap is expensive to hold long term, JPY contract was in hell today
[2016-10-24 21:47:29] rapidtrades : +1
[2016-10-24 21:49:21] marinomedia : Any price graphs on futures?
[2016-10-24 21:49:30] Mm bot : BitMEX_Greg: any further action for JPY holders caused by this "abnormality"? The "Recent Trades" tab looks like as nothing has happened
[2016-10-24 21:49:33] rapidtrades : buttfinex fund raising still at 20mil.....plus only 200 backers
[2016-10-24 21:49:48] rapidtrades : looks like most of that 20mil was inside funds
[2016-10-24 21:50:09] rapidtrades : meaning they haven't raised shit
[2016-10-24 21:50:25] BitMEX_Greg : Mm bot: We are investigating what happened with Quoine. They are located in Asian timezone so we should have an answer back sometime later
[2016-10-24 21:50:42] BTCDJS : rapidtrades: you got a law degree?
[2016-10-24 21:52:07] REKT : Liquidated long on `LTCXBT`: Sell 1000 @ 0.00593
[2016-10-24 21:52:29] marinomedia : No graph guys? guess i got to use api
[2016-10-24 21:52:53] rapidtrades : there is a chart in the middle....how can u miss it
[2016-10-24 21:53:29] rapidtrades : also offering the hacker money for the stolen coins can not be legal