This is a mirror of the original BitMEX trollbox archive that used to be online here.
BitMEX disabled their archive after the DDOS attack so I have decided to make my mirror publicly available.

Well now, a few days after I made this mirror available to the public, the original archive from BitMEX is online again.
But since it is still limited (neutered to the last few hundred messages) I will keep my FULL mirror alive.

You have access to more than 50 million trollbox posts. This is more than 7 gigabyte of data hosted on a $5 server so please be patient or consider a donation

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[2016-09-20 13:09:40] rapidtrades : yeah im with sleger here...it should be most leveraged ppl first not by profit
[2016-09-20 13:14:00] rapidtrades : that's why we wanted the change, to do away with winners paying for losers
[2016-09-20 13:17:07] BitMEX_Wally : Under this new system losers pay for losers (via losing their maintenance margin to fund insurance) and winners get closed out at a profit
[2016-09-20 13:17:59] Kalman : for profit at the losers bankroptsy price
[2016-09-20 13:18:26] BitMEX_Wally : In the situations where ADL will occur, the highest leveraged positions will be those that have been opened most recently, and the price will have moved in their favour, so they will be mostly in profit
[2016-09-20 13:23:26] Kalman : so if a trader putting his stack on a market sell XBTUSD @ 0, he might well have no short position as he's well off with all the triggered ADL's
[2016-09-20 13:27:13] BitMEX_Wally : XBTUSD is marked to the underlying index, so a market sell cannot trigger liquidations and ADL
[2016-09-20 13:27:45] BitMEX_Wally : Otherwise you are correct, you can just force the market up and down and get closed out at a profit. I think someone raped coinpit.io this way
[2016-09-20 13:29:05] zanza : AutoDeleveraging is interesting
[2016-09-20 13:29:20] zanza : did you guys make up this concept, or is it already used elsewhere?
[2016-09-20 13:32:21] BitMEX_Wally : Other exchanges have similar concepts, we've tried to make it more transparent by giving the indicator, and taking leverage into account
[2016-09-20 13:34:56] zanza : I wonder what Sleger will think of this
[2016-09-20 14:08:53] zanza : he is quite the critic
[2016-09-20 14:12:22] sleger : I suggested doing this at least 6 months to a year ago so i'm fine with that. Their approach is a bit extreme in my opinion : you can have your whole position closed at once if you happen to be top of the pile, whereas bitvc (hu0bi) closes everyone on the opposite side of a non-filled liquidation proportionally to the size of their position. So it happens more often but your position is usually reduced only by a tiny fraction
[2016-09-20 14:14:02] BitMEX_Arthur : sleger: Given we offer much higher leverage than Huobi, we wanted to rank users according to leverage and pnl
[2016-09-20 14:14:56] sleger : when you say "according to leverage AND pnl" you mean according to leverage conditional to pnl >0 ? Or does the pnl have more importance than that in the ranking ?
[2016-09-20 14:15:56] BitMEX_Arthur : https://www.bitmex.com/app/autoDeleveraging
[2016-09-20 14:16:03] BitMEX_Arthur : Effective Leverage and PNL % are defined there
[2016-09-20 14:17:16] sleger : so the more in profit I am the more likely I am to get closed out ?
[2016-09-20 14:18:14] BitMEX_Wally : The more in profit you are the less your effective leverage will be, so not necessarily
[2016-09-20 14:20:00] sleger : and if the liq is 50 contracts and the trader who ranks 1 has 50 contracts then he get completely closed out or is it split amongst the top x ranked traders ?
[2016-09-20 14:20:38] sleger : I honestly dont understand why the PNL Percentage has to intervene in that formula, that doesnt make sense to me. Leverage fine, pnl no.
[2016-09-20 14:20:56] BitMEX_Wally : Trader who ranks 1 gets completely closed out
[2016-09-20 14:25:08] BitMEX_Wally : BitMEX are visiting Shanghai this week and hosting some events, let us know if you would like to meet us
[2016-09-20 14:27:49] zanza : can i have free buffet if I go ?
[2016-09-20 14:27:53] zanza : food
[2016-09-20 14:28:58] BitMEX_Wally : zanza: Sure
[2016-09-20 14:29:05] zanza : :D thx
[2016-09-20 14:29:34] BitMEX_Arthur : Don't be surprised if there is cardboard in your bao
[2016-09-20 14:30:15] zanza : extra fiber :)
[2016-09-20 14:45:23] germanjew : BitMEX_Wally: Will you be at devcon?
[2016-09-20 14:45:27] BitMEX_Sam : Closing users by profit & leverage priority has advantages; users in profit have the margin to re-open, and by affecting only the best-situated and most risky users, less-risky users trading on lower leverage can have their positions untouched and hold long positions without worrying about ADL.
[2016-09-20 14:46:00] BitMEX_Wally : germanjew: I'm in Shanghai this week
[2016-09-20 14:47:02] germanjew : Where though? I'm at devcon 2 in Shanghai
[2016-09-20 14:47:22] germanjew : Where in Shanghai*
[2016-09-20 14:48:05] BitMEX_Arthur : germanjew: We are staying in Jing'an
[2016-09-20 14:48:32] BitMEX_Arthur : But are hosting some casual drinks on Thursday 7pm at Shanghai Brewery, 20 Donghu Lu
[2016-09-20 14:48:37] BitMEX_Arthur : in Xuhui
[2016-09-20 14:49:13] BitMEX_Arthur : if you can't make that, shoot me an email arthur@bitmex.com and we can meet up either in jing'an or at the hyatt where the conference is
[2016-09-20 14:52:34] germanjew : Thanks! I will try and make that, I might bring two work colleagues with
[2016-09-20 14:53:51] germanjew : If I can't I will send mail so that we can meet at the Hyatt
[2016-09-20 15:11:14] sleger : you should allow a setting for auto reentering a position in case of ADL (bitvc has that)
[2016-09-20 15:13:09] BitMEX_Arthur : Yes we have discussed that
[2016-09-20 15:14:34] sleger : at least emails in case someone's position is closed out ?
[2016-09-20 15:22:29] BitMEX_Arthur : Yes there will be email notifications
[2016-09-20 15:24:17] BitMEX_Sam : This is already live in Testnet and essentially ready to go, we're just doing some usability testing.
[2016-09-20 15:50:20] rapidtrades : I agree with sleger again, don't see why it's winning traders first that have to get penalized
[2016-09-20 15:50:50] rapidtrades : so if I get closed by deleveraging do I lose the maintenance margin?
[2016-09-20 15:52:12] sleger : no you're just closed against the price of the liq order (i hope)
[2016-09-20 15:52:34] sleger : which may be worse then closing with a market order, so it's gonna sting
[2016-09-20 15:53:49] BitMEX_Wally : You'll get closed out at the mark price
[2016-09-20 15:55:31] sleger : not the liquidation price ?
[2016-09-20 15:55:51] sleger : where does the pnl between liq and mark price go (= maintenance margin of the liquidated trader) ?
[2016-09-20 15:55:54] habibi : adl will hit when people will start eating liquidation or when liquidation will cause dpe?
[2016-09-20 15:56:14] sleger : neither .... when liq cant be filled
[2016-09-20 15:56:16] BitMEX_Wally : sleger: Effectively the bankruptcy price of that order and the mark price will be the same
[2016-09-20 15:56:57] BitMEX_Wally : The maintenance margin is spent aggressing the liquidation order to the bankruptcy price
[2016-09-20 15:57:49] BitMEX_Wally : habibi: ADL will hit whenever there would have been DPE in the past.
[2016-09-20 15:58:20] BitMEX_Wally : The insurance fund, liquidation orders, aggression, etc all remain the same. Once the mark price goes beyond the system bankruptcy price then instead of DPE there is ADL
[2016-09-20 15:58:40] sleger : ohh you're keeping an insurance fund
[2016-09-20 15:59:24] sleger : so liq orders might still sit on the book for some time, as long as they dont create DPE ?
[2016-09-20 15:59:33] BitMEX_Wally : Yes, losers will still pay for losers so ADL is very rare
[2016-09-20 15:59:34] BitMEX_Wally : sleger: Yes
[2016-09-20 15:59:57] sleger : habibi: i answered you wrong then
[2016-09-20 16:01:54] BitMEX_Wally : le client n'a jamais tort
[2016-09-20 16:07:34] REKT : Liquidated short on `XMR7D`: Buy 2700 @ 0.018182
[2016-09-20 17:58:14] lockhedge : BitMEX_Wally: are the quintiles based on the open interest (every quintile represents 20% of OI)?
[2016-09-20 17:58:51] rapidtrades : sleger: do u know why backing isn't yet open for buttfinex lil project?
[2016-09-20 17:58:59] BitMEX_Greg : lockhedge: Hi, I believe so. I'll double check for you
[2016-09-20 17:59:43] rapidtrades : what are they waiting for? Christmas?
[2016-09-20 18:00:15] lockhedge : BitMEX_Greg: thanks
[2016-09-20 18:02:35] REKT : Liquidated short on `XMR7D`: Buy 9 @ 0.018527
[2016-09-20 18:04:44] sleger : no idea @rapidtrades
[2016-09-20 18:29:55] QuantFocus : @bitmex - are we going to get a 12/31 xbt contract?
[2016-09-20 18:30:53] sleger : yes but it will smell sushi
[2016-09-20 18:31:06] QuantFocus : damn, just like my ex
[2016-09-20 18:32:03] QuantFocus : might need to move over to the woodchipper contract
[2016-09-20 18:32:17] QuantFocus : premium seems more reasonable anywa
[2016-09-20 18:32:20] QuantFocus : y
[2016-09-20 18:46:02] badtrader : i want to close my ethxbt position at 0.027 but it always corrects it to 27 !?
[2016-09-20 18:47:18] BitMEX_Sam : badtrader: Are you using the "Close Position" control?
[2016-09-20 18:48:03] badtrader : yes. sorry already solved it. comma was , not .
[2016-09-20 18:48:44] QuantFocus : BitMEX_Sam: you guys considering december xbt contract?
[2016-09-20 18:49:17] BitMEX_Sam : QuantFocus: Volume on XBTU16 has been low. We're watching it, we may do another if it picks up and/or there is significant demand for XBTZ16
[2016-09-20 18:49:51] QuantFocus : ok, thanks
[2016-09-20 19:07:15] Boontjie : how is the mark of xmr calculated?
[2016-09-20 19:13:23] sleger : with an AWS VM
[2016-09-20 19:13:52] Boontjie : possible given the difference between mark and spot
[2016-09-20 19:14:10] BitMEX_Sam : Boontjie: Mark is right between the bid and ask
[2016-09-20 19:14:24] BitMEX_Sam : See https://www.bitmex.com/app/fairPriceMarking
[2016-09-20 19:14:42] BitMEX_Sam : On futures, we use weighting of bid & ask to determine mark price.
[2016-09-20 19:15:28] Boontjie : BitMEX_Sam: Well there is a big fat 50 btc buy on polo
[2016-09-20 19:15:33] Boontjie : but the mark is not above 1870
[2016-09-20 19:15:46] BitMEX_Sam : Boontjie: It's based on *our* bid/ask, not the reference exchange's.
[2016-09-20 19:16:57] Boontjie : does it only take the first bid and ask?
[2016-09-20 19:17:14] Boontjie : ok there it is going down
[2016-09-20 19:19:00] BitMEX_Greg : It's based on a weighting of the bids and asks @Boontjie
[2016-09-20 19:19:42] BitMEX_Greg : Take a look at the link Sam posted above, specifically the Futures section: https://www.bitmex.com/app/fairPriceMarking#calculation-of-fair-price-for-futures-contracts
[2016-09-20 19:20:29] Boontjie : BitMEX_Greg: its slow. Huge bids would imply a mark close to 1857
[2016-09-20 19:20:46] Boontjie : That is not what I am seeing, it lags quite a bit
[2016-09-20 19:22:21] BitMEX_Greg : This is a futures product, so the price may differ from underlying spot except at settlement
[2016-09-20 19:23:07] Boontjie : BitMEX_Greg: I get that, no worries. Different supply and demand market
[2016-09-20 19:24:46] BitMEX_Greg : Could be. Traders who wish to trade with leverage will express their views here as oppose to Polo
[2016-09-20 19:25:52] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 50 @ 0.02268
[2016-09-20 19:38:50] justinlooking : xmr wtf man, we talked
[2016-09-20 20:47:36] zanza : wow look that XMR green canble
[2016-09-20 20:53:51] BitMEX_Sam : Yeah, on the move again.
[2016-09-20 21:35:35] REKT : Liquidated short on `ETHXBT`: Buy 105 @ 0.02321
[2016-09-20 21:36:10] rapidtrades : yeah monero aint going anywhere
[2016-09-20 21:38:06] rapidtrades : Yep, and that's exactly what happens. First any recovered coins goes to redeeming outstanding coins, then it goes to paying RRT holders.
[2016-09-20 21:38:25] rapidtrades : ^^^ this pretty much guarantees a flop
[2016-09-20 21:38:57] rapidtrades : you have to be an idiot to exchange when all profits will go to paying token holders
[2016-09-20 21:40:18] rapidtrades : Am I wrong?
[2016-09-20 21:42:10] rapidtrades : yeah im wrong...he's talking about recovered coins not profits
[2016-09-20 21:42:18] rapidtrades : i need to get some sleep
[2016-09-20 21:50:06] migz : these volume doesnt let me sleep. -_-
[2016-09-20 22:03:07] REKT : Liquidated short on `ETHXBT`: Buy 2 @ 0.02323 :punch: :whale:
[2016-09-20 22:08:59] sleger : ETH up who coulda seen that coming ;)
[2016-09-20 22:17:52] RocketScience : Santander bank is making a bank
[2016-09-20 22:40:43] omicron : mark price is different from index price, why?
[2016-09-20 22:45:11] lockhedge : omicron: it currently includes about 5/8 of the funding rate. index and mark are equal every 8 hours
[2016-09-20 22:45:52] lockhedge : (if your questions was about swaps)
[2016-09-20 23:03:58] omicron : lockhedge: thanks yes
[2016-09-20 23:17:57] BitMEX_Greg : omicron: Please take a look at the swaps guide which can help explain the funding: https://www.bitmex.com/app/swapsGuide
[2016-09-20 23:31:58] d00ber : 12h charts still seem to be broken
[2016-09-20 23:56:59] mjones : btc dumpin
[2016-09-20 23:57:07] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBJ24H`: Sell 189 @ 61590.0
[2016-09-20 23:59:52] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 150 @ 598.58
[2016-09-20 23:59:52] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 15535 @ 598.59
[2016-09-21 00:00:01] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 5680 @ 597.76
[2016-09-21 00:00:01] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 8 @ 598.09
[2016-09-21 00:00:01] REKT : Blood on the streets!
[2016-09-21 00:00:01] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 40100 @ 597.76 **MEGA-REKT** :boom:
[2016-09-21 00:00:01] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 160 @ 598.13
[2016-09-21 00:00:01] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 220 @ 598.26
[2016-09-21 00:00:01] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 5500 @ 597.54
[2016-09-21 00:00:01] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 8700 @ 598.19
[2016-09-21 00:00:01] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 40000 @ 597.63 **MEGA-REKT** :boom:
[2016-09-21 00:00:20] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 5000 @ 595.72
[2016-09-21 00:00:20] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 5000 @ 596.15
[2016-09-21 00:00:20] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 50 @ 596.05
[2016-09-21 00:00:20] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 5 @ 595.63
[2016-09-21 00:00:22] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 177 @ 595.36
[2016-09-21 00:00:33] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 200 @ 595.07
[2016-09-21 00:00:38] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 200 @ 593.81
[2016-09-21 00:00:38] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 15501 @ 593.25
[2016-09-21 00:00:38] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 3 @ 594.02 :punch: :whale:
[2016-09-21 00:00:38] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 510 @ 595.01
[2016-09-21 00:00:38] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 799 @ 594.17
[2016-09-21 00:00:38] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 10000 @ 593.52
[2016-09-21 00:00:43] habibi : wooohoo
[2016-09-21 00:00:51] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTU16`: Sell 2000 @ 600.40
[2016-09-21 00:00:51] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 3000 @ 592.41
[2016-09-21 00:00:51] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 27700 @ 593.21 **MEGA-REKT** :boom:
[2016-09-21 00:00:51] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 10000 @ 592.88
[2016-09-21 00:00:51] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 1426 @ 592.52
[2016-09-21 00:01:03] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 3000 @ 591.49
[2016-09-21 00:01:16] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 2410 @ 591.17
[2016-09-21 00:01:17] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 2950 @ 589.51
[2016-09-21 00:01:17] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 10000 @ 590.32
[2016-09-21 00:01:17] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 90 @ 590.78
[2016-09-21 00:01:17] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 66 @ 589.98
[2016-09-21 00:01:17] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 1500 @ 589.45
[2016-09-21 00:01:17] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 3889 @ 589.62
[2016-09-21 00:01:17] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 36000 @ 589.28 **MEGA-REKT** :boom:
[2016-09-21 00:01:53] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 207 @ 588.50
[2016-09-21 00:01:53] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 15000 @ 588.04
[2016-09-21 00:01:53] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBTUSD`: Sell 35000 @ 588.45 **MEGA-REKT** :boom:
[2016-09-21 00:05:19] habibi : nice action
[2016-09-21 00:05:22] habibi : anyone alive?
[2016-09-21 00:08:11] tb : me
[2016-09-21 00:08:32] tb : wait i thougth there wasn't dpe anymore
[2016-09-21 00:08:40] tb : why is there a liquidation in the books?
[2016-09-21 00:09:03] habibi : not yet
[2016-09-21 00:11:47] mjones : i got rekt trying to 50x guess the bottom
[2016-09-21 00:12:39] habibi : mjones: look and guess again http://prntscr.com/ckfr6s
[2016-09-21 00:13:37] sleger : News? Besides eth killing it?
[2016-09-21 00:15:45] mjones : i'm convinced not many people trade on BTCC and Huobi
[2016-09-21 00:16:27] sleger : Rekt convictions?
[2016-09-21 00:25:03] d00ber : LTC looking good...
[2016-09-21 00:26:27] tommygunn : hey my long at 589 hit, wow
[2016-09-21 00:33:45] omicron : what a drop, i got rekt
[2016-09-21 00:39:39] laisee : now thats rekkage ...
[2016-09-21 00:43:14] lockhedge : would the liquidations that rested unfilled for a while in the order book have triggered ADL?
[2016-09-21 00:47:25] omicron : is ADL active on XBTUSD?
[2016-09-21 00:47:48] lockhedge : not yet
[2016-09-21 00:48:37] omicron : i've been trading a bit on coinpit, they have ADL. Works good mostly
[2016-09-21 00:49:08] omicron : i was long on this drop, but if i was short, i dunno it may have ADL'd me
[2016-09-21 00:49:21] omicron : better than the socializd loss crap
[2016-09-21 00:50:56] omicron : so with ADL does that mean there is no more insurance fund?
[2016-09-21 01:00:29] sleger : somehow the way they did it, it stays
[2016-09-21 01:00:49] sleger : ADL replaces DPE, the rest is unchanged, just a different way to split losses
[2016-09-21 01:01:02] zen10 : Is there an event causing BTc to dump, or are whales just having their way with us?
[2016-09-21 01:07:22] alayos : wow good day today. Thank you BTC. Shorted at 609
[2016-09-21 01:09:40] rapidtrades : f*ck this jewdump man
[2016-09-21 01:10:03] rapidtrades : I barely got 2 hrs of sleep and now I can't go back cos BOJ
[2016-09-21 01:10:14] tommygunn : muice short hope you cover
[2016-09-21 01:59:04] TraderStefan : I like the look of the ADL system
[2016-09-21 02:13:36] rapidtrades : I see you graduated from Tulip to Trader
[2016-09-21 02:45:38] TraderStefan : Different guy I think
[2016-09-21 02:45:45] TraderStefan : I've always been Trader
[2016-09-21 03:22:38] rapidtrades : nice try Tulip....
[2016-09-21 03:23:11] rapidtrades : TraderStefan: do u believe that markets are random?
[2016-09-21 03:24:07] TraderStefan : rapidtrades: Yes I would say they are pretty close to being random
[2016-09-21 03:24:35] TraderStefan : Definitely more random than most trading would like to believe
[2016-09-21 03:24:52] TraderStefan : traders*
[2016-09-21 03:40:17] REKT : Liquidated short on `ETHXBT`: Buy 40 @ 0.02385
[2016-09-21 03:58:57] rapidtrades : TraderStefan: THEN WHY ARE U HERE TULIP
[2016-09-21 03:59:32] TraderStefan : I'm not Tulip, but I am here for market making
[2016-09-21 04:00:40] rapidtrades : can't fool me random walker
[2016-09-21 04:04:01] rapidtrades : 'I'm Stefan. I like chocolate, sucking cocks and random markets'
[2016-09-21 04:04:24] rapidtrades : ^ from ur dating profile
[2016-09-21 04:05:17] laisee : rapidtrades: why are you looking at guys dating profiles?
[2016-09-21 04:07:25] rapidtrades : undercover work
[2016-09-21 04:07:29] rapidtrades : can't talk about it
[2016-09-21 04:13:29] laisee : I'm sure its very undercover and not much talking involved. /?
[2016-09-21 04:26:05] sleger : lol
[2016-09-21 04:27:41] TraderStefan : yeah, that is my actual dating profile
[2016-09-21 04:29:01] TraderStefan : what can I say, I like what I like
[2016-09-21 04:37:08] jung1 : morning
[2016-09-21 05:07:46] billyboy402 : with the new funnding , does that mean , that if your in 1 poistion that is in profit and one ther negtiuve ,. does your balance abg out if you have cross margin
[2016-09-21 05:08:16] billyboy402 : talking about he ADL
[2016-09-21 05:09:52] REKT : Liquidated long on `XMR7D`: Sell 104 @ 0.017252
[2016-09-21 05:09:52] REKT : Liquidated long on `XMR7D`: Sell 260 @ 0.017284
[2016-09-21 05:10:34] REKT : Liquidated long on `XMR7D`: Sell 20 @ 0.017029
[2016-09-21 05:12:22] BitMEX_Greg : billyboy402: Hi, how would you have 1 position in profit and another in loss?
[2016-09-21 05:13:19] billyboy402 : if your short BTC XBU at 620 and long on btc swap 595
[2016-09-21 05:13:41] billyboy402 : or short on XMR/BTC and loong on BTC/USD
[2016-09-21 05:13:54] BitMEX_Greg : The Autodeleverage only applies to the contract that the liquidations occur in
[2016-09-21 05:17:07] billyboy402 : what is it call when you use un relaize profit as margin ?
[2016-09-21 05:17:39] BitMEX_Greg : Do you mean Cross Margin?
[2016-09-21 05:17:40] billyboy402 : would be great as some time i have long term contract open for hedging in profit and get margin call on other trade
[2016-09-21 05:19:11] billyboy402 : cross margin still margin call you tho
[2016-09-21 05:20:29] BitMEX_Greg : If you do not have any free margin yes
[2016-09-21 05:33:35] REKT : Liquidated short on `ETHXBT`: Buy 25 @ 0.02372
[2016-09-21 07:04:42] hh : Greg, question for you, could you suggest any website that shows Bitmex underlyings & prices on one page?
[2016-09-21 07:06:20] hh : or do you have any excel spreadsheet that import bitmex price data?
[2016-09-21 07:06:56] hh : I thought I saw some excel files before but can"t find it now.
[2016-09-21 07:11:32] BitMEX_Arthur : hh: you can see the underlying index on the contrac details
[2016-09-21 07:38:41] rapidtrades : markets giving a slow f*ck u to the BOJ
[2016-09-21 07:38:44] rapidtrades : again
[2016-09-21 07:48:07] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 200 @ 0.02340
[2016-09-21 07:48:16] Tetsuo : ETH down, BTC up!
[2016-09-21 07:48:57] Tetsuo : XMR sideways or slowly down
[2016-09-21 07:49:18] rapidtrades : no BTC up
[2016-09-21 07:50:33] Tetsuo : It might do a fuck u retrace back to 620.
[2016-09-21 07:51:11] rapidtrades : nope
[2016-09-21 07:54:35] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 1002 @ 0.02316
[2016-09-21 08:05:49] hh : Is there any third party bitmex chart/price provider? Cryptowat.ch seems to scrap Bitmex.
[2016-09-21 09:34:51] REKT : Liquidated short on `FCTXBT`: Buy 1 @ 0.005323 :punch: :whale:
[2016-09-21 09:42:03] jung1 : hh: https://bfxdata.com/
[2016-09-21 09:42:34] jung1 : bitcoin is dead
[2016-09-21 09:44:36] Susperia : jung1: so bitcoin = bfx?
[2016-09-21 09:45:11] jung1 : bitcoin are all of us
[2016-09-21 09:47:59] +1 : lol
[2016-09-21 09:50:48] jung1 : https://bitcoinmagazine.com/articles/toward-the-moon-genesis-mining-sends-the-first-bitcoin-into-space-1474394567
[2016-09-21 09:50:52] jung1 : bitcoin can into space
[2016-09-21 10:52:10] Susperia : Can you guys add dice to bitmex? It's easier to roll than wait for any action on BTC/USD
[2016-09-21 10:55:56] jung1 : go to polo then
[2016-09-21 10:56:06] sleger : lol, not such a bad suggestion (to add dice)
[2016-09-21 10:57:21] Susperia : Because 50x leverage is a dice, just slow dice.
[2016-09-21 10:57:49] hedgehog0223 : Why is order rejected?
[2016-09-21 10:58:02] hedgehog0223 : my order*
[2016-09-21 10:59:23] lockhedge : dice with maker/taker fee structure is everything a trader needs to understand market structure
[2016-09-21 11:02:58] jung1 : is there something like that?
[2016-09-21 11:16:26] sleger : somewhere another village is missing another idiot
[2016-09-21 11:24:22] laisee : just-dice.com was a top-notch trading site.
[2016-09-21 11:24:37] Boontjie : laisee: :)
[2016-09-21 11:27:08] laisee : better than the tech in majority of places I worked
[2016-09-21 11:40:28] Boontjie : time to short some meth
[2016-09-21 12:22:24] rapidtrades : I hear good things about meth
[2016-09-21 12:23:10] rapidtrades : good things from bad people...
[2016-09-21 12:36:28] rapidtrades : markets listened to the BOJ and were like NOPE NOPE NOPE
[2016-09-21 15:01:21] laisee : Rapid: who ever listened to BOJ?
[2016-09-21 15:04:49] omicron : wow volume is back. wtf happened? is sleger back?
[2016-09-21 15:10:05] Rado : so BTC fell because of FED or BOJ?
[2016-09-21 15:12:54] Susperia : because dead shitcoin
[2016-09-21 15:13:33] Susperia : buy ZCash, developed by lesbian shemale, the success will be huge
[2016-09-21 15:34:46] omicron : Im gonna create a new coin ZZCoin
[2016-09-21 15:34:59] omicron : It will play music from ZZTop
[2016-09-21 16:10:01] Boontjie : Susperia: doesnt stop the price from being
[2016-09-21 17:45:17] rapidtrades : from being what?
[2016-09-21 17:45:23] rapidtrades : don't leave me hanging brah
[2016-09-21 17:45:34] Boontjie : high
[2016-09-21 17:45:42] CaptainDean : So ware back under 600,
[2016-09-21 17:45:47] CaptainDean : i'm surprise
[2016-09-21 17:45:55] rapidtrades : i'm not
[2016-09-21 17:45:59] Boontjie : CaptainDean: why
[2016-09-21 17:46:32] CaptainDean : i don't know, i tough we would go higher,
[2016-09-21 17:46:55] Susperia : why it would go higher?
[2016-09-21 17:47:04] Boontjie : CaptainDean: The halvening has happened :) No new news
[2016-09-21 17:47:23] CaptainDean : Boontjie: Yeah we are missing some good news at the moment
[2016-09-21 17:47:54] rapidtrades : some tool will prolly knee-jerk the Fed
[2016-09-21 17:48:12] Susperia : Will go under 300 again, then to 160, 100.
[2016-09-21 17:48:17] Boontjie : We need Marc on speed dail. So there be YOLO long
[2016-09-21 17:48:44] Boontjie : Under 300 is possible. I dont know about a 100
[2016-09-21 17:49:31] CaptainDean : 300 will putt a lot of pressure on miner
[2016-09-21 17:49:37] CaptainDean : 100 would be horrible for miners
[2016-09-21 17:49:49] Susperia : Why not 100? Even why not 50? Network can die, no one need it. You can trade "futures" and numbers on exchange. No one really using it anyway.
[2016-09-21 17:49:51] CaptainDean : in fact miming would be plain stupid at large scale
[2016-09-21 17:50:32] Boontjie : Well difficulty will drop a lot
[2016-09-21 17:51:00] Boontjie : So 100 is theoretically possible. You just a lot less secure network
[2016-09-21 17:51:08] Boontjie : get*
[2016-09-21 17:51:17] CaptainDean : everyting is possible
[2016-09-21 17:51:21] CaptainDean : we could go 1000$ :P
[2016-09-21 17:51:35] Boontjie : I think we will eventually
[2016-09-21 17:52:04] Susperia : lol we will never see even 700 again
[2016-09-21 17:52:29] Boontjie : Thats what we said last year. Here we are
[2016-09-21 18:04:57] rapidtrades : no change in fed rates
[2016-09-21 18:10:53] CaptainDean : Susperia: SO you can predict future right ? no ones know what will happen, that's the true
[2016-09-21 18:15:05] sleger : the true the truce or the truth ?
[2016-09-21 18:32:14] CaptainDean : SHIPPABLE
[2016-09-21 18:32:21] CaptainDean : truth
[2016-09-21 18:40:22] REKT : Liquidated long on `XMR7D`: Sell 28 @ 0.016698
[2016-09-21 18:40:22] REKT : Liquidated long on `XMR7D`: Sell 150 @ 0.016697
[2016-09-21 19:01:07] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 581 @ 0.02245
[2016-09-21 19:01:07] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 7 @ 0.02244
[2016-09-21 19:01:22] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 5 @ 0.02243
[2016-09-21 19:06:11] Susperia : XMR :(
[2016-09-21 19:41:35] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 132 @ 0.02223
[2016-09-21 20:21:29] troller : can I margin fund here?
[2016-09-21 20:25:08] billz : Has bitmex switched over from the DPE system to the new one yet?
[2016-09-21 20:26:25] BitMEX_Sam : billz: No, that will go live on Oct 3, 12:00 UTC.
[2016-09-21 20:26:40] billz : ok cool
[2016-09-21 20:26:46] BitMEX_Sam : troller: Leverage here is "free", but you can earn funding on most contracts by shorting.
[2016-09-21 20:27:07] BitMEX_Sam : troller: See https://www.bitmex.com/app/swapsGuide#funding
[2016-09-21 20:33:07] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 7 @ 0.02209
[2016-09-21 20:35:52] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 5 @ 0.02206
[2016-09-21 20:39:07] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 20 @ 0.02202
[2016-09-21 21:51:22] REKT : Liquidated long on `FCTXBT`: Sell 1 @ 0.005196 :punch: :whale:
[2016-09-21 21:55:58] RocketScience : Factom ninja dump deluxe
[2016-09-21 22:09:40] mjones : nothing like dump 100k FCT when there is only 8,753,219
[2016-09-21 23:21:52] REKT : Liquidated long on `XMR7D`: Sell 30 @ 0.016511
[2016-09-21 23:22:34] REKT : Liquidated long on `XMR7D`: Sell 200 @ 0.016361
[2016-09-22 00:27:16] omicron : wow sudden vol on FCT
[2016-09-22 00:27:22] omicron : did something get announced
[2016-09-22 00:45:58] rapidtrades : Kuroda prolly having nightmares right about now
[2016-09-22 00:46:08] rapidtrades : time to invite Ben again
[2016-09-22 00:52:48] rapidtrades : http://www.coindesk.com/winklevoss-exchange-gemini-bitcoin-auctions/
[2016-09-22 00:53:35] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 3 @ 0.02259 :punch: :whale:
[2016-09-22 01:04:52] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 5 @ 0.02245
[2016-09-22 01:20:07] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETC7D`: Sell 8 @ 0.002021
[2016-09-22 01:21:07] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETC7D`: Sell 9 @ 0.002005
[2016-09-22 01:21:21] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETC7D`: Sell 4600 @ 0.001990
[2016-09-22 01:21:24] mjones : etc final leg down
[2016-09-22 01:32:23] CaptainDean : u sure ? :P
[2016-09-22 01:32:49] CaptainDean : mjones: i think it might collaspe
[2016-09-22 01:37:56] CaptainDean : it did survive the last dip
[2016-09-22 01:39:20] mjones : final leg as here is your last chance to get a bunch of BTC for your few ETC
[2016-09-22 01:39:39] mjones : looking at the polo buy side it looks like 1 person is holding price up. probably owns a ton of ETC.
[2016-09-22 01:39:43] CaptainDean : mjones: :D
[2016-09-22 01:40:06] rapidtrades : I remember a time when all we talked about in this chart was BTC
[2016-09-22 01:40:32] rapidtrades : now it's shitcoin A and shitcoin B
[2016-09-22 01:41:04] mjones : unless you are at the computer for the 2 minutes BTC moves every 1-2 weeks then shitcoins is all we got
[2016-09-22 01:42:17] habibi : 7 minutes*
[2016-09-22 01:45:45] mjones : etc market here is wack. market maker asleep
[2016-09-22 01:45:55] CaptainDean : yep
[2016-09-22 01:46:09] CaptainDean : the gap is stupid at the moment
[2016-09-22 01:50:53] omicron : mjones: on btc cant you use stop orders to enter on big moves
[2016-09-22 02:00:27] mjones : not sure about entering
[2016-09-22 02:00:40] CaptainDean : yeahhhhhh
[2016-09-22 02:00:52] CaptainDean : it's risky, good volume, good support but still unsafe i think
[2016-09-22 02:03:03] CaptainDean : mjones: or maybe i'm just a pussy ! :D
[2016-09-22 02:03:22] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 17 @ 0.02222
[2016-09-22 02:03:22] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 125 @ 0.02222
[2016-09-22 05:06:34] REKT : Liquidated short on `XMR7D`: Buy 160 @ 0.017736
[2016-09-22 06:08:52] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 44 @ 0.02195
[2016-09-22 06:10:07] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 3 @ 0.02187 :punch: :whale:
[2016-09-22 06:10:07] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 220 @ 0.02186
[2016-09-22 06:19:07] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 300 @ 0.02185
[2016-09-22 06:21:53] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 137 @ 0.02181
[2016-09-22 06:21:53] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 1501 @ 0.02179
[2016-09-22 06:21:53] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 300 @ 0.02166
[2016-09-22 06:21:53] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 50 @ 0.02168
[2016-09-22 06:21:53] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 1 @ 0.02159 :punch: :whale:
[2016-09-22 06:48:45] jordanbitfort : ez shakeout
[2016-09-22 10:09:32] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETC7D`: Sell 5 @ 0.001920
[2016-09-22 10:09:34] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETC7D`: Sell 36 @ 0.001916
[2016-09-22 10:25:25] germanjew : You guys still hosting drinks starting at 7?
[2016-09-22 10:29:56] germanjew : BitMEX_Sam
[2016-09-22 10:53:36] BitMEX_Wally : germanjew: yes, come along!
[2016-09-22 10:54:01] BitMEX_Wally : Shanghai Brewery, 20 Donghu Lu (东湖路20号)
[2016-09-22 10:54:47] germanjew : Great, we'll see you there but will be a little late
[2016-09-22 11:03:35] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 127 @ 0.02192
[2016-09-22 11:12:31] zanza : Winklevoss Twins dumping ?
[2016-09-22 11:13:35] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 3 @ 0.02187 :punch: :whale:
[2016-09-22 11:25:40] rapidtrades : btce just closed my trades for no reason...not margin called or anything
[2016-09-22 11:57:22] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 42 @ 0.02188
[2016-09-22 12:51:32] REKT : Liquidated short on `ETC7D`: Buy 10000 @ 0.002066
[2016-09-22 13:40:20] Susperia : ETH network is forked
[2016-09-22 13:55:08] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETHXBT`: Sell 315 @ 0.02110
[2016-09-22 14:02:51] Boontjie : ah that short
[2016-09-22 14:02:56] Boontjie : the feels :)
[2016-09-22 14:56:09] hazir : hey, if i buy Zcash future and i doesn't come out until December what happens to my contract?
[2016-09-22 14:56:27] hazir : (until december 16)
[2016-09-22 14:57:39] hazir : sorry....*it. what if zcash don't get genesised until after December 16? which is the date of the end of the contract?
[2016-09-22 14:58:28] Susperia : ZCash market cap is zero, only idiots buying it now.
[2016-09-22 14:58:59] hazir : ok
[2016-09-22 14:59:06] BitMEX_Sam : hazir: We reserve the right to declare a Market Disruption Event in that case and extend the contract
[2016-09-22 14:59:45] hazir : thank you
[2016-09-22 15:00:57] hazir : i'm new here, are there all kinds of fees on the contract? or is it like holding a regulate coin?
[2016-09-22 15:03:31] BitMEX_Greg : These are futures contracts
[2016-09-22 15:03:42] BitMEX_Greg : The fees page is listed here: https://www.bitmex.com/app/fees
[2016-09-22 15:34:35] REKT : Liquidated short on `ETC7D`: Buy 30 @ 0.002177
[2016-09-22 15:50:07] REKT : Liquidated short on `ETC7D`: Buy 19 @ 0.002251
[2016-09-22 15:58:22] REKT : Liquidated short on `ETHXBT`: Buy 650 @ 0.02156
[2016-09-22 16:16:20] germanjew : It was great meeting some of the BitMEX team, thanks for hosting!
[2016-09-22 16:47:08] QuantFocus : BitMEX_Greg: don't you guys list historical funding rates somewhere on the site? i'm an idiot and can't seem to find them right now
[2016-09-22 16:47:25] BitMEX_Greg : Here you go: https://www.bitmex.com/app/fundingHistory
[2016-09-22 16:47:29] QuantFocus : thanks
[2016-09-22 16:47:33] BitMEX_Greg : Under the "Contracts" tab at the top
[2016-09-22 16:47:43] QuantFocus : shit, first link
[2016-09-22 16:47:51] BitMEX_Greg : haha np
[2016-09-22 16:47:53] QuantFocus : i was looking under the specific contract
[2016-09-22 16:47:56] QuantFocus : thanks again man :)
[2016-09-22 17:05:52] REKT : Liquidated short on `ETHXBT`: Buy 13 @ 0.02178
[2016-09-22 18:53:12] rapidtrades : anyone else got their trades closed on btce? weird shit
[2016-09-22 19:22:31] rapidtrades : well...got my explanation....they say prices hit 1,000 today looool
[2016-09-22 19:22:51] rapidtrades : and he says it so nonchalantly like it's normal
[2016-09-22 19:23:06] rapidtrades : and few mins earlier they crashed to 130
[2016-09-22 19:29:37] Tetsuo : lol
[2016-09-22 19:31:05] habibi : on mt4?
[2016-09-22 19:31:44] rapidtrades : yes
[2016-09-22 19:31:46] Susperia : mt4 was always broken on btc-e
[2016-09-22 19:31:58] rapidtrades : it wasn't 'always broken' u tool
[2016-09-22 19:32:18] rapidtrades : it worked fine until few weeks ago...it was integrated with main exchange
[2016-09-22 19:33:02] rapidtrades : spikes like these didn't happen cos orders got routed to the main...but smth is broken
[2016-09-22 19:34:33] habibi : rapidtrades: just place ur bids/asks low and high to get filled on wicks like that with lot of margin left to not get liquidated
[2016-09-22 19:45:22] REKT : Liquidated short on `ETHXBT`: Buy 14 @ 0.02190
[2016-09-22 20:14:12] RocketScience : more than 50% of ETH has been lent to shorters on polo
[2016-09-22 20:14:18] RocketScience : this might get interesting soon
[2016-09-22 20:16:29] Boontjie : RocketScience: not yet
[2016-09-22 20:47:46] habibi : RocketScience: any exact numbers how much 50% is referring to?
[2016-09-22 20:48:35] RocketScience : 40k available now, max was 120k few days ago.
[2016-09-22 20:49:12] RocketScience : amount lent out could be less than 80k if people stopped offering lending in this volatile times
[2016-09-22 20:51:54] habibi : u think 80k is enough for short panic squeeze?
[2016-09-22 20:52:16] arbitrage001 : eth lending rate is quite low
[2016-09-22 20:53:03] arbitrage001 : normally high rate predict forseeable reversal since funding is expensive
[2016-09-22 20:54:38] RocketScience : true. These shorters can survive up to 0.0265 if they went 2,5x at 0.0210
[2016-09-22 20:57:25] rapidtrades : habibi: u mean place bid/asks? that's a great idea...dunno why I didn't think of that
[2016-09-22 20:57:25] RocketScience : I started high leverage trading here 2 days ago, already got rekt 2 times. Drunk on leverage :D
[2016-09-22 20:57:41] rapidtrades : habibi: oh wait I did and it doesn't work idiot
[2016-09-22 20:57:48] arbitrage001 : seen lots of people come and go here
[2016-09-22 20:57:56] arbitrage001 : especially alt coin traders
[2016-09-22 20:57:56] habibi : rapidtrades: good job, keep playing there :)
[2016-09-22 20:59:54] RocketScience : Are these 1500 orders on ETH from a bot owned by some rich guy?
[2016-09-22 21:00:33] arbitrage001 : likely suspect is sleger
[2016-09-22 21:00:48] arbitrage001 : as a market maker
[2016-09-22 21:04:07] rapidtrades : sleger...I f*cking knew it
[2016-09-22 21:08:22] rapidtrades : u can blame 60% of the shit that happens here on f*cking sleger
[2016-09-22 21:08:55] arbitrage001 : rapidtrades: how so?
[2016-09-22 21:09:39] arbitrage001 : market maker usually only make market, none directional trade
[2016-09-22 21:10:25] rapidtrades : he's too big for this place
[2016-09-22 21:10:50] RocketScience : but you get liquidated based on exchange price breaking your liq. price. I read that in the faqs
[2016-09-22 21:11:18] arbitrage001 : RocketScience: liqudation price is based on mark price
[2016-09-22 21:11:25] arbitrage001 : not market price here
[2016-09-22 21:13:25] arbitrage001 : trading eth is extremely dangerous now
[2016-09-22 21:13:30] arbitrage001 : gap up and down
[2016-09-22 21:13:35] arbitrage001 : on polo
[2016-09-22 21:13:46] RocketScience : yeah. that latest bug wasn't resolved, needs hard fork
[2016-09-22 21:13:57] arbitrage001 : have a feeling something big going to happen
[2016-09-22 21:14:00] rapidtrades : another hard fork? loolll
[2016-09-22 21:14:11] Boontjie : RocketScience: source?
[2016-09-22 21:14:14] habibi : RocketScience: source ?
[2016-09-22 21:14:32] Susperia : They are unable to fix problem, will only add crutches to mitigate it
[2016-09-22 21:14:52] rapidtrades : ETH has the worst developers by far
[2016-09-22 21:14:56] RocketScience : https://blog.ethereum.org/2016/09/22/transaction-spam-attack-next-steps/
[2016-09-22 21:15:21] Boontjie : rapidtrades: best idea though
[2016-09-22 21:15:31] RocketScience : the command that is responsible will get expensive with next HF to prevent these types of attack
[2016-09-22 21:15:42] rapidtrades : is the idea fork until u get it right? @Boontjie
[2016-09-22 21:16:11] RocketScience : The fall to 205 was because of this... Hashrate fell to 1,7 again today
[2016-09-22 21:16:38] rapidtrades : how much is 1.7....like fell from where
[2016-09-22 21:17:23] Susperia : And pools mining empty blocks now, ETH is fucked again like after DAO disaster
[2016-09-22 21:17:24] RocketScience : 5TH to 1.7TH
[2016-09-22 21:18:03] Boontjie : rapidtrades: sure until then it wwont have buttcorn marketcap
[2016-09-22 21:20:35] rapidtrades : hahaha that's great
[2016-09-22 21:20:38] rapidtrades : i hate ETH
[2016-09-22 21:21:36] rapidtrades : f*cking premined presaled spamcoin
[2016-09-22 21:21:45] rapidtrades : PPS
[2016-09-22 21:21:55] rapidtrades : actually FPPS
[2016-09-22 21:24:12] Boontjie : yeah, but the decentralized hosting it has behind it is good
[2016-09-22 21:24:18] Boontjie : But I agree on premine
[2016-09-22 21:24:45] Boontjie : All the fishy smell of get rich quick schemes
[2016-09-22 21:25:21] Boontjie : RocketScience: is that the bitcoin hashrate? Or what is this empty block talk?
[2016-09-22 21:30:13] rapidtrades : they spammed the crap out of reddit for couple of months
[2016-09-22 21:30:43] rapidtrades : right during major bull run
[2016-09-22 21:31:53] Boontjie : rapidtrades: i agree, it worked
[2016-09-22 21:38:17] REKT : Liquidated short on `ETHXBT`: Buy 150 @ 0.02218
[2016-09-22 21:38:40] rapidtrades : still 0 backed and not open https://bnktothefuture.com/pitches/bitfinex
[2016-09-22 21:38:57] rapidtrades : don't get it....why would u rush it if its not ready
[2016-09-22 21:39:16] rapidtrades : and they set a deadline for 30th if u want 1 share per token
[2016-09-22 21:39:26] rapidtrades : it's like they want tokens to crash
[2016-09-22 21:42:52] Boontjie : rapidtrades: they do
[2016-09-22 21:43:18] Boontjie : they keep news to around a week
[2016-09-22 21:43:35] Boontjie : every 7 days like clockwork
[2016-09-22 21:44:48] Boontjie : look at activity just before announcements
[2016-09-22 21:45:02] Boontjie : those executives trade
[2016-09-22 21:45:45] Kahir : hello
[2016-09-22 21:45:53] Kahir : can someone tell me what is kaiko
[2016-09-22 21:46:05] Kahir : the source for price index