This is a mirror of the original BitMEX trollbox archive that used to be online here.
BitMEX disabled their archive after the DDOS attack so I have decided to make my mirror publicly available.

Well now, a few days after I made this mirror available to the public, the original archive from BitMEX is online again.
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[2015-08-30 03:46:07] BitMEX_Arthur : Sunday funday
[2015-08-30 03:53:14] johnny : haha
[2015-08-30 06:22:34] zanza : whales swooping in ?
[2015-08-30 06:25:31] j8 : no volume
[2015-08-30 06:25:51] BitMEX_Arthur : Price has flatlined
[2015-08-30 07:51:36] BitMEX_Arthur : Anyone alive out there
[2015-08-30 07:57:19] cengel : yea
[2015-08-30 07:57:34] cengel : Arthur how do i subscribe to XBX live changes in the websocket
[2015-08-30 08:01:23] cengel : Or is the 1 minute snaps as real time as it will get
[2015-08-30 08:04:44] BitMEX_Arthur : You can go to tradeblock to subscribe the their websocket
[2015-08-30 08:04:49] BitMEX_Arthur : we provide only minutely for now
[2015-08-30 08:10:12] cengel : how come bitcoin and litecoin have ISO standard X prefix but not ETH
[2015-08-30 08:13:22] BitMEX_Arthur : Easier to understand
[2015-08-30 08:43:37] DunningKruger : cengel: because it's new I guess.
[2015-08-30 12:09:34] SnackyCoins : does tradeblock supply a public /free price api? google cant seem to find it
[2015-08-30 12:10:20] SnackyCoins : i'd like to track it on bitfx.info for mex users 8)
[2015-08-30 12:58:16] cengel : cant find either. id
[2015-08-30 14:38:44] cengel : if Sam is around maybe he can help?
[2015-08-30 14:44:21] cengel : even if there was reliable historical data i could try to reverse engineer the weightings
[2015-08-30 14:44:24] BitMEX_Sam : cengel: SnackyCoins: You can likely get a hook into their WS feed if you contact them, I believe they are being more liberal with keys now but I am not 100% on that
[2015-08-30 14:44:33] BitMEX_Sam : They export hourly CSV data yo ucould use.
[2015-08-30 14:44:40] BitMEX_Sam : We are working on publishing weightings too.
[2015-08-30 14:45:13] cengel : when i contacted them they just said you guys would have it
[2015-08-30 14:45:28] BitMEX_Sam : We'll see what we're allowed to do. We'd like to be able to republish the realtime data with weightings via the WS
[2015-08-30 14:45:37] BitMEX_Sam : I don't know if we could offer history but we may be able to provide realtime
[2015-08-30 14:47:19] cengel : the csv data is limited to the time period there
[2015-08-30 14:47:55] cengel : their weekly goes back to 2014 summer
[2015-08-30 14:48:05] BitMEX_Sam : It also appears they are publishing the data publicly via the WS on the XBX page
[2015-08-30 14:48:18] cengel : I couldnt quite figure that out though
[2015-08-30 14:49:58] cengel : for me realtime is more important than the historical
[2015-08-30 14:51:12] BitMEX_Sam : It appears they have no issue with publishing that data to the public if you see your browser connecting to the WS on that page
[2015-08-30 14:51:14] BitMEX_Sam : So that may be a good option
[2015-08-30 14:56:50] cengel : Im not seeing anything in devtools under Networks->Websockets
[2015-08-30 14:57:06] BitMEX_Sam : cengel: Usually you have to refresh it again once that's open
[2015-08-30 14:57:26] cengel : doh :)
[2015-08-30 14:58:07] cengel : Snacky: wss://socketbc.tradeblock.com/
[2015-08-30 14:58:13] cengel : ok
[2015-08-30 14:58:39] BitMEX_Sam : hmm that's odd
[2015-08-30 14:58:46] BitMEX_Sam : Our url scraper must have filtered that out, not intentional
[2015-08-30 14:58:51] BitMEX_Sam : wss://socketbc.tradeblock.com/
[2015-08-30 14:58:56] BitMEX_Sam : :(
[2015-08-30 14:59:16] BitMEX_Sam : wss:// socketbc.tradeblock.com/
[2015-08-30 14:59:57] cengel : yes
[2015-08-30 15:00:13] cengel : but that gives you the stream of the whole lot. have to filter for the market that is XBX but cant find what exact string is
[2015-08-30 15:00:30] cengel : narrowing down now sec
[2015-08-30 15:01:01] BitMEX_Sam : ` < {"time":1440946846,"pair":"XBT/USD","market":"IXBX","price":228.47,"size":0,"currency":"USD","type":2}`
[2015-08-30 15:01:12] BitMEX_Sam : You have to send it `ixbx-xbt-usd` when it starts up to get that added to your feed
[2015-08-30 15:04:17] cengel : yea this will do
[2015-08-30 15:04:20] cengel : ty
[2015-08-30 15:48:49] cryptojoe : darn. wish the last two days of free trading had more. has definitely been really fun. glad i checked this site out.
[2015-08-30 15:49:10] cryptojoe : more volume
[2015-08-30 15:53:02] BitMEX_Sam : cryptojoe: Glad you're enjoying it here
[2015-08-30 15:53:54] cryptojoe : been meaning to trade here for a while but the new found volatility was the clincher
[2015-08-30 15:54:56] BitMEX_Sam : Yeah volatility in the last few weeks has been great.
[2015-08-30 17:26:49] vbmithr : Hi bitcoiners
[2015-08-30 17:28:09] vbmithr : I can release a DTC data feed almost immediately if it can be of interest for anybody here
[2015-08-30 17:28:25] vbmithr : I'm gonna see this with the Sierra Chart team very soon
[2015-08-30 18:06:42] krtek.net : Hunting uraninite with friends is such fun.
[2015-08-30 18:07:45] vbmithr : sounds like you talk about hunting aliens in another planet
[2015-08-30 18:07:47] vbmithr : yaeh, sounds fun
[2015-08-30 18:07:48] krtek.net : Be a member of hackerspace, acquire cancer :)
[2015-08-30 18:08:45] krtek.net : No aliens, our shit is real, about 40 kilos brutto in 2 days, I estimate we can get about 200 gram of uranium from that )
[2015-08-30 18:10:28] krtek.net : http://nat.brmlab.cz/phtagr/explorer/view/category:Geovylet%20Pribram%202015-08
[2015-08-30 18:11:16] krtek.net : I'm the one with the rasta hat :)
[2015-08-30 18:27:48] vbmithr : cool :)
[2015-08-30 18:28:02] vbmithr : you want to make a a-bomb in your garage ?
[2015-08-30 18:47:29] krtek.net : well... let says, that yes, we want. but we also understand, that we are not able to collect enough material from the self-sustained chain-reaction :)
[2015-08-30 18:52:53] krtek.net : but there are other thinks that you can do with it... eg. uranite in a cloud chamber makes a great eye candy for the visitors :) An we also have some thing that are mostly not shown to normal visitors...
[2015-08-30 18:54:13] krtek.net : ... I'm still trying to make our betatron work. *wink* *wink*
[2015-08-30 19:06:01] vbmithr : :))
[2015-08-30 19:06:21] vbmithr : Cool projects
[2015-08-30 19:06:30] vbmithr : You're in Praha ?
[2015-08-30 19:12:51] krtek.net : yep.
[2015-08-30 19:13:25] vbmithr : I have a friend living there, nice city.
[2015-08-30 19:14:01] vbmithr : There is a Rihanna clip that has been filmed there :) the one of the diamond song :)
[2015-08-30 19:14:47] vbmithr : no not diamond, this! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yd8jh9QYfEs
[2015-08-30 19:15:14] vbmithr : the taxi has been imported, but the place is definitely Praha :)
[2015-08-30 19:19:21] krtek.net : Most probably. Kolonada waffles and Vodafone logo. Can be Praha. I'm not able to watch more than a half of that... and there was nothing more to guess from in the first part.
[2015-08-30 19:19:47] krtek.net : But there are some "diamonds" filmed here.
[2015-08-30 19:19:58] vbmithr : lol :)
[2015-08-30 19:20:08] vbmithr : yeah :)
[2015-08-30 19:20:08] krtek.net : Like Eurotrip movie... was almost completelly filmed here
[2015-08-30 19:20:12] vbmithr : that's just the first part
[2015-08-30 19:20:15] krtek.net : even the "Bratislava part" :D
[2015-08-30 19:20:47] krtek.net : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1mYqY5YELd0
[2015-08-30 19:20:52] vbmithr : Praha has probably sex appeal or something
[2015-08-30 19:21:05] vbmithr : what's the point of importing a NYC taxi there lol
[2015-08-30 19:22:31] krtek.net : Well... czech taxis are not required to be "yellow cabs"
[2015-08-30 19:22:33] vbmithr : "we're in eastern europe"
[2015-08-30 20:43:28] krtek.net : Until the next rain comes, we wouldn't need to turn the lights on at the backyard :D https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DYQzPI8frR4
[2015-08-30 21:39:53] vbmithr : Ha, by the way!!
[2015-08-30 21:39:57] vbmithr : BitMEX team
[2015-08-30 21:40:16] vbmithr : Could you release a version of the websocket API without the websocket framing
[2015-08-30 21:40:35] vbmithr : i.e. dump the same messages in a plain TCP connection
[2015-08-30 21:41:19] vbmithr : It's super easy to do for you
[2015-08-30 21:42:27] vbmithr : I mean, if it is indeed super easy for you, you should provide it
[2015-08-30 21:42:46] vbmithr : websocket is an additional complexity when you don't code an app that lives in a browser
[2015-08-30 21:43:10] vbmithr : and the protocol adds a layer of framing that makes the thing a bit less efficient
[2015-08-30 21:44:07] vbmithr : while you're at it you could even use something more efficient than json too :) but I'm asking too much :p
[2015-08-30 21:44:24] vbmithr : (but still, same messages over plain TCP would be awesome IMO)
[2015-08-31 00:02:18] TInvest : bam
[2015-08-31 00:02:33] BitMEX_Arthur : http://www.coindesk.com/uk-banking-giant-barclays-to-allow-charities-to-accept-bitcoin/
[2015-08-31 00:02:40] BitMEX_Arthur : Giddy Up
[2015-08-31 00:04:38] johnny : http://www.econotimes.com/Mozilla-study-shows-bitcoin-negatively-impacts-donations-78862
[2015-08-31 00:05:11] johnny : In light of that report, barklay's move proves banks are mostly insane
[2015-08-31 00:05:39] BitMEX_Arthur : johnny: Who cares if charities receive more money or not, barclays has said it actually bought bitcoin around 230
[2015-08-31 00:06:36] johnny : Oh? I wasn't aware of that, then that is pump time then!
[2015-08-31 00:22:10] TInvest : giddy up indeed Arthur
[2015-08-31 00:23:49] TInvest : and charities accepting bitcoin is a pretty brilliant idea - when you think of the amount of dust people end up left with if they're occasional dabblers - 0.00001 don't mean much - but a whole bunch of them... well that means almost something heh
[2015-08-31 00:46:01] johnny : I agree that it is a great idea, something like changetip is goign to make that a real thing
[2015-08-31 00:46:41] johnny : But its interesting how bitcoin has real brand issues, to the point were mainstream donors dont want to donate online when there is bitcoin as a paymetn option
[2015-08-31 00:46:55] johnny : We have a lot of work to do regarding advocacy etc
[2015-08-31 02:42:45] TrevinHofmann : BitMEX_Sam: Can I ask what you use for a database infrastructure? Is there one single server with a database, or do you have multiple nodes using something like Cassandra?
[2015-08-31 02:48:35] krtek.net : I think the "db" here is redis.
[2015-08-31 04:27:51] zanza : Do you guys ever plan to offer like SP500/Oil/Gold/Forex or anything like that?
[2015-08-31 04:32:04] krtek.net : I cannot speak for the 'mex, but anything that can be indexed, could be traded as futures contracts..
[2015-08-31 04:34:49] krtek.net : Eg. there are futures on reaching the Bitcoin XT's consensus by the end of the year prepared I think :)
[2015-08-31 04:35:52] j8 : could be legal grey area, i'm not sure
[2015-08-31 04:38:39] j8 : i'm a bit surprised sites like 1broker and simplefx survive
[2015-08-31 04:39:44] krtek.net : The only thing it IMHO depends is the legal value (or valuability) of the settlement.
[2015-08-31 05:46:39] zanza : they don't want to confuse their interface by offering too many products people don't use
[2015-08-31 05:47:46] zanza : unless there is legal issues with CFD's on say, SnP500?
[2015-08-31 05:48:03] zanza : above my knowledge
[2015-08-31 05:48:26] zanza : I wanna guess though, if they settle everything in BTC then it might be OK
[2015-08-31 07:33:36] krtek.net : eth just went full retard
[2015-08-31 08:00:56] chromaticcr : still less retard than that of the first week price discovery period
[2015-08-31 08:01:47] vbmithr : what is the multiplier field in the instrument api call ?
[2015-08-31 08:05:55] BitMEX_Wally : vbmithr: It is the multiplier used to turn the quote currency (i.e. USD) into the settlement currency (i.e. XBt or Satoshi)
[2015-08-31 08:06:05] vbmithr : thanks
[2015-08-31 08:07:00] BitMEX_Wally : So you do multiplier * quantity * price to get the value of the contract in Satoshi
[2015-08-31 08:07:08] BitMEX_Wally : If the multiplier is negative you do multiplier * quantity / price
[2015-08-31 08:08:35] vbmithr : ok, my use case is to figure out the currency value per tick size
[2015-08-31 08:09:03] vbmithr : so I guess, tickSize * multiplier
[2015-08-31 08:14:02] vbmithr : would be nice to document the fields
[2015-08-31 08:14:12] vbmithr : of your API json object responses
[2015-08-31 08:16:16] BitMEX_Wally : ticksize * multiplier will only work for linear or quanto contracts
[2015-08-31 08:16:47] BitMEX_Wally : For inverse futures the Satoshi value of a tick size move in the price is a function of the price
[2015-08-31 08:18:24] vbmithr : ha yeah nonlinear derivatives
[2015-08-31 08:18:33] BitMEX_Wally : Well, they're linear in USD terms
[2015-08-31 08:18:37] BitMEX_Wally : But settled in XBT
[2015-08-31 08:19:21] BitMEX_Wally : So the XBT value is a reciprocal of the price
[2015-08-31 08:20:53] vbmithr : I think that's I'm interested in
[2015-08-31 08:21:04] BitMEX_Wally : Have a look at the XBU series
[2015-08-31 08:21:32] BitMEX_Wally : `XBUU15` is always worth 100 USD of Bitcoin
[2015-08-31 08:22:08] vbmithr : yes
[2015-08-31 08:22:42] BitMEX_Wally : So 1 contract of `XBUU15` at 200 USD has a value of -0.5 XBT
[2015-08-31 08:23:01] BitMEX_Wally : 1 contract at 250 USD has a value of -0.4 XBT
[2015-08-31 08:23:27] BitMEX_Wally : The difference is 0.1 XBT of profit
[2015-08-31 08:25:29] BitMEX_Wally : So if you go long 1 contract at 200 and sell at 250 you make 0.1 XBT, which is exactly the same as if you went long 0.5 XBT at 200 and sold at 250, you would make 25 USD (i.e. 0.1 XBT at 250)
[2015-08-31 08:28:10] vbmithr : ok
[2015-08-31 08:29:49] vbmithr : I'm asking this because I'm translating the instrument api call to a DTC field
[2015-08-31 08:29:51] vbmithr : https://dtcprotocol.org/index.php?page=doc/doc_DTCMessageDocumentation.php#Messages-SECURITY_DEFINITION_RESPONSE
[2015-08-31 08:30:00] vbmithr : CurrencyValuePerIncrement
[2015-08-31 08:30:01] vbmithr : This field is the currency value per MinPriceIncrement in the Symbols currency.
[2015-08-31 08:30:11] vbmithr : I was wondering what I should write in this field
[2015-08-31 08:30:43] BitMEX_Wally : A lot of our fields follow the FIX spec: http://www.fixtradingcommunity.org/FIXimate/FIXimate3.0/
[2015-08-31 08:31:05] vbmithr : MinPriceIncrement
[2015-08-31 08:31:06] vbmithr : The minimum amount that prices can change by for the Symbol and minimum amount that prices are quoted in.
[2015-08-31 08:31:16] vbmithr : DTC is quite imprecise…
[2015-08-31 08:31:31] vbmithr : thanks I'm going to have a look at htis
[2015-08-31 08:31:40] BitMEX_Wally : Ok, so each instrument has 3 currencies
[2015-08-31 08:31:45] BitMEX_Wally : The underlying, i.e. XLT
[2015-08-31 08:31:49] BitMEX_Wally : The quote currency, i.e. USD
[2015-08-31 08:32:03] BitMEX_Wally : And the settle currency, i.e. XBt
[2015-08-31 08:33:05] vbmithr : why "XLT" is the underlying ?
[2015-08-31 08:33:26] BitMEX_Wally : So `tickSize` is in `quoteCurrency`
[2015-08-31 08:33:44] vbmithr : Ah, ok
[2015-08-31 08:33:45] vbmithr : LTC, sorry
[2015-08-31 08:33:51] BitMEX_Wally : `XLT` is Litecoin
[2015-08-31 08:34:00] BitMEX_Wally : Yeah we use ISO currency codes where we can
[2015-08-31 08:34:16] vbmithr : good, I'm doing the same but I did not know ltc had an ISO code.
[2015-08-31 08:34:25] BitMEX_Wally : `MinPriceIncrement` can just be `tickSize`
[2015-08-31 08:34:39] BitMEX_Wally : Well, `XBT` is used by Bloomberg
[2015-08-31 08:34:43] BitMEX_Wally : So it might become an ISO code
[2015-08-31 08:34:49] BitMEX_Wally : And maybe `XLT` too
[2015-08-31 08:40:03] cengel : wally when is XBUH16 coming
[2015-08-31 08:45:41] BitMEX_Wally : cengel: We're concentrating liquidity on the XBT series for now
[2015-08-31 08:49:35] cengel : did you take a hit on the volatility on XBU settlement guarantee?
[2015-08-31 09:00:19] BitMEX_Wally : No, we've never had to step in to bailout any contracts
[2015-08-31 12:10:28] gustavo7 : sell stop order confirmation dialog has wrong wording "price reaches above"?
[2015-08-31 12:11:16] gustavo7 : Order Summary: Sell XXX contracts of XBTU15 @ YYY.00. This is a stop order. It will trigger when the price reaches YYY or above.
[2015-08-31 12:11:53] gustavo7 : shouldn't it be "below"?
[2015-08-31 12:18:08] BitMEX_Wally : gustavo7: Yes, well spotted, we'll fix it
[2015-08-31 13:03:05] gustavo7 : that ain't no bull run, i'm shorting
[2015-08-31 13:32:25] gaoMex : I read the Digest. "Come September 8th, a full on barrage of positive acceptance news will change the tide of sentiment".
[2015-08-31 13:33:06] gaoMex : Why Sep 8? Source?
[2015-08-31 14:13:54] j8 : gaoMex: i think he just means that in the context of the end of summer. first day after labour day
[2015-08-31 16:11:29] BitMEX_Sam : Morning traders - we've made some slight updates to the site, including a new `Close Position` order type.
[2015-08-31 16:12:38] krtek.net : neat
[2015-08-31 16:12:56] krtek.net : I like panic buttons. :)
[2015-08-31 16:14:14] BitMEX_Sam : It's nice to have. Use with caution, market orders are dangerous.
[2015-08-31 16:21:28] SnackyCoins : Where is it, sam?
[2015-08-31 16:21:59] BitMEX_Sam : SnackyCoins: If you have an open position you'll see a third order type next to Stop Limit
[2015-08-31 16:22:04] SnackyCoins : Nice job on the colored sides for the orders bar, I got lost it in sometimes :)
[2015-08-31 16:22:22] SnackyCoins : ah okay I see it now, just had to switch contract pages
[2015-08-31 16:22:25] BitMEX_Sam : Thanks, we're always looking for ways to eliminate text and that seemed like an easy win
[2015-08-31 16:23:09] BitMEX_Sam : So "Close Position" is simple: market order, asks for confirmation before execution.
[2015-08-31 16:27:32] j8 : nice. any word on what the fee schedule will be going forward?
[2015-08-31 16:28:04] BitMEX_Sam : j8: Yes, we've simplified and published at https://www.bitmex.com/app/fees
[2015-08-31 16:29:20] j8 : ok, cool.
[2015-08-31 17:03:26] notyourmother : just moved here from OKCoin.
[2015-08-31 17:13:44] BitMEX_Sam : notyourmother: Nice to see you here
[2015-08-31 17:19:58] rodrigobwn : Hi Sam
[2015-08-31 17:20:45] rodrigobwn : I am checking the System before move some Assets from other exchange
[2015-08-31 17:21:33] rodrigobwn : the futures are the XBT7D, this contract is the sme as weeklies?
[2015-08-31 17:22:09] rodrigobwn : the index price is the Mark Price?
[2015-08-31 17:22:44] rodrigobwn : can you provide a HangOut to explain how the features works for us
[2015-08-31 17:22:46] rodrigobwn : ?
[2015-08-31 17:23:38] rodrigobwn : I believe a lot of guys will watch that, we need a better place
[2015-08-31 17:27:37] BitMEX_Sam : rodrigobwn: Yeah, we have a number of tutorials and a video that should help
[2015-08-31 17:27:54] BitMEX_Sam : See https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NEMjYgPjQX0
[2015-08-31 17:28:02] BitMEX_Sam : All of the relevant information has tooltips that should help as well.
[2015-08-31 17:28:23] BitMEX_Sam : Every contract has an expiration date. If you're coming from OKC you probably want to use the XBT series which has 25x
[2015-08-31 17:28:36] rodrigobwn : ok
[2015-08-31 17:29:01] rodrigobwn : I will check it and call you with doubs
[2015-08-31 17:52:36] jillhomebrew619 : where is my ref link
[2015-08-31 18:10:28] STRML_phone : Go to the Account section on the sidebar, affiliate program information is there
[2015-08-31 19:06:26] WRA|GoudaCoin : you guys going to fuck usd peeps too like okcoin?
[2015-08-31 19:07:02] BitMEX_Sam : WRA|GoudaCoin: Not planning on it.
[2015-08-31 19:07:24] WRA|GoudaCoin : can i tweet that? my help bring vol over :D
[2015-08-31 19:07:27] WRA|GoudaCoin : i move my btc out
[2015-08-31 19:07:37] BitMEX_Sam : Tweet whatever you like!
[2015-08-31 19:07:55] BitMEX_Sam : I'm not saying it'll never happen - we can't know where regulation is headed.
[2015-08-31 19:08:01] BitMEX_Sam : But I can tell you for sure that we will give notice.
[2015-08-31 19:12:10] WRA|GoudaCoin : https://twitter.com/gouda_coin/status/638428937777840128
[2015-08-31 19:12:12] WRA|GoudaCoin : retweet
[2015-08-31 19:12:13] WRA|GoudaCoin : thanks
[2015-08-31 19:23:50] muirtastic : Yes I value my financial privacy so do not use any sites that require all my personal info.
[2015-08-31 19:24:50] BitMEX_Sam : Yeah, that's 100% understandable.
[2015-08-31 19:47:26] gustavo7 : oh god the english in that customer support
[2015-08-31 19:52:56] WRA|GoudaCoin : and its a copy paste template
[2015-08-31 19:53:01] WRA|GoudaCoin : everyone gets that with the same mistakes :D
[2015-08-31 20:04:36] gustavo7 : m(
[2015-08-31 20:06:33] gustavo7 : moving my coins 796 -> bitmex
[2015-08-31 20:15:08] gustavo7 : wow bitgo lets you send with the amound received at just 1/6 confirmations
[2015-08-31 20:17:53] BitMEX_Sam : That seems optimistic
[2015-08-31 20:18:08] BitMEX_Sam : Depends a lot on how they control outgoing Bitcoin
[2015-08-31 20:25:18] gustavo7 : i guess they use something like live.blockcypher.com
[2015-08-31 20:26:01] BitMEX_Sam : Yes, there are ways to improve confidence by measuring block propagation
[2015-08-31 20:26:09] gustavo7 : it displays a confidence on unconfirmed tx, which usually shoots to 99% easily
[2015-08-31 20:27:07] BitMEX_Sam : That's a great site, clearly superior to bc.info
[2015-08-31 20:27:32] gustavo7 : oh there are many great now
[2015-08-31 20:28:04] gustavo7 : bitgo switched from blockr.io to blocktrail
[2015-08-31 20:28:39] gustavo7 : this exchange uses tradeblock right?
[2015-08-31 20:29:14] BitMEX_Sam : Yep
[2015-08-31 20:29:58] BitMEX_Sam : The confidence paper from blockcypher is very interesting. Appears they can do many deposits in about 10 seconds with very high confidence
[2015-08-31 20:31:11] BitMEX_Sam : Seems like a necessary step for any POS system
[2015-08-31 20:33:23] gustavo7 : so at least almost instant transactions are working
[2015-08-31 20:39:29] BitMEX_Sam : Within a confidence interval, yeah
[2015-08-31 20:39:52] BitMEX_Sam : So as a vendor you just calculate how much you're willing to lose. Of course, that's just like anything else and ~99.8% within 10s is quite good.
[2015-08-31 20:54:14] cengel : number of times ive heard anyone complain about double spend: 0
[2015-08-31 21:33:50] zanza : credit card processors can do it
[2015-08-31 22:59:09] dandoney : I'd like a little advice as a newbie. I'm long on BTC and want to set a short term 2 week hedge position to protect my investment. What is the best strategy.
[2015-08-31 22:59:52] BitMEX_Sam : dandoney: If you're looking to hedge the USD value of your Bitcoin, you can sell XBU futures to do so.
[2015-08-31 23:00:01] BitMEX_Sam : Each XBU contract is worth $100 of Bitcoin at expiry, no matter the Bitcoin price.
[2015-08-31 23:01:32] dandoney : where can I read about the contract? any recommended reading?
[2015-08-31 23:01:46] BitMEX_Sam : dandoney: Sure. Definitely read the FAQ to get started: https://www.bitmex.com/app/faq
[2015-08-31 23:02:15] BitMEX_Sam : The specification of the contract you'll want to trade is likely useful: https://www.bitmex.com/app/contract/XBUU15
[2015-08-31 23:02:35] BitMEX_Sam : We also have a basic guide to hedging: https://www.bitmex.com/app/lesson4#hedging
[2015-08-31 23:04:24] dandoney : very helpful! thanks Sam
[2015-08-31 23:13:57] WRA|GoudaCoin : where you long from
[2015-08-31 23:14:09] WRA|GoudaCoin : i see doom coming on btc
[2015-09-01 01:10:35] zanza : fees tomorrow!
[2015-09-01 01:52:48] zanza : I see higher volume lately, did anyone else notice that ?
[2015-09-01 02:57:33] mitzip : you're welcome
[2015-09-01 03:43:52] zanza : whale spotted
[2015-09-01 03:45:18] mitzip : I'm a big fish in a little pond... lol I continually ask all the sizes of fish, whales included to join me and make me a small fish again
[2015-09-01 03:45:50] mitzip : like gandi or someone said... "be the liquidity you want to see in the world"
[2015-09-01 04:19:25] zanza : yup it was ghandi
[2015-09-01 06:31:00] chromaticcr : smaill fish swims by...
[2015-09-01 06:51:42] laisee : mitzip: "Everyone thinks of changing the world, but no one thinks of changing himself"
[2015-09-01 07:27:26] zanza : this site interface/layout here is great
[2015-09-01 07:32:07] zanza : oil spiking to near 50's again
[2015-09-01 09:26:46] vbmithr : hey
[2015-09-01 10:33:58] chromaticcr : zanza: imho, looks professional and compact. Not too long for me to hands on
[2015-09-01 11:25:04] vbmithr : I have BitMEX data available in Sierra Chart for those interested
[2015-09-01 13:28:30] vbmithr : What did you think about my request of having websocket data without websocket ?
[2015-09-01 13:30:05] DunningKruger : Guess that guy who bought XLT7D for $2 over spot wasn't too happy...
[2015-09-01 13:34:26] BitMEX_Sam : vbmithr: For now I think it's more complexity than we're willing to deal with for the small optimization, as we'd have to deal with message framing to make it work - even though it would be a bit faster
[2015-09-01 13:34:35] BitMEX_Sam : vbmithr: I think the point will be moot once we have FIX
[2015-09-01 13:35:40] vbmithr : yeah
[2015-09-01 13:35:55] vbmithr : I just say this because I'm struggling a bit with my websocket library :)
[2015-09-01 13:36:29] BitMEX_Sam : Well, raw TCP is likely not going to make it any easier. What's the issue with the WS?
[2015-09-01 13:37:20] vbmithr : mmh, no issue
[2015-09-01 13:37:38] vbmithr : just that I am writing an OCaml websocket lib
[2015-09-01 13:38:06] vbmithr : No but really, I can't complain :)
[2015-09-01 13:39:00] BitMEX_Sam : From scratch? Surprised there isn't something available
[2015-09-01 13:39:20] vbmithr : I wrote the "something available"
[2015-09-01 13:39:26] vbmithr : Yeah apparently nobody else wrote it before me
[2015-09-01 13:39:35] vbmithr : ocaml not much used in the web
[2015-09-01 13:39:38] BitMEX_Sam : So I see
[2015-09-01 13:40:04] vbmithr : You want to support FIX at some point ?
[2015-09-01 13:40:30] BitMEX_Sam : Yeah it's on the roadmap.
[2015-09-01 13:40:34] vbmithr : have a look at this, too: http://blinkprotocol.org/
[2015-09-01 13:40:36] vbmithr : It's interesting.
[2015-09-01 13:40:45] vbmithr : Though I don't know how much it is used
[2015-09-01 13:40:51] vbmithr : It has been created by FIX people I believe
[2015-09-01 13:40:59] BitMEX_Sam : Interesting
[2015-09-01 13:41:08] BitMEX_Sam : Yeah if we had our way we would just send the kdb+ binary format down the pipe
[2015-09-01 13:41:15] BitMEX_Sam : Very exact, very compact, same layout as used in memory
[2015-09-01 13:41:27] BitMEX_Sam : But of course, nobody outside of finance knows how to read it.
[2015-09-01 13:41:44] vbmithr : You could do that easily ?
[2015-09-01 13:41:47] BitMEX_Sam : Very easily
[2015-09-01 13:42:20] BitMEX_Sam : But FIX will likely be the next public-facing protocol because of vendor support
[2015-09-01 13:44:00] vbmithr : I store time series data in leveldb
[2015-09-01 13:44:02] vbmithr : for my project
[2015-09-01 13:46:43] BitMEX_Sam : I hear good things
[2015-09-01 13:46:43] vbmithr : what's the good things about kdb+ ?
[2015-09-01 13:46:59] BitMEX_Sam : kdb+ is used by every tier1 bank for trade data
[2015-09-01 13:47:18] BitMEX_Sam : It's fast, concise, great at vector processing and can be accelerated via AVX instructions on a modern CPU or even a GPU
[2015-09-01 13:47:45] BitMEX_Sam : Of course a lot of market processing is inherently serial so it's built to be the fastest possible system for that
[2015-09-01 13:50:50] vbmithr : ok, I see
[2015-09-01 14:15:46] SnackyCoins : bitfx.info upgraded with dark theme and multichart options :)
[2015-09-01 14:19:56] BitMEX_Sam : Nice
[2015-09-01 14:20:49] BitMEX_Sam : SnackyCoins: I see you have a settlement clock, let me know if you need any help getting price data on there
[2015-09-01 14:20:58] BitMEX_Sam : Also I hate to be that guy, but it's `BitMEX`, not `BitMex` :)
[2015-09-01 14:21:41] SnackyCoins : oh snap it sure is, i'll go ahead and change it now in my source so it will make it in the next push :)
[2015-09-01 14:22:09] SnackyCoins : also just discovered my dark theme doesnt play nice on the individual pages, so that will probably be today lol
[2015-09-01 14:23:16] SnackyCoins : i do have plan for a lot of MEX prices when I add a few different tabs for price tickers (fx focused, commodities focused, crypto futures focused, etc)
[2015-09-01 14:27:25] BitMEX_Sam : Sounds good.
[2015-09-01 14:28:46] SnackyCoins : already done actually (and i always forget to set the listen back to port 80 when i'm done testing, blah)
[2015-09-01 14:34:27] vbmithr : what's turnover ?
[2015-09-01 14:34:34] vbmithr : "instrument", // instrument updates including turnover and bid/ask
[2015-09-01 14:39:53] BitMEX_Sam : vbmithr: Turnover is the value of the contracts traded in the current session
[2015-09-01 14:40:00] BitMEX_Wally : vbmithr: volume is number of contracts traded, turnover is value of contracts traded in Satoshi
[2015-09-01 14:40:10] BitMEX_Wally : Hah, snap
[2015-09-01 14:40:18] BitMEX_Sam : vbmithr: If you're on the site and change to the advanced view, and expand the instruments panel on the bottom, you'll see tooltips for every column
[2015-09-01 14:42:41] vbmithr : Ok I switched to advanced
[2015-09-01 14:43:16] vbmithr : in the API explorer ?
[2015-09-01 14:43:19] vbmithr : I'm a bit lost
[2015-09-01 14:43:29] BitMEX_Sam : In the main site - there's an options dialog on the top right
[2015-09-01 14:43:37] BitMEX_Sam : We have an older trade layout a lot of users still like so we kept it around
[2015-09-01 14:43:40] BitMEX_Sam : It shows a lot more information
[2015-09-01 14:44:08] vbmithr : yes
[2015-09-01 14:44:14] vbmithr : I switched that to advanced
[2015-09-01 14:44:23] BitMEX_Sam : Yep. Then fullscreen the instruments panel at the very bottom
[2015-09-01 14:44:32] BitMEX_Sam : You'll see all the raw columns and explanations of each column if you hover over the header
[2015-09-01 14:46:07] vbmithr : got it
[2015-09-01 14:47:25] vbmithr : and when is the turnover streamed to websocket ?
[2015-09-01 14:48:25] BitMEX_Sam : Every time it updates
[2015-09-01 14:50:29] vbmithr : ok
[2015-09-01 14:50:42] vbmithr : derivatives is more complicated than spot… :)
[2015-09-01 14:50:55] vbmithr : But it's good, I'm learning new things
[2015-09-01 14:52:39] BitMEX_Sam : Yes, much more complicated. :)
[2015-09-01 15:22:02] vbmithr : Sam: nice dashboard but eats all my CPU…
[2015-09-01 15:22:46] horlicks_ : On the topic of FIX, take a look at SBE commissioned by CME: http://mechanical-sympathy.blogspot.com/2014/05/simple-binary-encoding.html
[2015-09-01 15:24:50] BitMEX_Sam : vbmithr: It shouldn't, it usually averages about 12-15% CPU while active and about 2-3% while inactive or less, depending on browser
[2015-09-01 15:24:59] BitMEX_Sam : Thanks for the link horlicks_
[2015-09-01 15:28:27] vbmithr : I exagerated a bit maybe…
[2015-09-01 15:32:43] vbmithr : Do you have a testnet websocket endpoint btw ?
[2015-09-01 15:33:05] BitMEX_Sam : vbmithr: Yep, same as the production one, just sub `www` for `testnet`
[2015-09-01 15:34:28] vbmithr : ok
[2015-09-01 15:34:35] vbmithr : just understood that testnet was based on bitcoin testnet :)
[2015-09-01 15:39:02] BitMEX_Sam : Yep - otherwise it's the same platform
[2015-09-01 15:53:38] vbmithr : really cool
[2015-09-01 15:55:57] chromaticcr : If I recall correctly, some features like UI stuff will go live on testnet first for geeks to have fun,get ready, and give feedbacks
[2015-09-01 15:59:39] BitMEX_Sam : Yep. For instance there's some minor UI changes on there now
[2015-09-01 16:20:58] gustavo7 : *yawn*
[2015-09-01 18:01:31] vbmithr : really not for amateurs, derivatives
[2015-09-01 18:01:49] vbmithr : I guess you have the time to learn about it when you do a business school
[2015-09-01 18:20:10] vbmithr : how does quantos actually hedge from exchange rate risk.
[2015-09-01 18:20:15] vbmithr : I don't understand the mechanism
[2015-09-01 18:22:03] BitMEX_Sam : Quanto contracts generally aren't used for hedging because of their non-linear payoffs
[2015-09-01 18:22:28] BitMEX_Sam : If the price moves too much in either direction you'll blow the hedge if you're using quanto contracts
[2015-09-01 18:24:38] vbmithr : ok
[2015-09-01 18:24:53] vbmithr : need to learn this…
[2015-09-01 18:25:14] BitMEX_Sam : Definite take a look at https://www.bitmex.com/app/faq#what-is-the-difference-between-xbu-and-xbt-bitcoin-futures
[2015-09-01 18:25:23] BitMEX_Sam : Sorry about the link, isn't handling dashes properly
[2015-09-01 18:25:31] BitMEX_Sam : <a href="https://www.bitmex.com/app/faq#what-is-the-difference-between-xbu-and-xbt-bitcoin-futures">FAQ</a>
[2015-09-01 18:25:42] BitMEX_Sam : Ah you're on IRC anyway. So it should work for you
[2015-09-01 18:27:18] vbmithr : yeah
[2015-09-01 18:27:24] vbmithr : the first link was good :)
[2015-09-01 18:27:50] vbmithr : why do people trade derivatives in the first place ?
[2015-09-01 18:28:17] vbmithr : I understand the hedging use case
[2015-09-01 18:28:21] vbmithr : i.e. you are a bitcoin miner
[2015-09-01 18:28:34] BitMEX_Sam : For speculators there's higher leverage to enjoy,
[2015-09-01 18:28:45] vbmithr : or, yes, want to trade other things than the price like the volatility
[2015-09-01 18:28:48] BitMEX_Sam : The ability to make guaranteed or semi-guaranteed profit from premiums,
[2015-09-01 18:29:02] BitMEX_Sam : no swap rates, and no need to deal with fiat
[2015-09-01 18:29:57] BitMEX_Sam : A really nice part is being able to trade other currencies/indices without having to hold the actual asset itself, much like a CFD
[2015-09-01 18:30:11] vbmithr : yeah, I see
[2015-09-01 18:30:17] vbmithr : It's a sort of proxy to anything else
[2015-09-01 18:30:56] BitMEX_Sam : Yep. So we can trade Litecoin or Ether on here without having to actually hold it. In the future, perhaps, other worldwide indices
[2015-09-01 18:31:33] j8 : the `ETH` futures market was really interesting at the start when supply of physical eth was constrained
[2015-09-01 18:32:09] BitMEX_Sam : For sure
[2015-09-01 18:32:11] j8 : everyone knew it was going to dump, but no one had actual eth to dump
[2015-09-01 18:32:22] vbmithr : I see
[2015-09-01 18:32:45] BitMEX_Sam : Yeah, ETH7D was trading at less than half of spot because it wasn't possible to sell on other markets for some time
[2015-09-01 18:41:13] vbmithr : I just understood that arbitraging is…
[2015-09-01 18:41:35] vbmithr : more interesting on derivatives than spot
[2015-09-01 18:42:14] BitMEX_Sam : Yes, much more. And you can use it as a hedge for spot arb while you sit through transaction delays
[2015-09-01 18:57:32] vbmithr : what is a "trading session" here ?
[2015-09-01 18:57:36] vbmithr : 24h vs "trading session"
[2015-09-01 18:57:48] BitMEX_Sam : 8hrs
[2015-09-01 18:58:00] BitMEX_Sam : On XBU that's when the limit up / limit down are reset
[2015-09-01 18:59:14] vbmithr : Can I know the number of trades per symbol ?
[2015-09-01 19:01:37] vbmithr : and the daily number of trades ?
[2015-09-01 19:04:54] BitMEX_Sam : https://www.bitmex.com/api/explorer/#!/stats/find
[2015-09-01 19:05:19] BitMEX_Sam : We don't actually expose the raw # of trades, just volume and turnover, if you wanted to figure out how many trades happened per day you could do a per-symbol call to /trade and filter between dates
[2015-09-01 19:09:11] vbmithr : okay
[2015-09-01 19:09:20] vbmithr : I just implement a basic DTC interface
[2015-09-01 19:09:29] vbmithr : I'm gonna keep harder to implement things for later.
[2015-09-01 19:09:38] vbmithr : It turns out to be not-so-hard
[2015-09-01 19:14:49] j8 : big arbs with okc weekly and quarterly these days
[2015-09-01 19:16:50] j8 : they really overreact over there
[2015-09-01 19:23:09] vbmithr : interesting :)
[2015-09-01 19:23:17] vbmithr : Ok, so I'm doing good progress with DTC to BitMEX
[2015-09-01 19:23:44] vbmithr : In one week or two you will be able to trade on bitmex with Sierra Chart beta
[2015-09-01 19:23:54] vbmithr : and for free :p
[2015-09-01 19:28:17] vbmithr : Congratulation BitMEX, you're the first exchange that is not a pita to map to the DTC protocol
[2015-09-01 19:29:36] j8 : very cool, haven't used it, is it really free or free trial software?
[2015-09-02 00:18:48] TraderStefan : I like the new fee schedule
[2015-09-02 00:20:39] TraderStefan : Glad that BitMEX will be making some revenue
[2015-09-02 01:47:59] chromaticcr : J8, just keep an eye on the horrible.clawback that could happen over at Chinese platforms.... Got burned doing that like twice already
[2015-09-02 01:49:13] j8 : chromaticcr: yeah, i'm aware it's playing with fire.
[2015-09-02 02:19:29] BitMEX_Arthur : Morning traders
[2015-09-02 02:19:40] BitMEX_Arthur : China is dumping again
[2015-09-02 02:31:28] j8 : spam attack is underway.
[2015-09-02 02:34:31] j8 : they're sure spending a lot on fees to make a point
[2015-09-02 02:35:52] zanza : morning Arthur
[2015-09-02 02:45:44] joequant : I'm not see a bitcoin dump. I'm seeing a Shanghai stock dump.
[2015-09-02 02:46:06] joequant : Shanghai has still another 20% to go, the PE ratios are still too high.
[2015-09-02 02:48:50] bitcoinvsevil : Sam here?
[2015-09-02 02:50:56] BitMEX_Sam : bitcoinvsevil: Yeah, what's up?
[2015-09-02 03:15:05] lolcookie : wtf someone shorting like mad
[2015-09-02 03:15:47] lolcookie : just blew up the bids on xbt7d
[2015-09-02 03:23:13] lolcookie : BitMEX_Sam: do you guys have plans for trailing stops? Setting a bunch of limit orders is annoying
[2015-09-02 03:29:34] cengel : you mean stop limit orders
[2015-09-02 03:32:49] Matthew.v : how about dem bergs?
[2015-09-02 03:35:19] lolcookie : no cengel i mean trailing stops
[2015-09-02 03:35:39] lolcookie : lol stop limit is equally annoying
[2015-09-02 03:51:23] cengel : trailing stop would require stop limits. limit will only take profit
[2015-09-02 03:59:22] lolcookie : stop limit doesnt follow the price what are you talking about
[2015-09-02 04:10:01] cengel : feel free to learn what a trailing stop is: http://www.investopedia.com/articles/trading/03/080603.asp
[2015-09-02 04:13:06] cengel : @lolcookie ^
[2015-09-02 04:24:01] BitMEX_Wally : lolcookie: What I think cengel is saying, is that because we do not support Trailing Stops, instead you have to place and cancel many Stop Limit orders?
[2015-09-02 04:25:03] BitMEX_Wally : If you were long and had a stop sell order, as the price rises you keep adjusting the stop price upwards?
[2015-09-02 04:34:16] lolcookie : yeah which is a pain in the ass
[2015-09-02 04:34:50] lolcookie : I literally wake up and find the book has been blown while I was asleep and lose out on a good trade
[2015-09-02 04:41:48] chromaticcr : joequant: I see a global dump instead, just that China would go first, HODL Bitcoin lol
[2015-09-02 04:42:14] BitMEX_Arthur : chromaticcr: We need some more price action in Bitcoin
[2015-09-02 04:42:16] BitMEX_Arthur : this shit is boring
[2015-09-02 04:42:35] BitMEX_Arthur : Fuck HODL, 25x leveraged futures :)
[2015-09-02 04:43:36] chromaticcr : BitMEX_Arthur: Haha, I guess that is too much for a long term hedge against the collapsing financial system. Leave the 25x for Chinese :wink:
[2015-09-02 04:44:08] BitMEX_Arthur : chromaticcr: You can HODL `XBTH16`
[2015-09-02 04:46:21] chromaticcr : Ya, saw your article yesterday. Perhaps @joequant you will be interested in this piece too
[2015-09-02 04:51:53] thegloryofgod : Hello to all...I just joined - I am a Chris Dunn Bitcoin mentor student. Anyone here from Chris Dunn ? Also this 20 x leverage- we can short as well? Is it truly a 25 leverage and what are the true costs in fees when all is said and done? Anyone here mind sharing their honest experience here at Bitmex...? Thanks all in advance
[2015-09-02 04:53:33] BitMEX_Arthur : thegloryofgod: Hi
[2015-09-02 04:54:28] BitMEX_Arthur : I would love to answer all your questions in detail, I will shoot you an email and we can talk out of this chat so it's faster
[2015-09-02 04:55:43] thegloryofgod : Hello all...sorry for the newbie feel...I'm just pumped and need to read all first...cool: Kleimang@bellsouth.net
[2015-09-02 04:56:16] thegloryofgod : Coinsetter or Krakken..anyone?
[2015-09-02 04:57:59] miratrader : thegloryofgod, my honest experience (trading here since June): very good platform, people who run it are always here answering questions, issues are fixed fast. Liquidity is a bit low but improving.
[2015-09-02 05:09:49] thegloryofgod : Miratrader: thank you...how is the actual 25x leverage working out- the bottom line and what others are directly experiencing...sorry this isn't a late night interrogation- I'm just excited and wary
[2015-09-02 05:14:59] lolcookie : someone bear xlt pls
[2015-09-02 05:24:19] lolcookie : what is coin even doing right now
[2015-09-02 05:25:20] zanza : this site/interface is the best of any site I have used, very quick/easy/responsive
[2015-09-02 05:25:44] zanza : hopefully liquidity improves, and possible adding some interesting contracts as well for the future
[2015-09-02 05:30:33] chromaticcr : hello guys~ Just a ping to see if y'all are good coding people or quantitive guys, there are some nice API to use here
[2015-09-02 05:43:41] BitMEX_Arthur : Basic explanation of how 25x leverage works, https://blog.bitmex.com/how-to-trade-with-25x-leverage/
[2015-09-02 05:52:59] zanza : Arthur you need to start giving examples where people lose their shirts :)
[2015-09-02 05:53:39] BitMEX_Arthur : Think happy thoughts
[2015-09-02 05:55:43] BitMEX_Arthur : More happy thoughts, more counterparties
[2015-09-02 06:32:24] lolcookie : I rarely go over 10x leverage
[2015-09-02 06:32:33] lolcookie : prefer to hang around 5
[2015-09-02 06:32:46] lolcookie : greed is almost always punished
[2015-09-02 06:39:26] zanza : higher leverage means you can get bossed around also
[2015-09-02 07:34:26] zanza : XBTZ15 has some nice volume
[2015-09-02 07:40:14] TInvest : jeepers bitstamp is a mess
[2015-09-02 07:40:26] BitMEX_Arthur : What's going on there
[2015-09-02 07:41:38] TInvest : oh just the travel on a 5 minute candle
[2015-09-02 07:41:41] TInvest : bouncy bouncy
[2015-09-02 07:42:50] TInvest : i think more of the trade is sitting outside the bollinger bands on 5min than inside
[2015-09-02 07:44:11] TInvest : first place I trade though, thought that was just par for hte course
[2015-09-02 07:56:42] bitcoinvsevil : hi
[2015-09-02 07:57:07] bitcoinvsevil : Arthur here?
[2015-09-02 07:57:17] BitMEX_Arthur : bitcoinvsevil: How can I help
[2015-09-02 07:58:14] bitcoinvsevil : I am interested in your service.....am I seeing an easy as pie cash/carry trade with your xbt and futures contract?
[2015-09-02 07:58:31] BitMEX_Arthur : What questions do you have about that strategy
[2015-09-02 07:58:57] bitcoinvsevil : Well....sometimes things look too good to be true....
[2015-09-02 07:59:33] bitcoinvsevil : So for example.....if I did a 25 dollar spread with Dec......that's cash in my pocket?
[2015-09-02 07:59:50] BitMEX_Arthur : Basically because XBT is linear in Bitcoin terms, but quadratic in USD terms, if the price trades outside a upper or lower bound you will lose money
[2015-09-02 08:00:26] BitMEX_Arthur : But you can solve for the upper and lower bound pre-trade and make a judgement if you think the volatility will be greater than the spread between the two bounds
[2015-09-02 08:00:28] bitcoinvsevil : How is that if I own the underlined commodity?
[2015-09-02 08:00:53] BitMEX_Arthur : That assumes you buy spot and sell future so that at the beginning your XBT and USD exposure is flat
[2015-09-02 08:01:01] BitMEX_Arthur : these exposures will change as the spot price moves
[2015-09-02 08:01:09] BitMEX_Arthur : because of the payoff properties of the XBT series
[2015-09-02 08:01:12] bitcoinvsevil : That is the example I used.
[2015-09-02 08:01:47] BitMEX_Arthur : https://blog.bitmex.com/xbt-vs-xbu-chain/
[2015-09-02 08:02:02] bitcoinvsevil : Why can't I just cover with bitcoin?
[2015-09-02 08:02:07] BitMEX_Arthur : you can
[2015-09-02 08:02:24] BitMEX_Arthur : but that article gives you an explanation of the return profile of the 25x leveraged futures
[2015-09-02 08:02:39] bitcoinvsevil : So how would I lose if I sold the future....but held bitcoin?
[2015-09-02 08:03:04] BitMEX_Arthur : Assume that you dynamically hedge as the price moves to keep your USD exposure flat
[2015-09-02 08:03:11] bitcoinvsevil : I'm not asking about leverage
[2015-09-02 08:03:20] BitMEX_Arthur : as the price rises you buy bitcoin, as the price falls you sell bitcoin
[2015-09-02 08:03:25] BitMEX_Arthur : so you are short volatility
[2015-09-02 08:03:41] bitcoinvsevil : But that is not the strategy I am asking about.
[2015-09-02 08:03:59] BitMEX_Arthur : You want to buy Bitcoin and short `XBTZ15` for example?
[2015-09-02 08:04:03] bitcoinvsevil : I'm buying bitcoin at 100. Selling DEC for 125.....
[2015-09-02 08:04:13] bitcoinvsevil : collecting $25