This is a mirror of the original BitMEX trollbox archive that used to be online here.
BitMEX disabled their archive after the DDOS attack so I have decided to make my mirror publicly available.

Well now, a few days after I made this mirror available to the public, the original archive from BitMEX is online again.
But since it is still limited (neutered to the last few hundred messages) I will keep my FULL mirror alive.

You have access to more than 50 million trollbox posts. This is more than 7 gigabyte of data hosted on a $5 server so please be patient or consider a donation

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[2016-06-15 10:12:25] jung1 : 500 could be awesome
[2016-06-15 10:14:15] Mr Blue : That wouldn't be awesome lol, I'm long average entry 680
[2016-06-15 10:16:13] billz : 500 is wishful thinking
[2016-06-15 10:17:01] jung1 : yeah I know
[2016-06-15 10:17:08] jung1 : maybe in 6months from now
[2016-06-15 10:17:13] jung1 : but who know
[2016-06-15 10:17:27] jung1 : maybe satoshi will dump his coins on next bubble
[2016-06-15 10:19:17] Mr Blue : Ye an build the great buy wall of China just under it lol.. not that I believe in Satoshi
[2016-06-15 10:31:06] jung1 : even if you do not belive in him
[2016-06-15 10:31:15] jung1 : he sitting now on $700mln
[2016-06-15 10:31:51] Mr Blue : jung1: some entity is for sure, but I believe it's the global elites
[2016-06-15 10:31:51] Bitcoingirl : will we hold 675
[2016-06-15 10:31:53] Bitcoingirl : that is the question
[2016-06-15 10:32:16] BTCDJS : yes
[2016-06-15 10:32:33] BTCDJS : or no
[2016-06-15 10:33:00] BTCDJS : no matter which way we go I will be right
[2016-06-15 10:33:15] BTCDJS : and I will come out and say I called it
[2016-06-15 10:33:32] jung1 : yeah rich with money or experience
[2016-06-15 10:36:41] BTCDJS : bitcoin always pumps on the weekend. So i may have made a mistake going long ?
[2016-06-15 10:43:01] Mr Blue : BTCDJS: what entry price?
[2016-06-15 10:43:50] rapidtrades : 666
[2016-06-15 10:46:04] jung1 : scary one
[2016-06-15 10:46:18] Mr Blue : rapidtrades: I'll buy more at that level if we drop ? pic might be trolling but seems to be pumping
[2016-06-15 10:46:37] Mr Blue : Woodchopper lol
[2016-06-15 10:46:50] BTCDJS : 679.7. Looked like strong resistance but I think now there will still be room to go down to 670
[2016-06-15 10:47:40] Mr Blue : BTCDJS: I'm in at 680 was 690 but lowered it
[2016-06-15 10:48:56] jung1 : https://rise.vision/
[2016-06-15 10:48:56] jung1 : lisk clone
[2016-06-15 10:53:20] rapidtrades : us needs to stop freaking out on every china selling....we're still $15 below them
[2016-06-15 10:53:45] Mr Blue : I thought Lisk was just a token on the ETH blockchain anybody can create by adding code to ETH blockchain?, I mean couldn't I added a bit of a lolcat to Eth blockchain and create a new 100 million tokens?
[2016-06-15 10:53:57] rapidtrades : noone cares what lisk is
[2016-06-15 10:54:12] Mr Blue : Gif*
[2016-06-15 10:55:47] Mr Blue : My point is how can it be cloned? Doesn't have it's own blockchain dies it?
[2016-06-15 10:55:54] Mr Blue : Does it*
[2016-06-15 10:56:51] aethlios : Mr Blue: lisk different coin blockchain,
[2016-06-15 10:57:46] jung1 : Mr Blue: lisk it not eth clone
[2016-06-15 10:58:08] Mr Blue : aethlios: ahh sounds okay then, might be worth a research , if it was just token on Eth blockchain would be fucked
[2016-06-15 10:59:10] jung1 : http://i.imgur.com/K7JAkvq.jpg
[2016-06-15 10:59:33] Mr Blue : jung1: what also is it?
[2016-06-15 10:59:35] aethlios : Mr Blue: it is a different coin-platform similar to eth, tries to offer similar products (smart contracts) like eth blockchain.
[2016-06-15 10:59:45] Mr Blue : Algo*
[2016-06-15 11:00:01] jung1 : Mr Blue: http://i.imgur.com/K7JAkvq.jpg
[2016-06-15 11:01:02] Mr Blue : aethlios: I've seen others with smart contact features, but I think something is in the works about that for Bitcoin?
[2016-06-15 11:02:10] Mr Blue : Lightning network ?? Or is that one just for fast blockchain transactions?
[2016-06-15 11:03:26] aethlios : Mr Blue: there is something called sidechains to work parallel to btc, but I don't know how far they have come. I am more in the trading sector, but also try to learn the tech behind in order to make decisions. The tech behind each crypto is the fundamentals of a stock-company. So a lot of research needed.
[2016-06-15 11:04:01] aethlios : Mr Blue: lighting is for transactions and the block size issue solution.
[2016-06-15 11:04:05] Mr Blue : aethlios: true +1 to that
[2016-06-15 11:04:32] jung1 : in '16 there will be huge bubble on all daos
[2016-06-15 11:04:40] jung1 : similar do dotcom bubble
[2016-06-15 11:04:46] jung1 : maybe a bit smaller
[2016-06-15 11:04:50] jung1 : but who knows
[2016-06-15 11:05:41] rapidtrades : what's with the volatility here
[2016-06-15 11:06:09] aethlios : Mr Blue: this year I invested in Lisk ico only and my next target is Zcash. 2 years of development and in September it starts. https://z.cash/
[2016-06-15 11:07:23] aethlios : but I didn't got in eth, I knew about it but I didn't risk it.
[2016-06-15 11:07:57] aethlios : rapidtrades: a bot must lost it.... it trades 9000
[2016-06-15 11:08:05] Mr Blue : aethlios: cool I'll look in to it
[2016-06-15 11:09:02] jung1 : aethlios: oh its still alive, I heard about it back in '14
[2016-06-15 11:09:33] aethlios : jung1: a lot of development happening, and a big team.
[2016-06-15 11:10:08] jung1 : btw this is why Im thinking that all dao/blockchain bubble actually start
[2016-06-15 11:10:09] aethlios : jung1: no ico, mining from the 1st coin. so not a fast profit.
[2016-06-15 11:10:49] jung1 : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_highest_funded_crowdfunding_projects 5 of 20 biggest crowdfunding project ever are blockchain related
[2016-06-15 11:13:42] jung1 : aethlios: even eth moving on pos in '17
[2016-06-15 11:13:53] jung1 : so dont know if its good
[2016-06-15 11:17:02] jung1 : aethlios: so you are going to invest in minning of z cash
[2016-06-15 11:17:03] jung1 : ?
[2016-06-15 11:18:16] jung1 : or wait until bitmex add zcash perpetual futures and open long right after an never close?
[2016-06-15 11:19:57] aethlios : jung1: I got in lisk with 10.350 usd, received 150.000 coins with 0.07 usd, sold 50.000 with 0.455 usd, so I will invest the 10.350 again. Either buy from exchange or hire mining rigs or mining power fron nicehash, which is cheaper.
[2016-06-15 11:20:53] jung1 : yeah I made similar as you
[2016-06-15 11:21:35] jung1 : sold some my ICO lisks and invest in waves
[2016-06-15 11:22:47] aethlios : jung1: I keep the rest 100.000 for voting profit sharing delegates to earn interest while waiting for the devs to start deliver.
[2016-06-15 11:23:13] jung1 : same :)
[2016-06-15 11:23:19] jung1 : : )
[2016-06-15 11:23:43] aethlios : jung1: safe strategy, and interest earning strategy, or arb!!
[2016-06-15 11:26:54] jung1 : Im thinking of run some site with interesting blockchain project to invest in
[2016-06-15 11:27:13] jung1 : or even dao investment fund
[2016-06-15 11:27:34] rapidtrades : Don't give me dao nao!
[2016-06-15 11:27:37] aethlios : jung1: https://wings.ai/
[2016-06-15 11:27:58] rapidtrades : u guys post the shadiest links
[2016-06-15 11:28:00] jung1 : saw it
[2016-06-15 11:28:22] aethlios : wings is a platform for dao's, the major dev of crypti started it. lisk is based on crypti.
[2016-06-15 11:28:23] rapidtrades : www.tits.ass
[2016-06-15 11:29:14] aethlios : but i want get in wings either, next target zcash, 2 alts investment in a year is ok.
[2016-06-15 11:29:38] rapidtrades : they're not 'investments'
[2016-06-15 11:30:17] jung1 : well imo in this year there will be a lot of good opportunities to earn on dao/blockchain
[2016-06-15 11:31:00] Bacon futures trader : Yehhh buy the dip
[2016-06-15 11:32:02] aethlios : Lisk bought in ico is a good long term investment in the blockchain upps tech, also you earn interest-income while waiting.
[2016-06-15 11:32:43] aethlios : for me who lost eth, lisk was a good opportunity
[2016-06-15 11:33:39] futuretrader : when is th next rebalance]
[2016-06-15 11:33:42] rapidtrades : look at these cunts https://uk.finance.yahoo.com/news/revealed-bosses-final-plea-stay-073912544.html
[2016-06-15 11:33:56] Bacon futures trader : Only succesfull ico I know is eth
[2016-06-15 11:34:04] Bacon futures trader : 9ipo
[2016-06-15 11:34:56] jung1 : Bacon futures trader: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_highest_funded_crowdfunding_projects 5 of 20 biggest crowdfunding project ever are blockchain related
[2016-06-15 11:36:47] rapidtrades : god dam dao is n1....just shows how stupid ppl are
[2016-06-15 11:37:02] rapidtrades : $164,400,000
[2016-06-15 11:37:07] BTCDJS : When the moon hits you eye, like a big pizza pie, thats amore
[2016-06-15 11:37:44] rapidtrades : here that sound folks? its all the $$$ earned during by 'early' adopters going out the window
[2016-06-15 11:38:07] rapidtrades : ok i butchered that but u get my point
[2016-06-15 11:38:41] BTCDJS : rapidtrades: Holders of DAO get rewarded when the projects are successful and make profit.
[2016-06-15 11:38:54] rapidtrades : so never?
[2016-06-15 11:40:23] BTCDJS : Its the first of its kind so maybe or maybe not. But if its successful, it'll be mega successful
[2016-06-15 11:40:38] rapidtrades : hint: it won't
[2016-06-15 11:40:50] BTCDJS : rapidtrades: you don't know that
[2016-06-15 11:41:03] rapidtrades : ur right....but im 95% sure
[2016-06-15 11:41:22] BTCDJS : you're 95% sceptical
[2016-06-15 11:42:26] jung1 : dao did not conviced me. I like the idea but will wait for dao 2.0
[2016-06-15 11:42:44] BTCDJS : jung1: yeah I didn't invest either
[2016-06-15 11:49:10] Bacon futures trader : That dao liquidity lol
[2016-06-15 11:49:34] Bacon futures trader : What's dao market cap?
[2016-06-15 11:49:42] STRML : 0, I think
[2016-06-15 11:53:46] rapidtrades : Scottish Brexit poll: 53% remain 32% leave
[2016-06-15 12:00:47] stf28 : seriously how is that possible every funding f**cks up with wrong numbers
[2016-06-15 12:01:30] rapidtrades : ur bot sucks dude
[2016-06-15 12:02:13] stf28 : yeah i know but it's not my bot which does the funding
[2016-06-15 12:02:28] j8 : what wrong numbers
[2016-06-15 12:03:04] stf28 : bitmex admitted to make wrong counts int unrealised/realised pnl, but this doesn't keep 'em from using it in funding calculations
[2016-06-15 12:03:46] stf28 : i'm really curious to see the extended trade history, i saved everything i can
[2016-06-15 12:04:07] stf28 : wallet balance should be on trade history, why isn't?
[2016-06-15 12:04:55] j8 : dunno people have asked for it for a long time
[2016-06-15 12:05:02] stf28 : shady
[2016-06-15 12:05:17] stf28 : i'm curious to see how will they manage this
[2016-06-15 12:05:26] j8 : my funding transactions are for the right amount. i haven't noticed any problem there
[2016-06-15 12:05:31] rapidtrades : stf28: just use the size of ur position whats the problem
[2016-06-15 12:05:40] rapidtrades : can't u do the calc urself
[2016-06-15 12:05:53] stf28 : yeah and it greatly differs from what happens here
[2016-06-15 12:06:01] rapidtrades : i doubt that
[2016-06-15 12:06:28] BitMEX_Wally : stf28: Please email support@bitmex.com and I can explain all calculations on your account
[2016-06-15 12:06:38] rapidtrades : are u taking into account the fact that ur BTC position decays in btc terms when we go up @stf28
[2016-06-15 12:06:58] stf28 : i don't want you to explain, i want the wallet balance on trade history, retroactively
[2016-06-15 12:07:24] rapidtrades : the funding is right there in ur trading history
[2016-06-15 12:07:38] rapidtrades : along with size...post it
[2016-06-15 12:07:41] j8 : one thing that happens is the mark price rises by an amount equal to the next period's funding.. so if you're short and the funding rate increases you will have more unrealised loss than the realised gain from funding. but you get it eventually
[2016-06-15 12:07:42] stf28 : i want realised profits instantly as losses are
[2016-06-15 12:08:04] j8 : realised profits from funding ARE instant
[2016-06-15 12:08:04] rapidtrades : lol not gonna happen
[2016-06-15 12:08:14] j8 : just not trading profits
[2016-06-15 12:08:21] stf28 : yeah of course, this isn't problem, the problem is that unrealised/realised pnl are broken and this is wwhat is used to calc funding
[2016-06-15 12:08:27] BitMEX_Sam : stf28: No, it is not.
[2016-06-15 12:08:38] BitMEX_Wally : How are they broken?
[2016-06-15 12:08:40] rapidtrades : stf28: u use the size of ur position to calc funding
[2016-06-15 12:08:46] lockhedge : stf28: if you need a python script that calculates your PNL based on your trade history, i can upload it somewhere
[2016-06-15 12:08:52] rapidtrades : profits have 0 to do with funding
[2016-06-15 12:09:07] stf28 : please explain how can i have unrealised pnl of -0.35 since days ?
[2016-06-15 12:09:28] rapidtrades : on what instrument
[2016-06-15 12:09:36] stf28 : position was opened/closed a lot of times, but this doesn't change
[2016-06-15 12:09:48] rapidtrades : on what
[2016-06-15 12:09:58] stf28 : xbtusd
[2016-06-15 12:10:19] j8 : unrealised pnl should be changing with the price. if your position is closed it should be zero
[2016-06-15 12:10:24] stf28 : lockhedge: thanks, curious to see it
[2016-06-15 12:10:52] stf28 : j8: yeah, seems logical, even if it's "perpetual"
[2016-06-15 12:10:52] BitMEX_Wally : Your unrealised PNL is calculated from the last rebalance price to the current mark price
[2016-06-15 12:11:02] BitMEX_Wally : all other PNL is realised
[2016-06-15 12:11:17] stf28 : BitMEX_Wally: yes, so why doesn't it reset at 0 when no position ?
[2016-06-15 12:11:40] stf28 : why profits are witheld and losses instant?
[2016-06-15 12:12:00] rapidtrades : asking the tough questions
[2016-06-15 12:12:13] stf28 : is that a proof of good will?
[2016-06-15 12:12:17] stf28 : i doubt
[2016-06-15 12:12:30] stf28 : why wallet balance isn't shown in trade history ?
[2016-06-15 12:12:50] aethlios : uptrend resumed? what do you think?
[2016-06-15 12:13:09] BitMEX_Sam : stf28: Neither losses nor profits are realised until the next rebalance, in case you go from loss to profit
[2016-06-15 12:13:24] stf28 : BitMEX_Sam: wrong, losses are deducted from wallet instantly
[2016-06-15 12:13:30] BitMEX_Sam : As for wallet balance not being in trade history, that's simply because they're different data sets - we have an open ticket to expand that data
[2016-06-15 12:13:45] stf28 : different data set? why that?
[2016-06-15 12:13:46] BitMEX_Sam : stf28: Not wrong, of course if you lose money it must be deducted as you cannot trade with lost money
[2016-06-15 12:13:51] BitMEX_Sam : They're different tables
[2016-06-15 12:14:08] stf28 : BitMEX_Sam: losses aren't deducted from profit but from wallet
[2016-06-15 12:14:19] BitMEX_Sam : Let's say you have 1 XBT wallet balance and you lose 0.3 XBT and close out. You now have 0.7 wallet balance, -0.3 XBT of which is unrealised pnl
[2016-06-15 12:14:21] stf28 : whereas profit is witheld
[2016-06-15 12:14:25] rapidtrades : ah i see his point
[2016-06-15 12:14:36] BitMEX_Sam : If you make 0.3 XBT, your profit is immediately realised as it has offset your loss
[2016-06-15 12:14:59] rapidtrades : ok cool so ur wrong @stf28
[2016-06-15 12:15:00] BitMEX_Sam : If you make another 0.3 XBT from there, you have 0.3 XBT withheld profit and 0.3 XBT unrealised PNL
[2016-06-15 12:15:06] stf28 : BitMEX_Sam: i bring 1 btc, win 2btc witheld, lose 1 of profit and can't trade why is that?
[2016-06-15 12:15:18] BitMEX_Sam : Were they on different contracts?
[2016-06-15 12:15:22] stf28 : no
[2016-06-15 12:15:46] BitMEX_Sam : Are you being theoretical? I don't see trades of that size in your account from a cursory glance
[2016-06-15 12:15:54] Death : Wtf why do i have 50% of my position ?
[2016-06-15 12:16:10] BitMEX_Wally : If you have currentQty = 0 then unrealisedPNL = 0.
[2016-06-15 12:16:10] stf28 : no of course, i won't bring any serious money here
[2016-06-15 12:16:27] BitMEX_Sam : Okay, then what I will say is that your hypothetical is incorrect
[2016-06-15 12:16:34] Mr Blue : Lmao
[2016-06-15 12:17:29] stf28 : BitMEX_Sam: i have lots of screenshots and data to show it's not theoretical
[2016-06-15 12:17:32] BitMEX_Sam : If you start with 1 XBT, make 2 and lose 1, you have 1 XBT unrealised PNL / witheld profit
[2016-06-15 12:17:33] Mr Blue : stf28: you need money to make money mate, sad fact of life but it's the truth.
[2016-06-15 12:17:46] BitMEX_Wally : Profit is withheld until after rebalance
[2016-06-15 12:17:56] stf28 : BitMEX_Wally: yeah profit is witheld and losses are instant
[2016-06-15 12:18:02] Death : Why am i down 1 btc ?
[2016-06-15 12:18:10] stf28 : BitMEX_Wally: that's normal
[2016-06-15 12:18:47] BitMEX_Sam : Death: Do you want me to discuss account details here or via email?
[2016-06-15 12:19:12] Death : Here
[2016-06-15 12:19:14] stf28 : BitMEX_Sam: yes, and why is that 1 btc not mine after all
[2016-06-15 12:19:20] BitMEX_Sam : stf28: https://www.bitmex.com/app/dynamicProfitEqualisation#contract-settlement-rebalance
[2016-06-15 12:19:24] Death : :)
[2016-06-15 12:19:28] BitMEX_Sam : Death: You shorted at a price $10 below the last rebalance price
[2016-06-15 12:19:37] Death : Yeah so ?
[2016-06-15 12:19:50] BitMEX_Sam : So if you're wondering why you're at a loss, that's why
[2016-06-15 12:19:59] Death : If it goes own 20 now?
[2016-06-15 12:20:04] Death : Down
[2016-06-15 12:20:07] BitMEX_Sam : Then you would be in profit
[2016-06-15 12:20:07] BitMEX_Wally : You'll make it back and more
[2016-06-15 12:20:22] stf28 : BitMEX_Sam: thanks for your explanations this doesn't tell me why instant losses, witheld profit
[2016-06-15 12:20:36] Death : The point is did i get liquidated ?
[2016-06-15 12:20:49] BitMEX_Sam : stf28: As the doc states, profit is withheld because there may be a total system loss before rebalance time
[2016-06-15 12:20:52] BitMEX_Sam : At rebalance profit is realised.
[2016-06-15 12:20:55] BitMEX_Sam : Death: No
[2016-06-15 12:21:07] stf28 : how can you lose MY bitcoin that was not profit
[2016-06-15 12:21:08] BitMEX_Sam : At rebalance, which was 20 minutes ago, unrealised PNL becomes realised
[2016-06-15 12:21:10] stf28 : but MINE
[2016-06-15 12:21:13] Death : Pfff... @stf28 has a point though
[2016-06-15 12:21:21] BitMEX_Sam : stf28: I'm not sure what you're getting at
[2016-06-15 12:21:26] BitMEX_Wally : Your profit is someone else's loss
[2016-06-15 12:21:34] BitMEX_Wally : how do you know they are not bankrupt?
[2016-06-15 12:21:34] stf28 : not profit, my wallet
[2016-06-15 12:21:39] Death : Why no rebalance of lose?
[2016-06-15 12:21:46] Death : Thats what he means
[2016-06-15 12:21:56] Death : Its either one or the other for pl
[2016-06-15 12:22:10] BitMEX_Wally : Realised PNL for the current rebalance interval goes into the wallet and is then immediately withheld until rebalance
[2016-06-15 12:22:19] stf28 : I bring 1 btc, win 2 btc, lose 1 and can't trade anymore even if i brought 1 btc
[2016-06-15 12:22:40] BitMEX_Wally : On the same instrument?
[2016-06-15 12:22:43] stf28 : BitMEX_Wally: yeah, why are you taking my bitcoin in your fund?
[2016-06-15 12:22:50] BitMEX_Wally : We're not
[2016-06-15 12:22:53] stf28 : yeah on the same instrument, as said twice before
[2016-06-15 12:23:05] BitMEX_Wally : It has been withheld, not taken
[2016-06-15 12:23:19] stf28 : witheld in this case means you can't use it
[2016-06-15 12:23:21] BitMEX_Wally : If there is 0% DPE you get it all unlocked at rebalance
[2016-06-15 12:23:36] BitMEX_Sam : You can't use it *right away*, but it is unlocked to you after a short time
[2016-06-15 12:23:47] stf28 : yes, but in the meantime i can't use it even if i didn't lose it
[2016-06-15 12:23:52] stf28 : BitMEX_Sam: short time???
[2016-06-15 12:23:55] stf28 : you kidding
[2016-06-15 12:24:04] stf28 : 8 hours isn't short time in market trading
[2016-06-15 12:24:13] stf28 : especially when it's free money
[2016-06-15 12:24:15] BitMEX_Sam : 1 day is short in these time spans, OKC unlocks in 7 days
[2016-06-15 12:24:38] stf28 : yeah you have nice comparison
[2016-06-15 12:25:10] stf28 : compare to the worst stealers and front runners in this business isn't good i think
[2016-06-15 12:25:33] stf28 : why don't you tell me "even mtgox froze it for months so be happy"
[2016-06-15 12:25:48] BitMEX_Sam : Because we didn't steal it, it is yours after a day and the terms are clearly outlined in the docs
[2016-06-15 12:26:04] yerb : BitMEX_Sam: i dont have an option for clef in my acc setting
[2016-06-15 12:26:16] BitMEX_Sam : yerb: Do you have a different 2FA option set up?
[2016-06-15 12:26:32] stf28 : BitMEX_Sam: so that's your answer here?
[2016-06-15 12:26:40] stf28 : rtfm ?
[2016-06-15 12:26:45] BitMEX_Sam : stf28: The answer is that this is how the contract works and it is very clear in the documentation
[2016-06-15 12:26:47] Death : Realised Pnl is locked?
[2016-06-15 12:26:53] BitMEX_Sam : Every high leverage crypto exchange has a caveat that makes the high leverage possible
[2016-06-15 12:27:02] BitMEX_Sam : It is the trader's responsibility to read the contract specifications
[2016-06-15 12:27:27] BitMEX_Wally : If you have 2 Bitcoin realised PNL (during this rebalance period) and 1 Bitcoin unrealised PNL then the 2 Bitcoin profit are withheld but your net exposure to DPE is 1 Bitcoin
[2016-06-15 12:27:32] yerb : BitMEX_Sam: yeag google 2fa
[2016-06-15 12:27:51] BitMEX_Sam : yerb: You can only have one 2fa option set up at a time, so you would need to disable Google Authenticator first.
[2016-06-15 12:28:07] Death : So i cant make the same money back?
[2016-06-15 12:28:36] Death : Now that funds are in realised pnl?
[2016-06-15 12:28:38] stf28 : BitMEX_Wally: isn'nt it nice to pay for the others with money that's not involved
[2016-06-15 12:28:41] BitMEX_Sam : Death: Realised PNL during a rebalance period is withheld until the end of the session after which point in time it is released to you
[2016-06-15 12:28:56] BitMEX_Sam : stf28: If you have a loss on a contract it is no longer your money
[2016-06-15 12:29:09] BitMEX_Sam : If you have a profit, it is your money, it just is held for a period due to the risk of systemic loss
[2016-06-15 12:29:15] Death : Is my position still total contracts?
[2016-06-15 12:29:16] stf28 : bring 1, win 2, lose 1, i still have 1 no?
[2016-06-15 12:29:21] BitMEX_Sam : No
[2016-06-15 12:29:37] BitMEX_Sam : You have 1 and 1 pending, you will have 2 available at the next rebalance
[2016-06-15 12:29:59] yerb : BitMEX_Sam: ok, maybe it would be good if you add some text like: "You must disable current 2FA if you want to use other 2FA options."
[2016-06-15 12:29:59] stf28 : yes it's clear
[2016-06-15 12:30:13] BitMEX_Sam : Death: Yes your position does not change at rebalance, only your realised PNL
[2016-06-15 12:30:17] stf28 : my money isn't my money anymore
[2016-06-15 12:30:29] stf28 : as soon as i deposit it here and trade with it
[2016-06-15 12:30:45] stf28 : you assume the 1 i'm losing is the one i bought, not the one i lost
[2016-06-15 12:31:08] BitMEX_Sam : It is always netted during a period
[2016-06-15 12:31:15] BitMEX_Sam : Profit 2, loss 1, you have profited 1
[2016-06-15 12:31:27] BitMEX_Sam : That profit is within a certain time period, and after the rebalance threshold, it is unlocked
[2016-06-15 12:31:40] stf28 : same answer here, nice rhtoric
[2016-06-15 12:31:42] Mr Blue : stf28: dude if your up 1 BTC why you complaining, just wait till 12pm tomorrow lol
[2016-06-15 12:31:52] stf28 : lol
[2016-06-15 12:32:02] stf28 : yeah win and shut up, lose and complain
[2016-06-15 12:32:03] BitMEX_Sam : It's not "rhetoric", it is how the contract works, it is very clear and outlined in the docs, and we are not stealing your money
[2016-06-15 12:32:36] Death : So if i make 5 btc on a trade and close ig profit differs ?
[2016-06-15 12:32:43] stf28 : no of course, you are just keeping me from using it when the position may be favorable for the exchange, during this you margin call traders and wait for next rebalance
[2016-06-15 12:32:57] Death : stf28: correct
[2016-06-15 12:33:03] stf28 : it's clearly stated in the manual
[2016-06-15 12:33:19] BitMEX_Wally : 50% of realised PNL is unlocked every 8 hours
[2016-06-15 12:33:34] BitMEX_Wally : so in 7.5 hours you'll get 1 Bitcoin unlocked
[2016-06-15 12:33:48] stf28 : Death: seen it a lot here
[2016-06-15 12:34:22] stf28 : it reminds me of btc24 a lost exchange of the bitcoin world which refused to show wallet balance on trade history
[2016-06-15 12:34:44] stf28 : the day they showed it guy was escaping leaving the exchange to hackers
[2016-06-15 12:34:47] BitMEX_Wally : We are adding it
[2016-06-15 12:34:51] BitMEX_Wally : with full history
[2016-06-15 12:35:09] stf28 : yes i'm curious to see how you will manage to have right numbers there
[2016-06-15 12:35:24] stf28 : is bitmex audited in any way ?
[2016-06-15 12:35:25] Death : What licenses do u guys have and where are u established?
[2016-06-15 12:35:49] BitMEX_Wally : You can export all trade history and just sum up the execCost and execComm for each rebalance session and you will get the CashRebalance number you see in your wallet history
[2016-06-15 12:35:58] Mr Blue : BitMEX_Wally: lmao I feel for you mate
[2016-06-15 12:36:20] stf28 : BitMEX_Wally: is your exchange audited?
[2016-06-15 12:36:35] stf28 : like serious ones do?
[2016-06-15 12:36:43] BitMEX_Wally : BitMEX accounts were audited by a CPA last month
[2016-06-15 12:36:57] stf28 : can you please link me to conclusions of this audit?
[2016-06-15 12:37:10] stf28 : how is that hard for you great coders to show a simple number in the trade history ?
[2016-06-15 12:37:39] aethlios : stf28: tell a crypto exchange that is audited.
[2016-06-15 12:37:44] stf28 : kraken
[2016-06-15 12:37:49] stf28 : for example
[2016-06-15 12:38:00] aethlios : stf28: from where it is audited?
[2016-06-15 12:38:00] BitMEX_Wally : None are audited but some release proof of funds
[2016-06-15 12:38:02] j8 : stf28: i've traded here for over a year and have audited my own account, it checks out. don't take my word for it, all the data is there. maybe not the easiest to understand, it's there though
[2016-06-15 12:38:14] BitMEX_Wally : but we have multisig so it is hard to do a merkel tree proof
[2016-06-15 12:38:46] BitMEX_Sam : Additionally the trading engine does full auditing of all accounts many times a second
[2016-06-15 12:38:51] stf28 : j8: nice for you, mine doesn't + owners behavior + long experience in this field tells me something's wrong
[2016-06-15 12:39:01] stf28 : BitMEX_Sam: that's a proof of nothing
[2016-06-15 12:39:34] stf28 : i understand it's hard to run high leverage platforms
[2016-06-15 12:39:42] j8 : you are probably misunderstanding something, it's not exactly simple
[2016-06-15 12:39:56] BitMEX_Wally : stf28: if you have a concern please email us and I will show you to the last Satoshi how every calculation in your account is correct
[2016-06-15 12:39:57] arbitrage001 : rules are simple
[2016-06-15 12:40:04] arbitrage001 : if you dont trust the exchange, dont use it
[2016-06-15 12:40:11] lockhedge : stf28: python script to calculate your PNL, funding and commission Income http://pastebin.com/6wz8KNdm
[2016-06-15 12:40:22] lockhedge : some code stolen from Sam
[2016-06-15 12:40:27] stf28 : BitMEX_Wally: nice why don't you take this time to make the wallet balance appear in trade history instead?
[2016-06-15 12:40:32] aethlios : stf28: crypto's are based in trust, it is not the same as fiat world. do you trust your bank? why audited banks go bankrupt? why subprime bonds had AAA???
[2016-06-15 12:40:48] BitMEX_Wally : I told you we're going to add PNL to the trade history
[2016-06-15 12:41:59] stf28 : lockhedge: thanks dude
[2016-06-15 12:42:06] BitMEX_Wally : As you know, withdrawals affect wallet balance, but withdrawals are not trades, so it would be meaningless to add wallet balance to trade history
[2016-06-15 12:42:15] stf28 : BitMEX_Wally: no PNL, wallet BALANCE
[2016-06-15 12:42:34] stf28 : onl is wrong
[2016-06-15 12:42:47] BitMEX_Wally : Your wallet balance is the sum of deposits minus withdrawals plus Realised PNL
[2016-06-15 12:42:50] stf28 : you told me few eeks ago that there are problems with it
[2016-06-15 12:43:00] BitMEX_Wally : What problem?
[2016-06-15 12:43:28] stf28 : i don't know, you told me to rely on my trades and not on these numbers
[2016-06-15 12:43:42] BitMEX_Wally : If your trade history includes wallet balance but the wallet balance can randomly change due to wallet transactions, how are you going know it is correct?
[2016-06-15 12:43:43] stf28 : you didn't say what problem, just that it's not working as it should
[2016-06-15 12:44:11] stf28 : BitMEX_Wally: are you implying that if i add wallet and trade history i won't make it?
[2016-06-15 12:44:41] BitMEX_Wally : ?
[2016-06-15 12:45:00] stf28 : randomly ?
[2016-06-15 12:45:15] stf28 : how is that random ?
[2016-06-15 12:45:44] gustavo7 : short 674 in profit now? how?
[2016-06-15 12:45:55] BitMEX_Wally : all PNL is ultimately decided by trades. The rebalance price and the mark price can vary so I probably told you to ignore your CashRebalance transaction as a measure of the profit of a trade.
[2016-06-15 12:46:08] stf28 : aethlios: thanks, i trust noone in crypto
[2016-06-15 12:46:46] stf28 : google btc24 to know what's next
[2016-06-15 12:46:53] stf28 : i have to leave
[2016-06-15 12:47:22] BitMEX_Wally : Yoy want a wallet balance history on the trade history, but the wallet balance is affected by more than trades, so it would be a meaningless number that would not help you verify the trades
[2016-06-15 12:47:34] 3aum : i keep getting these margin call warnings
[2016-06-15 12:47:44] 3aum : but my position in 1x leverage
[2016-06-15 12:48:00] BitMEX_Wally : stf28: If you cannot understand our system and do not trust us, then please trade elsewhere
[2016-06-15 12:48:00] 3aum : liquidation price on the short is like 140k
[2016-06-15 12:48:15] Mr Blue : 3aum: you sure your not on cross? That takes from margin or something
[2016-06-15 12:48:22] BitMEX_Wally : 3aum: Sam emailed you?
[2016-06-15 12:48:28] aethlios : stf28: that's not bad, that's why we diversify, I use 4 exchanges, so don't have all eggs in one basket, also we trade in crypto because returns are high and compensate for the counterparty risk. Because of no regulation this market has a quick development. regulations delay development and make it expensive.
[2016-06-15 12:48:32] 3aum : so i am on 1x
[2016-06-15 12:48:41] 3aum : not cross, and sam did emai me, but i'm still getting these notifications
[2016-06-15 12:48:56] 3aum : it happens when i try to use up the available balance to 0
[2016-06-15 12:48:56] BitMEX_Wally : 3aum: those emails were sent in error and Sam already fixed it
[2016-06-15 12:49:08] BitMEX_Wally : you even replied to the email so I am sure you know this
[2016-06-15 12:49:16] 3aum : right, but i'm saying it is still happening
[2016-06-15 12:49:25] 3aum : he said it shouldn't happen anymore right?
[2016-06-15 12:49:38] BitMEX_Wally : I will investigate
[2016-06-15 12:49:49] BitMEX_Wally : My apologies
[2016-06-15 12:50:10] 3aum : no problem. i understand its just a glitch, but its a bit scary
[2016-06-15 12:50:11] 3aum : haha
[2016-06-15 12:51:54] BitMEX_Wally : Margin call only refers to open orders being canceled. Liquidation is solely decided by the liquidiation price
[2016-06-15 12:52:09] 3aum : oh ok, i see
[2016-06-15 12:53:06] BitMEX_Wally : Open orders at 1x require to be 100% margined at the current price
[2016-06-15 12:53:48] 3aum : ok, that makes sense now.
[2016-06-15 12:53:50] 3aum : thanks
[2016-06-15 12:53:53] BitMEX_Wally : So as the mark price varies, the open orders might get canceled
[2016-06-15 12:54:04] 3aum : yep. gotcha. thanks wally
[2016-06-15 12:54:07] BitMEX_Wally : we will fix the wording of the enail
[2016-06-15 12:54:22] BitMEX_Wally : Sorry for the confusion
[2016-06-15 12:54:34] aethlios : BitMEX_Wally: Hello Wally, are you planning to keep the long term contracts? If yes think to add a 1 year quanto also. 3m, 6m, 12m, this will create an 1 year yield curve for btc and traders could bet on the slope.
[2016-06-15 12:55:31] arbitrage001 : aethlios: long term contract do not have the liquidity
[2016-06-15 12:55:50] BitMEX_Sam : 3aum: I'm not seeing that one of these has been sent to you for 2 days, can you confirm?
[2016-06-15 12:56:41] BTCDJS : Is sleger known as collin crypto on twitter?
[2016-06-15 12:56:48] 3aum : you are correct sam. the ones that happened just now were not emailed, just notifications on the website.
[2016-06-15 12:56:52] gustavo7 : ah so my realised PNL has gone down and my unrealised up
[2016-06-15 12:57:01] aethlios : arbitrage001: you can make nice strategies with them and swap. you can bet on the slope of the curve.
[2016-06-15 12:57:04] BitMEX_Sam : 3aum: Ah yes. That is normal.
[2016-06-15 12:57:33] arbitrage001 : aethlios: yes.but when market move and there is no way to close 50k contract
[2016-06-15 12:57:38] 3aum : Thanks sam. wally explained it to me. glad you guys are in the channel to answer our dumb questions.
[2016-06-15 12:57:39] arbitrage001 : what do you do?
[2016-06-15 12:57:53] BTCDJS : Rapidtrades: Is sleger known as collin crypto on twitter?
[2016-06-15 12:58:37] aethlios : arbitrage001: you can place your order in a favorable price for the opposite side how opened the trade with you.
[2016-06-15 12:59:05] arbitrage001 : BTCDJS: why you think collin cryto is slegar?
[2016-06-15 12:59:55] arbitrage001 : aethlios: and if there is a large margin call and price keeps moving futher away
[2016-06-15 12:59:57] BTCDJS : arbitrage001: because there is an old tweet where colin crypto said he got REKT and someone replied: "Poor Sleger"
[2016-06-15 13:01:27] arbitrage001 : BTCDJS: have link on that post?
[2016-06-15 13:01:38] BTCDJS : two secs
[2016-06-15 13:02:37] BTCDJS : arbitrage001:https://twitter.com/wurstgelee/status/736685740483084289
[2016-06-15 13:03:07] BitMEX_Sam : I think that was just a joke.
[2016-06-15 13:07:48] BTCDJS : could be
[2016-06-15 13:34:07] wurstgelee : of it was a joke
[2016-06-15 13:34:12] wurstgelee : *ofc
[2016-06-15 13:34:40] BTCDJS : wurstgelee: oh it was you
[2016-06-15 13:34:43] wurstgelee : yep :)
[2016-06-15 13:35:07] BTCDJS : shit joke
[2016-06-15 13:35:13] BTCDJS : :)
[2016-06-15 13:35:51] wurstgelee : more of a running gag. i automatically assume it's leger when a large position gets liquidated
[2016-06-15 13:35:52] wurstgelee : for no reason
[2016-06-15 13:36:02] wurstgelee : *sleger
[2016-06-15 13:36:38] BTCDJS : the man is starting to become a legend
[2016-06-15 13:37:42] BTCDJS : wurstgelee: collin crypto wants to buy REP. Just needed to know if I was dealing with sleger or not
[2016-06-15 13:38:06] stf28 : BitMEX_Wally: thanks for assuming i can't understand your system
[2016-06-15 13:38:11] j8 : sleger doesn't want to buy alts, i can tell you that
[2016-06-15 13:38:13] stf28 : believe me i understand it
[2016-06-15 13:38:58] stf28 : and you should be pleased i try to convince myself i can trade here
[2016-06-15 13:39:37] stf28 : but all the answers to wrong behavior are RTFM, but how can I trade on a contract on which terms evolve freely without notice
[2016-06-15 13:41:06] stf28 : i wouldn't mean "without notice" as you send a lot of notifications recently, like 7am for a contract change 1 hour after
[2016-06-15 13:42:32] j8 : stf28: that is a real issue, we've all been on their case for making sudden changes. they've said they will give notice and settle the contract and launch a new one next time
[2016-06-15 13:43:59] stf28 : and what? did they make something about it? @j8
[2016-06-15 13:45:51] stf28 : all this system is based on the assumption that losses are instant whereas profit is witheld, even with "sophisticated" specifications based upon "fair price" to hide that they're clearly taking advantage upon traders here
[2016-06-15 13:48:27] j8 : that's not what i'm talking about. and no, they're not taking advantage of traders.
[2016-06-15 13:49:54] stf28 : how is that? didn't they banned the big wall guy? didn't they change the contracts specifications without due notice? didn't they empty the insurance fund?
[2016-06-15 13:50:17] stf28 : how can you say that they aren't ? because you make profit?
[2016-06-15 13:50:20] j8 : what big wall guy
[2016-06-15 13:50:46] j8 : they did change the contract with very little notice. that pissed a lot of people off
[2016-06-15 13:51:06] j8 : the insurance fund was spent to clear liquidations. that's how a socialized loss system works
[2016-06-15 13:51:08] stf28 : few days ago hundreds of thousands of contracts were used to f** up the liquidations
[2016-06-15 13:52:15] stf28 : do you assume this is correct behaviour to notify traders this way?
[2016-06-15 13:53:04] stf28 : does this make you trust in owners?
[2016-06-15 13:53:40] j8 : read these if you haven't, https://www.reddit.com/r/BitcoinMarkets/comments/4nrpof/bitmexs_perpetual_xbt_swap_product_struggles/
[2016-06-15 13:53:47] j8 : https://www.reddit.com/r/BitcoinMarkets/comments/4nv2cd/bitmexs_response_to_xbtusd_swap_concerns/
[2016-06-15 13:54:00] zanza : is sleger back yet?
[2016-06-15 13:55:36] stf28 : yes basically is the same answers as in trollbox
[2016-06-15 13:55:53] stf28 : RTFM, DPE, fair price
[2016-06-15 13:56:07] j8 : honestly i've had a lot of respect for the bitmex guys over the last year and a half. i think they messed up pretty bad with the launch of this swap though. it's getting to be a better product, but the launch and changes and poor communication were an issue
[2016-06-15 13:56:36] stf28 : someone just told me they make verification s "multiple times per second"
[2016-06-15 13:57:14] stf28 : isn't it nice? they verify everything multiple times per second yet they can manage a contract which nearly 2 million dollars were lost ?
[2016-06-15 13:57:43] j8 : dunno where the 2 million dollars came from
[2016-06-15 13:58:03] zanza : If Sleger was long 1000 BTC, then he must have made a killing the past month anyways
[2016-06-15 13:58:12] stf28 : your links, arthur's answer : "d. By Sunday morning Asia time, we had $1.8 million worth of short orders that needed to be closed in the market"
[2016-06-15 13:58:16] zanza : it is really worth getting upset over $10 discrepency ?
[2016-06-15 13:58:52] stf28 : how can an exchange owner verify everything "multiple times per second" yet can let this kind of losses happen ?
[2016-06-15 13:58:58] j8 : 1.8 million is the notional value of the position, the system losses were far less
[2016-06-15 13:59:42] stf28 : j8: wouldn't you be worried to see these numbers when you check your products behavior?
[2016-06-15 13:59:52] j8 : of course
[2016-06-15 13:59:54] zanza : it just means people got liquidated and Bitmex took over those positions which caused DPE
[2016-06-15 14:00:29] j8 : for a long time i've argued that the swap had a really high risk of DPE
[2016-06-15 14:01:14] stf28 : zanza: yes, why did they let this happen? it f** everyone, and right after they change the contract f** everyone a second time in less than 48hours
[2016-06-15 14:01:15] j8 : i just think the product was poorly designed, not that they were stealing from people
[2016-06-15 14:01:53] stf28 : j8: to be dumb is not a reason to make traders assume all the losses and exchange all the profit
[2016-06-15 14:02:11] BitMEX_Sam : stf28: The confusion you're having has nothing to do with the swap product, it has everything to do with the DPE system which has been in place for almost a year, and your account has been active for even longer
[2016-06-15 14:02:29] BitMEX_Sam : That system has not fundamentally changed, except to allow more profit unlocking, since inception
[2016-06-15 14:02:48] BitMEX_Sam : As for us "taking all the profit", trades here are strictly peer-to-peer, we don't take any of the profit. We make money from fees alone.
[2016-06-15 14:03:12] zanza : Slegers problem was, they increased the interest rate, which lowered the price. Since he was long 1000 BTC, it cost him money he says
[2016-06-15 14:03:37] zanza : when the price lowered $12, however since the instrument was trading way above spote, we had to expect this woudl happen
[2016-06-15 14:03:53] BitMEX_Sam : In this case, as the system has not changed fundamentally since inception, and is in many ways functionally comparable to every other socialized loss system on every other market that offers one, aside from early unlocking benefits, it is a perfectly reasonable response to say "Read the specification" when a question is about the specification
[2016-06-15 14:03:57] stf28 : BitMEX_Sam: there's no evidence, i just have to trust you on this
[2016-06-15 14:04:04] BitMEX_Sam : There is plenty of evidence, pull your account history
[2016-06-15 14:04:13] BitMEX_Sam : You don't have to trust me at all.
[2016-06-15 14:04:33] stf28 : "rades here are strictly peer-to-peer, we don't take any of the profit."
[2016-06-15 14:04:54] REKT : Liquidated short on `XBTUSD`: Buy 59340 @ 685.25 **EPIC REKT** :unamused: :confounded: :astonished:
[2016-06-15 14:04:58] stf28 : i understand it's hard to run this kind of platform
[2016-06-15 14:05:21] BitMEX_Sam : stf28: You are seeing things that are not there. You can make any allegations you wish but be prepared to back them up with evidence.
[2016-06-15 14:05:41] BitMEX_Sam : Pull your account history if you have any question about the math.
[2016-06-15 14:05:47] REKT : Liquidated short on `XBTUSD`: Buy 1600 @ 685.69
[2016-06-15 14:05:47] REKT : Liquidated short on `XBTUSD`: Buy 17252 @ 685.62
[2016-06-15 14:06:06] BitMEX_Sam : If you have any questions about how DPE works, read the doc. If there are gaps in your understanding and you are unable to understand after a thorough reading, I and the other users will help you understand the system.
[2016-06-15 14:06:11] stf28 : i have no question about maths, i could teach you some if you need better management
[2016-06-15 14:06:21] BitMEX_Sam : If you wish to be a troll, I suggest you simply trade elsewhere.
[2016-06-15 14:06:32] stf28 : i like your answers more and more
[2016-06-15 14:06:57] Yumi : Hey troll not wanted in the trollbox
[2016-06-15 14:07:28] luckynuke : I <3 bulls
[2016-06-15 14:07:46] BTCDJS : we love you too
[2016-06-15 14:07:55] luckynuke : wow
[2016-06-15 14:08:00] luckynuke : love in the air
[2016-06-15 14:08:03] Yumi : The changes on swap were good in the long term
[2016-06-15 14:08:14] zanza : yeah no DPE since changes
[2016-06-15 14:08:42] Yumi : Make it better a product
[2016-06-15 14:08:43] BTCDJS : luckynuke: if you went to a party and woke up the next morning with a condom stuck in your ass, Would you tell anyone?
[2016-06-15 14:09:05] stf28 : BitMEX_Sam: there are no "gaps in my understanding"... how can you play "superior" as you clearly state that "product was poorly designed"
[2016-06-15 14:09:14] luckynuke : lol dont go to any parties
[2016-06-15 14:09:21] BTCDJS : camping?
[2016-06-15 14:10:08] BTCDJS : hypothetically? would you tell anyone or keep it to yourself? @luckynuke
[2016-06-15 14:10:16] stf28 : don't you know what's happening here? it's bitcoin it's not a relatively low volatility product
[2016-06-15 14:11:06] luckynuke : BTCDJS: that´s a hard question, i can´t imagine that. But i think i would ask somebody what happened
[2016-06-15 14:11:11] stf28 : so clearly i need no evidence to tell that this trading instrument needs some tuning
[2016-06-15 14:11:32] BTCDJS : luckynuke: would you tell your friends?
[2016-06-15 14:11:44] BTCDJS : yes or no
[2016-06-15 14:11:53] stf28 : as there is no simple arbitrage possible this will happen again soon
[2016-06-15 14:12:13] luckynuke : BTCDJS: i dont think so. I wouldnt state with it
[2016-06-15 14:12:20] stf28 : even with large insurance fund, like okc did 2 years ago
[2016-06-15 14:12:21] zanza : stf28: even OKC has clawback, also they use cascading market orders I think which can cas big volatility
[2016-06-15 14:12:24] BTCDJS : wanna come to a party?
[2016-06-15 14:12:29] BTCDJS : lol
[2016-06-15 14:12:45] luckynuke : BTCDJS: lol no
[2016-06-15 14:12:56] Yumi : stf28: only bitmex fault was to give too short notice on changes, but if you read Arthur's post it was necessary to act quick to avoid huge dpe
[2016-06-15 14:12:59] luckynuke : BTCDJS: what would you do ?
[2016-06-15 14:13:09] BTCDJS : thats an old joke. I can't believe you never heard it before
[2016-06-15 14:13:32] BTCDJS : well I said no. and got invited to a party
[2016-06-15 14:13:38] stf28 : Yumi: if i read it I understand what he said, but can't you imagine others solutions to this?
[2016-06-15 14:14:00] luckynuke : BTCDJS: stupid joke lol
[2016-06-15 14:14:03] BTCDJS : BRB
[2016-06-15 14:14:13] zanza : what would be other solution stf28?
[2016-06-15 14:14:31] zanza : the XBT was trading at $10+ premium to spot
[2016-06-15 14:14:42] Yumi : Product's design was faulty for market condition we had, it had to be fixed
[2016-06-15 14:14:50] elmorte : What's stf28 tl;dr anyone...DPE?
[2016-06-15 14:15:06] zanza : I don't think faulty is the right word
[2016-06-15 14:15:18] 3aum : i only joined this site a few days ago. when was the perpetual swap started?
[2016-06-15 14:15:27] zanza : 3 weeks ago 3aum
[2016-06-15 14:15:52] stf28 : market condition hasn't changed, bitcoin is known to be high volatility +/- 100$ in one day, people like j8 know this so they stated that dpe fund won't be enough, yet traders agreed the contract so they agreed to be f**
[2016-06-15 14:16:38] Yumi : Anyway after the announcement the premium collapsed but it went back up to +$10 after
[2016-06-15 14:16:46] luckynuke : china is on the road to 700%
[2016-06-15 14:18:17] Yumi : So unless you closed long during initial premium collapse you weren't affected
[2016-06-15 14:19:55] Yumi : And the swap in current form is much more tradable
[2016-06-15 14:20:37] stf28 : zanza: others solution would have been to prevent this instead of acting after.
[2016-06-15 14:21:04] stf28 : but they always act after the losses are made "to not interfere with trading"
[2016-06-15 14:21:15] stf28 : making the trades meaningless anyway
[2016-06-15 14:23:36] zanza : I think their mistake was to copy Bitfnex rates which was bad idea
[2016-06-15 14:23:52] Mr Blue : 3aum: perpetual swap times ten lev is one I like to use, I think years as they once had x100 leverage on it, now only product with x100 is Bitcoin yen, but who doesn't like shorting Japan lol
[2016-06-15 14:23:56] stf28 : BitMEX_Sam: btw not trolling at all, can you make the pnl, realised, unrealised, and wallet balance appear in a complete trade/wallet history ?
[2016-06-15 14:24:28] stf28 : this would be the best "explanation" you can give to me :)