This is a mirror of the original BitMEX trollbox archive that used to be online here.
BitMEX disabled their archive after the DDOS attack so I have decided to make my mirror publicly available.

Well now, a few days after I made this mirror available to the public, the original archive from BitMEX is online again.
But since it is still limited (neutered to the last few hundred messages) I will keep my FULL mirror alive.

You have access to more than 50 million trollbox posts. This is more than 7 gigabyte of data hosted on a $5 server so please be patient or consider a donation

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[2016-01-25 13:05:34] habibi : huge panic here, on rest futures and on spots
[2016-01-25 13:05:42] irbbqu : rofl.
[2016-01-25 14:03:19] Akaiapc40 : eth booom
[2016-01-25 14:03:47] Akaiapc40 : entered long @ 598 but already shorted
[2016-01-25 14:04:01] Akaiapc40 : i don't trust a lot
[2016-01-25 14:05:33] chromaticcr : altcoin could really be mad in P/D's
[2016-01-25 14:05:48] chromaticcr : just look at what okcrap did to Litecoin in June last year
[2016-01-25 14:07:34] jjangg96 : Hmmm
[2016-01-25 15:09:11] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBT7D`: Sell 1247 @ 398.71
[2016-01-25 15:14:44] chromaticcr : poloniex loan BTC now up to 0.33%....
[2016-01-25 15:16:49] sleger : i can lend btc there for .33% per day ?
[2016-01-25 15:17:36] chromaticcr : most of mine are taken at 0.17%
[2016-01-25 15:17:52] chromaticcr : loans could be cancelled anytime by lenders
[2016-01-25 15:19:47] j8 : sleger: don't do it, you risk losing your principal when there's bankruptcies
[2016-01-25 15:20:10] sleger : has it happened before ?
[2016-01-25 15:20:27] j8 : i'm not sure, not that i know of but it hasn't been around that long
[2016-01-25 15:20:49] sleger : I agree, risk reward doesnt seem so great
[2016-01-25 15:21:24] j8 : poloniex takes no liability, and they let people trade random shitty alts with your btc
[2016-01-25 15:22:02] sleger : so does bitfinex, but they can only short btc with your btc
[2016-01-25 15:23:16] j8 : yeah, it's a way more mature market, and bitfinex does guarantee the loans
[2016-01-25 15:23:35] sleger : i dont think they do
[2016-01-25 15:23:42] j8 : no?
[2016-01-25 15:23:50] sleger : They once paid off the losses because it made sense for them business wise
[2016-01-25 15:24:09] sleger : as in the loss was not too big and they could continue running their exchange, so they CHOOSE to pay them
[2016-01-25 15:24:32] sleger : but they did not have to, but they knew if they didnt their exchange would be dead
[2016-01-25 15:25:26] sleger : and after that they implemented some circuit-breakers that are not really documented, so that they can stop cascade margin calls
[2016-01-25 15:25:49] j8 : yeah now that i read a bit they say the risk of lending is "low"
[2016-01-25 15:27:22] sleger : I dont lend my btc on finex
[2016-01-25 15:27:39] sleger : the payoff is too small
[2016-01-25 15:37:56] j8 : yeah i haven't done any lending at all, can generally make a lot more doing some safe trades with it
[2016-01-25 15:39:02] j8 : i heard bitfinex wants to eventually make the loans tradeable though, that could be interesting
[2016-01-25 15:40:15] sleger : they should make them non early repayable, or with penalty at least
[2016-01-25 15:41:21] laisee : can loan for X number of days on BFC e.g. 2 days
[2016-01-25 15:41:52] laisee : ^BFC^BFX
[2016-01-25 15:46:04] sleger : I know, but thats not what Im saying
[2016-01-25 15:46:36] sleger : right now i have almost no incentive to make a loan for 30 days vs 2
[2016-01-25 15:46:58] sleger : because most people who take for30 days if rates drop they cancel and retake, if rates increase they keep it, so i always lose
[2016-01-25 15:49:14] Akaiapc40 : sleger: better make some good trades, you can easily have the same gain imo
[2016-01-25 15:49:20] laisee : just use a bot to submit loan bids for best return
[2016-01-25 15:49:48] sleger : i think you're all missing the point im making, nevermind
[2016-01-25 15:51:50] j8 : i get ya. i think a lot of the people borrowing / lending are not even looking at the rates or details like that
[2016-01-25 15:52:39] j8 : other than seeing they can get 20% annual return and thinking that's great
[2016-01-25 15:54:29] rapidtrades : 20% is a great return for doing nothing...but ur obviously taking on counter-party risk
[2016-01-25 15:57:21] laisee : j8> prolly most people are happy with dbl-digit returns on lending. but the system goes through periodic squeezes so its possible to do much better.
[2016-01-25 16:03:03] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBT24H`: Sell 1000 @ 394.02
[2016-01-25 16:03:03] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBT24H`: Sell 100 @ 394.67
[2016-01-25 16:03:12] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBT24H`: Sell 1000 @ 393.24
[2016-01-25 16:04:02] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBT7D`: Sell 8000 @ 393.16
[2016-01-25 16:17:26] rapidtrades : yeahhhhh! go down baby
[2016-01-25 16:31:02] habibi : so we get insider whale here ?
[2016-01-25 16:32:03] sleger : yes
[2016-01-25 16:32:06] irbbqu : Cmon dont be delusional
[2016-01-25 16:32:23] amahte : that 500k contracts
[2016-01-25 16:32:25] amahte : did the spot
[2016-01-25 16:32:38] irbbqu : yours?
[2016-01-25 16:32:56] chromaticcr : New blog post: https://blog.bitmex.com/crypto-trader-digest-jan-25/
[2016-01-25 16:33:22] chromaticcr : [Ann] Early Profit Unlocking: Now Live [Ann] Ether leverage 5x -> 15x
[2016-01-25 16:35:36] sleger : so what happens if you make profits, withdraw them, and later on there is DPE, they should at least explain a bit more
[2016-01-25 16:36:18] sleger : "BitMEX is the only platform where you can short Ether using only Bitcoin" huh, what about poloniex ?
[2016-01-25 16:36:57] j8 : technically you borrow ether to do that
[2016-01-25 16:37:03] laisee : futures, not margin
[2016-01-25 16:37:34] chromaticcr : you are touching eth when lending, that counts I guess....
[2016-01-25 16:38:43] sleger : j8: yes but you only "use" bitcoin so what im saying is correct
[2016-01-25 16:39:03] sleger : laisee: it doesnt say "futures platform" just "platform"
[2016-01-25 16:39:24] laisee : marketing speak, perhaps?
[2016-01-25 16:39:32] sleger : my first point was the most important though
[2016-01-25 16:39:33] j8 : no, you "use" the ether that you borrow even if you don't "own" it.
[2016-01-25 16:39:44] j8 : but yeah who cares.
[2016-01-25 16:39:44] chromaticcr : you colletraize USING bitcoin, and lend ETH. you USE your ETH to sell to the market.
[2016-01-25 16:39:50] sleger : what happens if DPE kicks in and some people have withdrawn profits and some havent ?
[2016-01-25 16:40:05] j8 : good question, was wondering that too
[2016-01-25 16:40:07] chromaticcr : Call 'em out
[2016-01-25 16:40:16] laisee : bigger DPE?
[2016-01-25 16:40:21] habibi : both groups has the same % ammount of money withdrawalbe and not dpe concerned
[2016-01-25 16:40:58] laisee : would make trading non-linear on next level, knowing when to take out profits ...
[2016-01-25 16:41:07] sleger : that would be SO stupid
[2016-01-25 16:41:25] sleger : surely, withdrawing shouldnt put you at an advantage
[2016-01-25 16:41:34] sleger : but if you can withdraw 100% of profits then dpe cant work
[2016-01-25 16:41:38] laisee : ... surely not
[2016-01-25 16:41:45] j8 : they also say they will periodically unlock profits
[2016-01-25 16:41:56] sleger : well then they should just do hourly settlements
[2016-01-25 16:42:04] j8 : yeah that would make sense
[2016-01-25 16:42:13] laisee : margin engine would have to be quite smart
[2016-01-25 16:42:22] j8 : sounds like that's what it is
[2016-01-25 16:42:28] laisee : ... or fast
[2016-01-25 16:42:51] chromaticcr : try it on the orderbook, only way we'll know without admin here i guess ;)
[2016-01-25 16:43:22] laisee : not sledger, withdrawing his profits may cause DPE to go over 100%
[2016-01-25 16:43:32] laisee : ;-)
[2016-01-25 16:43:53] j8 : at some point you should see your withheld profit clear, at which point it doesn't matter if you withdraw it or not. that's my hypothesis
[2016-01-25 16:45:33] sleger : or that means dpe affects only people who at the time hold a position against the dpe order
[2016-01-25 16:45:57] sleger : which is kind of what auto deleveraging (that I have been advocating) does. somewhat in between dpe and this
[2016-01-25 16:46:12] sleger : hence you can only withdraw "realized" profits which means you're out of the position
[2016-01-25 16:46:27] sleger : I'm guessing that's what it is, if so, much better than previous system
[2016-01-25 16:47:39] j8 : yeah thats true, just realized, well i guess we need to wait and hear it from the bitmex guys
[2016-01-25 16:48:38] rapidtrades : it's been a fun few hours huh
[2016-01-25 16:48:46] rapidtrades : from discunt to premium
[2016-01-25 16:48:56] rapidtrades : discunt hehe
[2016-01-25 16:50:06] chromaticcr : realized my arb. such easy money toady, alongside wtih some unexpected extra
[2016-01-25 16:51:09] j8 : yeah closed a nice arb already too. pretty good for so early in the day
[2016-01-25 16:52:07] chromaticcr : we need more premium creating whales over here
[2016-01-25 17:03:54] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETH7D`: Sell 250 @ 0.01
[2016-01-25 17:09:29] sleger : hmm rounding issue there @REKT
[2016-01-25 17:19:23] justinlooking : "sleger: what happens if DPE kicks in and some people have withdrawn profits and some havent ?" that's what witheld profit is for
[2016-01-25 17:23:49] tscha : justinlooking: "BitMEX will periodically unlock a portion of realised profits on contracts that do not have a profit adjustment." They still keep profits as withheld if the profits are affected by profit adjustment. If they are not, you can withdraw.
[2016-01-25 17:24:36] tscha : The question is just what "periodically" means exactly, but they will clear it up soon I think.
[2016-01-25 17:25:28] sleger : that's not the most important question
[2016-01-25 17:30:03] Akaiapc40 : Lol someone just hacked dice site Rollin.io, 35+ BTC stolen...
[2016-01-25 17:59:16] MarketQ : Lol eth has 666 selling at 0.00666
[2016-01-25 18:06:56] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBT24H`: Sell 2000 @ 391.89
[2016-01-25 18:10:26] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBT7D`: Sell 70 @ 389.26
[2016-01-25 18:10:26] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBT7D`: Sell 4000 @ 389.14
[2016-01-25 19:37:58] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETH7D`: Sell 145 @ 0.01
[2016-01-25 19:39:38] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETH7D`: Sell 150 @ 0.01
[2016-01-25 19:50:19] REKT : Liquidated short on `ETH7D`: Buy 22 @ 0.01
[2016-01-25 20:56:41] REKT : Liquidated short on `XBT24H`: Buy 6284 @ 394.15
[2016-01-25 21:55:42] REKT : Liquidated short on `ETH7D`: Buy 100 @ 0.01
[2016-01-25 22:23:03] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBT24H`: Sell 550 @ 392.89
[2016-01-25 22:38:37] REKT : Liquidated short on `XBT7D`: Buy 5002 @ 395.54
[2016-01-25 22:59:56] rapidtrades : WHY IS NOONE CHATTING
[2016-01-25 23:01:50] sleger : because you're shouting
[2016-01-25 23:02:18] jesperf : LOUD NOISES
[2016-01-25 23:07:10] rapidtrades : scalping was created by the devil
[2016-01-25 23:43:19] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBT24H`: Sell 3606 @ 391.56
[2016-01-25 23:48:19] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBT24H`: Sell 334 @ 390.82
[2016-01-25 23:49:39] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBT24H`: Sell 3999 @ 390.24
[2016-01-26 00:03:01] lockhedge : *BitPay has seen transaction volume increase by 50% just in the last two months and by 110% in 12 months ... we saw the greatest transaction growth in Latin America. By the end of 2015, total transactions in the region were up 1747% over transactions in 2014. The majority of our total transactions came from merchants in Europe, which led with 54% of our transaction activity in 2015.* https://blog.bitpay.com/understanding-bitcoins-growth-in-2015/
[2016-01-26 00:20:04] rapidtrades : sell bitcoin
[2016-01-26 00:34:18] lockhedge : rapidtrades: the last time i went short Bitcoin by paying a pizza via BitPay was in August, at about $270
[2016-01-26 00:34:58] rapidtrades : u bought $270 worth of pizza huh...
[2016-01-26 00:35:00] rapidtrades : HU
[2016-01-26 00:35:03] rapidtrades : HUH
[2016-01-26 00:35:47] sleger : back to your old self it seems
[2016-01-26 00:35:49] lockhedge : guess it was only about 0.1 XBT :)
[2016-01-26 00:37:36] rapidtrades : should've bought more...at least u'd have something tangible not some imaginary virtual token
[2016-01-26 00:40:21] sleger : yes cause everyone knows 6 months old pizza is very useful
[2016-01-26 00:41:42] rapidtrades : he could've fed the homeless
[2016-01-26 00:41:45] lockhedge : i should have kept the pizza and sold it when XBT was at $460. but i was too greedy and ate it.
[2016-01-26 00:43:13] rapidtrades : greed will kill u
[2016-01-26 00:44:49] rapidtrades : or make u stronger, whichever comes first
[2016-01-26 00:45:04] rapidtrades : prolly kill u though
[2016-01-26 00:47:40] REKT : Liquidated short on `XBT24H`: Buy 799 @ 392.27
[2016-01-26 00:48:15] lockhedge : typical beginner mistake in risk management. will never do such a stupid thing as buying a pizza with Bitcoin. may compensate my losses by paying with Rubel at a Russian restaurant soon.
[2016-01-26 00:48:53] rapidtrades : and at this point sledger will step in with ''What's a Rubel?''
[2016-01-26 00:50:06] sleger : it's a Ruble stupid
[2016-01-26 00:50:08] sleger : ;)
[2016-01-26 00:51:00] BitMEX_Wally : Hi guys, please let me know your questions regarding our profit unlock feature and I'll try to answer them
[2016-01-26 00:51:20] rapidtrades : well what is it...first time I'm hearing bout it
[2016-01-26 00:52:23] BitMEX_Wally : You should read our newsletter
[2016-01-26 00:52:26] habibi : can we know exacly how much and when we will get our profit withdrawble? and how u prevent making dpe over 100% for example in last day of contracts before settlement
[2016-01-26 00:52:44] BitMEX_Wally : rapidtrades: https://blog.bitmex.com/crypto-trader-digest-jan-25/
[2016-01-26 00:54:09] BitMEX_Wally : habibi: We will start by unlocking 50% of realised profits at the end of each trading session, if the indicative profit adjustment is 0%
[2016-01-26 00:54:42] habibi : trading session lasts 8 hours right?
[2016-01-26 00:54:46] BitMEX_Wally : Yes
[2016-01-26 00:55:10] BitMEX_Wally : The amount we can unlock is subject to availability, i.e. the ratio between realised profits and realised losses
[2016-01-26 00:55:35] sleger : BitMEX_Wally: So if I make money and withdraw and there's more than 50% DPE but some other guy doesnt withdraw, then he ends up paying for me although everything I did was withdrawing money ?
[2016-01-26 00:55:53] BitMEX_Wally : It makes no difference whether you withdraw or not
[2016-01-26 00:56:20] sleger : but then you dont have enough gains left to cover losses
[2016-01-26 00:56:34] BitMEX_Wally : The tax rate is adjusted to take into account the amount unlocked
[2016-01-26 00:56:54] sleger : but assume there is no dpe
[2016-01-26 00:57:00] sleger : I make money withdraw it
[2016-01-26 00:57:14] sleger : then there is dpe and over 50%
[2016-01-26 00:57:19] rapidtrades : can we get rid of DPE, its stupid and noone but losers like it
[2016-01-26 00:57:20] sleger : it's possible gains left dont cover losses
[2016-01-26 00:57:41] BitMEX_Wally : sleger: It is not possible
[2016-01-26 00:57:44] sleger : what you actually should be doing is a settlement 8 hour
[2016-01-26 00:57:48] rapidtrades : let's try automatic releveraging or whatever
[2016-01-26 00:58:06] rapidtrades : de*
[2016-01-26 00:58:20] BitMEX_Wally : Firstly, whether you withdraw the profit or not does not matter. It has been unlocked so you are free to do whatever you want with it.
[2016-01-26 00:58:27] sleger : BitMEX_Wally: yes it is, unless you havent explained everything yet
[2016-01-26 00:58:44] BitMEX_Wally : Secondly the DPE adjustment applies to your full profit, whether locked or unlocked.
[2016-01-26 00:58:55] sleger : ok so DPE applies only to open positions at time of DPE ?
[2016-01-26 00:58:58] rapidtrades : BitMEX_Wally: ok but if I don't withdraw, then u can clawback the amount I have left in my account
[2016-01-26 00:59:16] rapidtrades : so it makes no sense not to withdraw
[2016-01-26 00:59:17] BitMEX_Wally : In your example, if we unlocked at 50% and DPE goes to 60% then you would only get adjusted by 50%
[2016-01-26 00:59:35] rapidtrades : ah ok...
[2016-01-26 00:59:41] rapidtrades : that's more reasonable
[2016-01-26 01:00:34] sleger : BitMEX_Wally: is that better than just doing a 8 hour settlement ? It seems more complicated
[2016-01-26 01:00:51] rapidtrades : so to make this clear...say I win 1 BTC...u unlock 50%, then I can only get DPE-ed on 0.5 BTC, regardless or whether I withdraw or not?
[2016-01-26 01:01:04] BitMEX_Wally : rapidtrades: Correct
[2016-01-26 01:01:21] rapidtrades : so if DPE is 50%, I will get clawed by 0.25 BTC?
[2016-01-26 01:01:28] BitMEX_Wally : No
[2016-01-26 01:01:34] BitMEX_Wally : You will get clawed by 0.5
[2016-01-26 01:01:37] BitMEX_Wally : 50% of your profit
[2016-01-26 01:01:41] rapidtrades : ah right
[2016-01-26 01:01:46] BitMEX_Wally : So it is fair to everyone
[2016-01-26 01:01:47] rapidtrades : sry my bad
[2016-01-26 01:02:26] rapidtrades : ok this is better then the current system....how often will this be applied? two per session or
[2016-01-26 01:02:48] BitMEX_Wally : At the moment at least once per session, but we will see how it goes and maybe do it in real time
[2016-01-26 01:02:51] habibi : every 8 hour rapid
[2016-01-26 01:03:09] sleger : so dpe cant go above 50% in his previous example?
[2016-01-26 01:03:39] BitMEX_Wally : sleger: His personal DPE cannot go above 50%
[2016-01-26 01:03:50] rapidtrades : it can but only 0.5 BTC of ur profit will clawback...if I understand correctly
[2016-01-26 01:03:58] BitMEX_Wally : Yes
[2016-01-26 01:04:26] sleger : ok so DPE depends on if you had a profit during session when DPE happened?
[2016-01-26 01:04:27] lockhedge : BitMEX_Wally: is this session based profit unlocking an addition or a replacement for weekly rebalancing?
[2016-01-26 01:04:57] BitMEX_Wally : lockhedge: At the moment it is in addition
[2016-01-26 01:05:48] BitMEX_Wally : sleger: DPE applies to everyone equally, but if you had some profit before there was DPE, then your personal DPE rate may be capped at 100-unlockRate
[2016-01-26 01:06:06] rapidtrades : BitMEX_Wally: so still bit confused...in my current example u have unlocked 0.5 BTC....does this mean that DPE will apply proportionately to only that 0.5 BTC or to the entire 1 BTC? For example what would happen if DPE reached 25%, 75% and 100%
[2016-01-26 01:06:10] sleger : yes so it doesnt apply "equally"
[2016-01-26 01:06:27] BitMEX_Wally : Equally up to a cap
[2016-01-26 01:06:41] lockhedge : so in the last session of every week there will be 100% unlocked, in all the other sessions 50%, right?
[2016-01-26 01:06:42] BitMEX_Wally : But once we reach that cap, it's basically unrealised profit vs unrealised loss
[2016-01-26 01:07:14] rapidtrades : ok so at 25% DPE I will get clawback for 0.25 BTC...at 50% for 0.5 BTC and at 100% again 0.5 BTC
[2016-01-26 01:07:15] BitMEX_Wally : lockhedge: Effectively yes
[2016-01-26 01:07:22] BitMEX_Wally : rapidtrades: Correct
[2016-01-26 01:07:22] sleger : that's some weird compromise, to be honest, frequent settlement (1, 2, 4 hour whatever) or auto-deleveraging make more sense, but I still prefer it to current system @BitMEX_Wally
[2016-01-26 01:07:58] rapidtrades : yeah it's definitely an improvement...not an ideal solution obv
[2016-01-26 01:08:26] BitMEX_Wally : We're interested to see how this evolves and see what you think
[2016-01-26 01:08:52] sleger : that's a "bastard" compromise, bastard being the exact pure word here, not an insult
[2016-01-26 01:08:54] rapidtrades : yeah let's see if there are any unintended consequences
[2016-01-26 01:09:16] rapidtrades : BitMEX_Wally: this is for all contracts? when does it kick in
[2016-01-26 01:09:17] sleger : I prefer pure, but it's still better than the current 24h dpe system
[2016-01-26 01:09:21] habibi : so dpe 100% wouldnt be 100% in old system?
[2016-01-26 01:09:37] sleger : habibi: maybe make a question that makes more sense
[2016-01-26 01:10:02] BitMEX_Wally : rapidtrades: We are trailing this on XBT24H and XBT7D for now
[2016-01-26 01:10:16] rapidtrades : is it live now?
[2016-01-26 01:10:36] BitMEX_Wally : Yes, I am about to manually unlock 50% of XBT24H realisedPnl
[2016-01-26 01:10:44] rapidtrades : nice....do it
[2016-01-26 01:11:02] sleger : so I can buy .. a pizza
[2016-01-26 01:11:54] rapidtrades : BitMEX_Wally: another q, does this apply to open positions too or just closed
[2016-01-26 01:12:11] BitMEX_Wally : rapidtrades: It applies to realisedPnl so does not matter if you have an open position or not
[2016-01-26 01:12:23] BitMEX_Wally : You have to have closed part of a position to have realisedPnl
[2016-01-26 01:13:49] rapidtrades : is realized PnL sum or realized and unrealized profits/losses?
[2016-01-26 01:14:00] sleger : BitMEX_Wally: Can you bring something else up with management, I have one issue with daily, which is that during settlement, I have large position that come and take time to go. What 0kcoin has is good as in I can start rolling this week to next week. Maybe you could start listing next day 12 hours earlier than you do now ?
[2016-01-26 01:14:07] sleger : rapidtrades: yes
[2016-01-26 01:14:44] rapidtrades : yeah I second that suggestion
[2016-01-26 01:14:50] sleger : BitMEX_Wally: My second suggestions would be to move daily close 2 hours later, it would cover more timezones with living people when people are not sleeping and can actively manage settlement
[2016-01-26 01:15:07] BitMEX_Wally : sleger: Yes, we are looking at launching XBT48H which will become XBT24H each day
[2016-01-26 01:15:13] lockhedge : BitMEX_Wally: any specific market situations and trading strategies where this session based DPE version means higher (or lower) risk than the old one?
[2016-01-26 01:15:17] sleger : BitMEX_Wally: ok that one would be perfect
[2016-01-26 01:15:38] rapidtrades : BitMEX_Wally: nice....:) more contracts never hurts
[2016-01-26 01:16:12] BitMEX_Wally : rapidtrades: Realised PNL is the sum of realised PNL, which does not include unrealised PNL
[2016-01-26 01:16:30] rapidtrades : ok so it doesn't include open trades then
[2016-01-26 01:17:12] micmix : BitMEX_Wally: wouldn't it be fair to apply DPE accumpulated during a session to session's profits only?
[2016-01-26 01:17:37] sleger : micmix: that's what I said, it would mean doing settlement every 8 hours
[2016-01-26 01:17:39] rapidtrades : yeah sleger suggested that...seems a better solution
[2016-01-26 01:18:01] BitMEX_Wally : We may move to a system like that
[2016-01-26 01:18:03] sleger : seems so much easier for everyone
[2016-01-26 01:18:05] micmix : BitMEX_Wally: basically do a rebalance every session
[2016-01-26 01:18:09] BitMEX_Wally : It would effectively be the same as unlocking 100% of PNL
[2016-01-26 01:18:25] sleger : no
[2016-01-26 01:18:41] sleger : because it would also mean closing potential liq orders open
[2016-01-26 01:19:01] BitMEX_Wally : Rebalancing does not close liquidation orders
[2016-01-26 01:19:06] BitMEX_Wally : It just moves them up to the rebalance price
[2016-01-26 01:19:12] rapidtrades : I guess the problem with that system would be, we could have a scenario where we still have a resting margin call on the orderbook after we close one 8-hour window
[2016-01-26 01:19:26] micmix : yes, you will have to close all liq orders to make it work per session
[2016-01-26 01:19:28] sleger : BitMEX_Wally: ok didnt know that
[2016-01-26 01:19:37] rapidtrades : so it would effectively DPE all new traders in that new 8h window
[2016-01-26 01:19:48] micmix : it can't work if liq orders are left open
[2016-01-26 01:20:08] rapidtrades : yeah...they'll have to market close and they don't want that :)
[2016-01-26 01:20:10] sleger : micmix: yes you can move the price of liq orders as he said
[2016-01-26 01:20:12] BitMEX_Wally : lockhedge: This new unlock feature does not make DPE any more likely, but it means that if DPE gets above 50% then it might rise slightly quicker
[2016-01-26 01:20:34] BitMEX_Wally : rapidtrades: We do not close liquidation orders out at a realised loss
[2016-01-26 01:20:48] rapidtrades : :)
[2016-01-26 01:22:13] micmix : If I understand it correctly, leaving liq orders open can lead to DPE in the next session if they are still not closed during the next session
[2016-01-26 01:22:51] BitMEX_Wally : If there are open liquidation orders then that means there is DPE
[2016-01-26 01:23:08] lockhedge : BitMEX_Wally: will you now move up liq orders to the rebalance price as well every session?
[2016-01-26 01:23:32] BitMEX_Wally : lockhedge: We can't do that unless we rebalance at the end of every session
[2016-01-26 01:23:34] rapidtrades : BitMEX_Wally: if there is DPE, we won't get 50% profit?
[2016-01-26 01:24:07] BitMEX_Wally : If there is DPE then we will not unlock any further realised profit
[2016-01-26 01:24:20] BitMEX_Wally : (because that realised profit might be the unrealised system loss)
[2016-01-26 01:24:59] habibi : so in case dpe goes >50 in 2nd sesion of dailys then people who didnt realised profit at first loose more than these who did?
[2016-01-26 01:25:07] lockhedge : BitMEX_Wally: are you mainly doing this 50% unlocking to increase trading volume?
[2016-01-26 01:25:07] sleger : no
[2016-01-26 01:25:13] micmix : BitMEX_Wally: that's what I mean, to prevent DPE during one session from affecting the next session, you will have to close all liq orders at the end of the session. (this is in case you switch to DPE per session affecting current session only)
[2016-01-26 01:25:26] rapidtrades : BitMEX_Wally: so this new change will not apply if there is DPE?
[2016-01-26 01:25:51] BitMEX_Wally : lockhedge: We are doing it do make the platform fairer and more attractive
[2016-01-26 01:27:33] BitMEX_Wally : habibi: If DPE goes above 50% then realised profits will be taxed less than unrealised profits.
[2016-01-26 01:27:52] BitMEX_Wally : But DPE is all about an unrealised loss
[2016-01-26 01:28:04] BitMEX_Wally : So there is a corresponding unrealised profit
[2016-01-26 01:30:06] micmix : IMHO it would be easier and more fair to implement auto de-leveraging. Plus it's good marketing: we don't have clawbacks
[2016-01-26 01:31:03] BitMEX_Wally : Auto de-leveraging is not very transparent
[2016-01-26 01:31:08] lockhedge : BitMEX_Wally: apart from increasing trading volume (which imo makes the platform more attractive), how will this system contribute to a fairer and more attractive trading venue?
[2016-01-26 01:31:40] BitMEX_Wally : lockhedge: Being able to withdraw 50% of realisedPnl is better than 0%
[2016-01-26 01:32:04] habibi : withdraw policy stays the same ?
[2016-01-26 01:32:20] BitMEX_Wally : Yes
[2016-01-26 01:36:48] micmix : BitMEX_Wally: how is this DPE change reflected on the API level? any changes to position/account tables?
[2016-01-26 01:37:26] BitMEX_Wally : No changes, but look at `posAllowance` on the `position` table
[2016-01-26 01:37:41] BitMEX_Wally : `posAllowance` is the amount that has been unlocked for that position
[2016-01-26 01:38:01] BitMEX_Wally : so `0 <= posAllowance <= realisedProfit`
[2016-01-26 01:38:32] BitMEX_Wally : You will notice `taxableMargin` decrease
[2016-01-26 01:39:49] micmix : BitMEX_Wally: great, thanks for the explanation
[2016-01-26 01:42:31] micmix : By `realisedProfit` you mean `realisedPnl` field? I don't see `realisedProfit`
[2016-01-26 01:51:46] lockhedge : BitMEX_Wally: did you internally discuss circumstances (high volatility) when you would temporally suspend session-based profit unlocking?
[2016-01-26 01:52:42] BitMEX_Wally : We will only unlock realised PNL when DPE is 0%
[2016-01-26 01:52:56] BitMEX_Wally : Once goes above 0% then we do not unlock any further realised PNL
[2016-01-26 01:53:15] BitMEX_Wally : micmix: Yes, `realisedPnl` is the field, but the inequality only holds when it is positive
[2016-01-26 01:53:36] lockhedge : *temporarily* not temporally
[2016-01-26 01:53:48] micmix : BitMEX_Wally: got it, thanks
[2016-01-26 02:01:14] lockhedge : BitMEX_Wally: ok, thanks for your explanations and all your efforts to make this platform more fair and attractive. still thinking about quoting at slightly wider spreads b/c my mm bot can expect slightly higher (more profit) volume and slightly higher risk when DPE gets above 50% ;)
[2016-01-26 02:09:01] micmix : lockhedge: I don't think you need to change anything, DPE above 50% on XBT24H is highly unlikely
[2016-01-26 02:17:01] rapidtrades : famous last words!
[2016-01-26 02:31:43] lockhedge : micmix: my monkey robot's *emergency committee for market structure changes* just changed to a max. quote size of 249 instead of 250, it's a very conservative market maker bot, it doesn't like uncertainty ;)
[2016-01-26 02:39:50] micmix : lockhedge: :-) I'll just stop quoting altogher if we get DPE >50%, it's not worth the risk IMHO. Your profit is greatly reduced but potential loss is not.
[2016-01-26 02:41:16] habibi : eu nights are so boring lately
[2016-01-26 02:43:12] lockhedge : micmix: that's exactly the problem, and then i will say i'll stop quoting at 30% and tscha and sleger will exit the market at 25%...
[2016-01-26 02:53:51] stevelim : Hi Bitmex, I withdrew the bitcoin 11hours ago, but it is still 0 confirmation (with fee 0.0001) Do you know what to do?
[2016-01-26 02:55:22] stevelim : f91202fa6f282913f72a8692d93280ece0b8ef9695c646587c149be38b3a940b
[2016-01-26 02:57:25] BitMEX_Sam : Hey stevelim - sorry, there's nothing that can be done once it hits the mempool
[2016-01-26 02:57:35] BitMEX_Sam : I assume it will be confirmed shortly, but in the future, keep the default fee amount
[2016-01-26 02:59:01] habibi : basically there is, replace by fee tx Sam :p
[2016-01-26 03:06:03] stevelim : it says "this transaction has non standard input."
[2016-01-26 03:06:15] stevelim : do you know what this about?
[2016-01-26 03:06:34] rapidtrades : Ruble back above 80....it was close down there for a sec :)
[2016-01-26 03:07:06] rapidtrades : got to 76 yesterday
[2016-01-26 03:11:23] BitMEX_Wally : stevelim: It's sent from a P2SH multisig address
[2016-01-26 04:00:35] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBT24H`: Sell 790 @ 389.74
[2016-01-26 04:00:35] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBT24H`: Sell 831 @ 390.11
[2016-01-26 04:00:35] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBT24H`: Sell 8000 @ 390.10
[2016-01-26 04:00:55] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBT24H`: Sell 780 @ 389.29
[2016-01-26 04:43:00] hashman : OCO, trailing stop loss orders still coming soon ?
[2016-01-26 04:50:00] BitMEX_Wally : hashman: Yes, very soon
[2016-01-26 04:50:37] hashman : cool
[2016-01-26 04:51:03] hashman : ETH7D has some much better liquidity now
[2016-01-26 06:09:02] GerryHYH : Hi guys, how much is tick here?
[2016-01-26 06:09:09] GerryHYH : 0.01 or 0.1?
[2016-01-26 06:09:14] GerryHYH : and how much is it worth? :D
[2016-01-26 06:09:22] micmix : GerryHYH: 0.01
[2016-01-26 06:09:28] GerryHYH : Hi again! :)
[2016-01-26 06:09:38] micmix : GerryHYH: hi Gerry
[2016-01-26 06:09:39] GerryHYH : awesome, and how much is 0.01 worth?
[2016-01-26 06:10:24] micmix : isn't worth much :-)
[2016-01-26 06:10:33] GerryHYH : like for US S&P 500 Mini, it moves 0.25, and worth like 12.5$ i think, or $6.25, not sure :D how much here?
[2016-01-26 06:10:42] GerryHYH : hmmm, it's not listed under fees :/
[2016-01-26 06:11:34] micmix : Each XBT contract is worth 1000 Satoshis per $1 price, currently 4.418 mXBT
[2016-01-26 06:12:29] BitMEX_Arthur : https://www.bitmex.com/app/contract/XBT24H
[2016-01-26 06:12:41] BitMEX_Arthur : Each contract has a description page which spells out the contract details
[2016-01-26 06:12:48] GerryHYH : Ah! the Legendary Arthur, thank you sir :3
[2016-01-26 06:13:09] BitMEX_Arthur : All this is available via the api as well
[2016-01-26 06:13:12] GerryHYH : (saw your 1st youtube webinar btw, very helpful! thank you)
[2016-01-26 06:13:21] GerryHYH : havn't had time to check out your other ones yet
[2016-01-26 06:13:30] BitMEX_Arthur : They are there waiting for you
[2016-01-26 06:13:36] micmix : Arthur can explain everything much better :-)
[2016-01-26 06:13:37] BitMEX_Arthur : the last lesson in this series will air on thursday
[2016-01-26 06:18:21] GerryHYH : Hmm
[2016-01-26 06:18:48] GerryHYH : I think I'm stupid... I'm trying to work out how much is 1 tick worth (0.01 USD)
[2016-01-26 06:19:18] GerryHYH : What I did was (0.0000001 multiply by 393.88)
[2016-01-26 06:20:00] GerryHYH : so each tick worth 0.000039 dollars? :O
[2016-01-26 06:20:04] GerryHYH : I'm doing something wron!
[2016-01-26 06:23:54] BitMEX_Wally : GerryHYH: That sounds correct. 1 contract is very small
[2016-01-26 06:25:51] GerryHYH : I see Wally, thank you. So to make decent money, it's all about volume :D
[2016-01-26 06:26:10] BitMEX_Wally : 255 contracts has a gross value of 1 Bitcoin
[2016-01-26 06:27:03] BitMEX_Wally : We offer 100x leverage so you only need 0.01 Bitcoin in your account to go long 1 Bitcoin worth
[2016-01-26 06:27:27] GerryHYH : I see
[2016-01-26 06:31:48] GerryHYH : This is fascinating stuff, but a little hard for retail trader to understand initially :)
[2016-01-26 06:35:23] BitMEX_Wally : We're working on an interface where you can deal with Bitcoin amounts rather than contract quantities, this should help simplify it
[2016-01-26 06:35:54] BitMEX_Wally : Then you could go long 1 Bitcoin and the payout per tick is 0.01 USD in Bitcoin
[2016-01-26 06:46:09] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETH7D`: Sell 125 @ 0.00665
[2016-01-26 07:42:42] GerryHYH : Guys, regarding the fee
[2016-01-26 07:43:25] GerryHYH : the taker fee is 0.075%
[2016-01-26 07:43:45] BitMEX_Arthur : GerryHYH: Yes
[2016-01-26 07:44:09] GerryHYH : is that the 'contract value'? so it would be 0.0075% times $393 market value?
[2016-01-26 07:44:26] BitMEX_Arthur : It is 7.5bps of the Bitcoin value of your trade
[2016-01-26 07:44:46] BitMEX_Arthur : so for `XBT24H` = 1000 Satoshis * Price * Contracts
[2016-01-26 07:45:08] BitMEX_Arthur : \* Price \* Contracts
[2016-01-26 07:45:42] GerryHYH : hmmm, so in nominal value is it $0.30 ish?
[2016-01-26 07:46:07] BitMEX_Arthur : 1 contract of xbt24h is worth 0.0039 Bitcoin
[2016-01-26 07:46:11] BitMEX_Arthur : at the current price
[2016-01-26 07:46:32] GerryHYH : Ok, thank you Arthur, that part I understand ^^
[2016-01-26 07:46:46] GerryHYH : but exchange fee (taker fee) is...?
[2016-01-26 07:47:56] BitMEX_Arthur : Taker you pay us, maker we pay you
[2016-01-26 07:48:38] GerryHYH : That part I do understand sir :D but the fee I have to pay to trade
[2016-01-26 07:48:43] GerryHYH : as taker
[2016-01-26 07:49:11] GerryHYH : is 0.075%, which will cost me 29 cents at current price?
[2016-01-26 07:49:58] GerryHYH : sorry for these questions, I want to trade here soon, but just want to work out how much I need to deposit..
[2016-01-26 07:51:29] BitMEX_Arthur : assume you traded a position worth 100 XBT you would pay 0.075% * 100 Bitcoin
[2016-01-26 07:55:39] GerryHYH : so I was correct?
[2016-01-26 07:57:21] micmix : GerryHYH: it's much easier if you do all calculations in bitcoin
[2016-01-26 07:59:13] BitMEX_Arthur : micmix: Agreed don't think in Dollars
[2016-01-26 07:59:20] BitMEX_Arthur : Unless you are talking about your risk exposure
[2016-01-26 08:09:34] GerryHYH : OK Arthur, and thank you for your time
[2016-01-26 08:11:02] BitMEX_Arthur : If you ever have a question and one of us isn't online please submit a support ticket and we will get back to you
[2016-01-26 08:12:11] rapidtrades : PBOC seems to be defending the 6.62 line on offshore
[2016-01-26 08:12:31] rapidtrades : sharp reversals near there past 3 days
[2016-01-26 08:52:17] elmorte : Hi Arthur and everyone
[2016-01-26 08:52:44] elmorte : I have a negative Realised PNL on a trade where I was a maker...was wondering how that happens?
[2016-01-26 08:53:15] elmorte : And second question, what are the trades in the trade book that are in black font without the arrow?
[2016-01-26 08:56:43] BitMEX_Arthur : elmorte: You only receive a commission rebate you still can lose money if the trade goes against you, maybe I don't understand your question I suggest you send us a support ticket and we can discuss your account details away from the public chat
[2016-01-26 08:56:45] rapidtrades : elmorte: black is when price doesn't change from previous tick
[2016-01-26 08:57:25] elmorte : Thanks rapidtrades
[2016-01-26 08:58:58] rapidtrades : the current rebate for maker is around 10 cents, so if BTC moves 10 cents against u, u'll be down on that trade
[2016-01-26 08:59:16] elmorte : Arthur, position is still open. As soon as the order executed, my Realised PNL went negative (0.1111XBT). As a maker, shouldn't it go positive
[2016-01-26 08:59:45] elmorte : Realised PNL during an open trade should not be affected by the price movements, no?
[2016-01-26 08:59:47] rapidtrades : that is calculated on the fair price, which is usually between bid/ask...so that's whwy
[2016-01-26 09:00:25] elmorte : Ok...now I'm even more confused
[2016-01-26 09:00:52] elmorte : I thought maker rebate is 0.25%
[2016-01-26 09:01:00] rapidtrades : the PnL is calculated on the mid price roughly....so you'll be down almost everytime as soon as u enter
[2016-01-26 09:01:10] rapidtrades : elmorte: that's on XBU not daily
[2016-01-26 09:01:29] rapidtrades : 0.025% on daily...and only 0.1% on XBU
[2016-01-26 09:01:30] elmorte : Ok. What's the formula for daily?
[2016-01-26 09:01:58] rapidtrades : https://www.bitmex.com/app/fees
[2016-01-26 09:02:01] elmorte : Let me check the fees again :)
[2016-01-26 09:02:07] rapidtrades : look at he values with minus :)
[2016-01-26 09:02:19] elmorte : Maker Fee -0.025%
[2016-01-26 09:02:34] elmorte : Yah, sorry, off by a decimal, but still my realised PNL should not be negative
[2016-01-26 09:02:39] elmorte : on daily
[2016-01-26 09:02:52] rapidtrades : yeah it should, is it still open
[2016-01-26 09:03:29] rapidtrades : like I said current rebate is 10 cents...so with a spread of 50 cents, u'll be down everytime at the start
[2016-01-26 09:04:22] j8 : if it was your first trade of the contract and you were maker, then yes you would have a small positive realised pnl
[2016-01-26 09:04:41] elmorte : Thank you. Could you just break it down for me a bit. So the 0.025% was calculated on what exactly?
[2016-01-26 09:05:00] rapidtrades : elmorte: https://www.bitmex.com/app/tradeHistory
[2016-01-26 09:05:07] rapidtrades : u can find ur rebate there
[2016-01-26 09:05:13] j8 : on the notional value of the trade
[2016-01-26 09:05:14] elmorte : I thought so too j8. What changes on the second trade (if both are say long)
[2016-01-26 09:05:40] j8 : its just that the pnl accumulates until settlement. maybe you had pnl from previous trades today?
[2016-01-26 09:06:01] elmorte : No, I just opened a position, had 2 long trades
[2016-01-26 09:06:02] j8 : if you add to your position you don't realise pnl (except fees, could be + or -)
[2016-01-26 09:06:22] elmorte : I'm not talking about unrealised PNL yet
[2016-01-26 09:06:30] j8 : me neither
[2016-01-26 09:06:55] j8 : check your trade history at the link rapidtrades gave. make sure you actually paid maker fees
[2016-01-26 09:07:00] j8 : * got paid
[2016-01-26 09:07:26] elmorte : Yup, looking at it right now
[2016-01-26 09:07:58] j8 : the Comm. column will be negative... negative fee is positive pnl
[2016-01-26 09:09:10] elmorte : Really? Ok
[2016-01-26 09:09:45] elmorte : Every commission in the last 36hrs is negative...
[2016-01-26 09:10:49] elmorte : None add up to .1111 XBT though
[2016-01-26 09:10:56] elmorte : Gonna download the CSV and do some math
[2016-01-26 09:20:32] elmorte : Arthur, I opened a support ticket with a screenshot
[2016-01-26 09:23:36] elmorte : And just to share a sob story....I was short on XBT at 404-405.50....21000 contract, some 40hrs ago. Forgot all about the margin and it got liquidated at 408.93. _sniff_
[2016-01-26 09:24:13] rapidtrades : elmorte: k, how big are u trading right now
[2016-01-26 09:24:25] elmorte : I think the settlement price ended up being ~400
[2016-01-26 09:24:38] elmorte : Well, I have 1BTC in my wallet
[2016-01-26 09:24:43] elmorte : Considering adding another one
[2016-01-26 09:24:50] elmorte : My contracts are 2000-4000
[2016-01-26 09:24:58] elmorte : My current position is 7000 long
[2016-01-26 09:25:04] elmorte : Why?
[2016-01-26 09:25:27] rapidtrades : I can't tell u what to do, but if I were u, I would keep my size down to 1 until I learn the platform
[2016-01-26 09:25:46] elmorte : Yeah, it was an expensive lesson. Appreciate it
[2016-01-26 09:26:31] elmorte : Trying to find some options platforms as well...but BitMEX is just so easy to use (almost too easy on the user experience - thanks Arthur!)
[2016-01-26 09:27:08] elmorte : How many active traders are there, if you don't mind me asking?
[2016-01-26 09:27:21] rapidtrades : 7
[2016-01-26 09:27:36] elmorte : For real? In a zero sum game?
[2016-01-26 09:27:56] rapidtrades : j/k around 15-20 ppl frequent this chat
[2016-01-26 09:28:07] rapidtrades : rest come and go...
[2016-01-26 09:28:13] rapidtrades : poof...
[2016-01-26 09:28:18] elmorte : Hehe, nice one
[2016-01-26 09:30:06] elmorte : Yeah, I was so disappointed with myself and the forced liquidation...almost said screw it
[2016-01-26 09:30:27] elmorte : It happened so fast...it was seconds between "you need to top up" and "liquidated"
[2016-01-26 09:30:40] elmorte : But I should have paid more attention....stupid Netflix
[2016-01-26 09:32:09] elmorte : rapidtrades, do you use bots?
[2016-01-26 09:32:30] rapidtrades : no
[2016-01-26 09:33:21] elmorte : Cool...was interested in the algorithms and what base price they use
[2016-01-26 09:34:03] elmorte : I was almost certain it was bitfinex since the price here followed the movements there closely....but then not anymore in the last 48 hrs
[2016-01-26 10:03:15] REKT : Liquidated short on `ETH7D`: Buy 50 @ 0.00689
[2016-01-26 10:30:27] BitMEX_Wally : elmorte: I have replied to your support request
[2016-01-26 10:30:43] BitMEX_Wally : You had realisedPNL from opening, then closing a position...
[2016-01-26 10:30:51] elmorte : Cheers Wally, I'll have a look
[2016-01-26 10:32:20] elmorte : Got it, thanks for the explanation!
[2016-01-26 10:41:36] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBT24H`: Sell 250 @ 394.85
[2016-01-26 12:13:38] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBT7D`: Sell 100 @ 394.80
[2016-01-26 12:16:38] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBT7D`: Sell 50 @ 393.68
[2016-01-26 14:56:27] Akaiapc40 : Only bots in eth7D?
[2016-01-26 14:57:01] rapidtrades : LAAAAAAGGGGG
[2016-01-26 14:57:42] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBT24H`: Sell 100 @ 392.82
[2016-01-26 14:58:02] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBT7D`: Sell 10 @ 391.81
[2016-01-26 14:58:02] REKT : Liquidated long on `XBT24H`: Sell 831 @ 391.44
[2016-01-26 15:02:20] habibi : wtf with 24h?
[2016-01-26 15:02:33] habibi : Order could not be submitted: Executing at 388.24 would cause immediate liquidation. Try disabling isolated margin.
[2016-01-26 15:02:54] habibi : ah isolated somehow get enabled;p
[2016-01-26 15:09:46] rapidtrades : what bullshit man...I traded 2 times today and first time I caught the spike up the wrong way and now the spike down
[2016-01-26 15:10:24] rapidtrades : this shit of a coin barely moved outside of the time I had a resting bid/offer to get picked
[2016-01-26 15:10:32] rapidtrades : srlsy shit fucking coin cunt
[2016-01-26 15:28:43] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETH7D`: Sell 10 @ 0.00676
[2016-01-26 15:30:23] REKT : Liquidated long on `ETH7D`: Sell 33 @ 0.00668
[2016-01-26 15:31:32] rapidtrades : I think today we break down again
[2016-01-26 15:44:38] elmorte : Anything in the news?
[2016-01-26 15:45:21] rapidtrades : no idea, check reddit
[2016-01-26 15:45:28] elmorte : I am, brb
[2016-01-26 15:46:46] elmorte : Nothing really new, just a bunch of hype and squabbles
[2016-01-26 15:57:41] elmorte : rapidtrades, you trade anywhere else?
[2016-01-26 16:04:19] rapidtrades : yea
[2016-01-26 16:17:07] elmorte : you're a man of few words
[2016-01-26 16:19:10] DareDevil : how come 24H is $2.5 lower then market? Lag?
[2016-01-26 16:20:44] elmorte : Or people are predicting the market will crash...
[2016-01-26 16:21:02] elmorte : 7D is $5 below
[2016-01-26 16:26:42] j8 : just bearish, it's an arb opportunity really.
[2016-01-26 16:46:35] elmorte : j8, how?
[2016-01-26 16:47:48] j8 : buy `XBT24H`, sell spot, buy back spot at settlement
[2016-01-26 16:48:01] j8 : or in a couple hours if there's a positive premium, who knows
[2016-01-26 16:48:22] elmorte : Can you buy spot here?
[2016-01-26 16:48:33] j8 : no, have to use another exchange for that
[2016-01-26 16:48:43] elmorte : Ok
[2016-01-26 16:48:52] elmorte : Nice one, thanks
[2016-01-26 16:49:45] Akaiapc40 : what's spot?
[2016-01-26 16:50:07] elmorte : The actual bitcoin
[2016-01-26 16:50:19] elmorte : Not the derivative like what we're trading here
[2016-01-26 16:50:27] j8 : i.e. the BTC/USD markets, bitfinex, bitstamp etc
[2016-01-26 16:51:25] elmorte : test
[2016-01-26 16:51:40] elmorte : Hmmm...two of my earlier msgs didn't get thru
[2016-01-26 16:52:15] elmorte : Actually, they're in the archive but disappeared from the trollbox
[2016-01-26 16:53:01] j8 : try refreshing, they look the same to me
[2016-01-26 16:53:04] Akaiapc40 : elmorte: thanks ;)
[2016-01-26 16:54:19] elmorte : No worries, guys around here have been very helpful to me too, just paying it forward :)
[2016-01-26 16:54:28] Akaiapc40 : eheeehhe
[2016-01-26 16:54:48] Akaiapc40 : yes i like community eher...some nice guys very helpful
[2016-01-26 16:54:54] Akaiapc40 : here*
[2016-01-26 16:55:49] elmorte : True. I only opened the trollbox today coz I was on mobile and saw there was real conversation going on
[2016-01-26 16:56:57] elmorte : How's the market been treating you?
[2016-01-26 16:58:21] Akaiapc40 : long on ETH from 660
[2016-01-26 16:58:52] elmorte : Nice. I haven't really had time to research ETH